Genderbending ASOIAF characters

[norwaywolf123]

How would different ASOIAF characters be affected by changing gender? Characters that are male in canon would be female, while characters that are female would male. Let's take the discussion case for case.

I think a funny genderbend might be if Stannis was born female. I wonder how a female Stannis would act? How would she-Stannis be similar to he-Stannis, and what would the differences be? I also imagine that female Stannis would marry Rhaegar, since Stannis would be Rhaegar's closest related female kin.

[Lord Varys]

9 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

I think a funnt genderbend might be if Stannis was born female. I wonder how a female Stannis would act? How would she-Stannis be similar to he-Stannis, and what would the differences be? I also imagine that female Stannis would marry Rhaegar, since Stannis would be Rhaegar's closest related female kin.

A female Stannis might indeed have married Rhaegar, but she would never share all that many character traits with male Stannis. Stannis became the way he was because he couldn't even remotely compete with Robert. A female Stannis wouldn't have to compete with Robert, nor would she be encouraged or allowed to take part in ruling stuff, etc.

Westeros is so much a patriarchal society that men are women are forced to live so different lives that being female completely cuts you off from crucial parts of life.

[Lord of Raventree Hall]

I think any character would be completely different as a d

[Lord Lannister]

Cersei often thinks she'd be Tywin if she were a man. Personally I think she'd be more like Walder Frey.

[Ylath's Snout]

1 hour ago, Lord Lannister said:

Cersei often thinks she'd be Tywin if she were a man. Personally I think she'd be more like Walder Frey.

Cersei's life would be so wildly different that it is pretty hard to guess what male-Cersei would be like.

All her resentment over not getting respect because of her sex would be gone.

Almost everyone outside of Dorne would have completely different life if born to opposite gender because of Westerosi culture and gender-roles. Makes it pretty hard to talk about it TBH.

[Sigella]

7 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

Cersei often thinks she'd be Tywin if she were a man. Personally I think she'd be more like Walder Frey.

Nah. If Cersei had been a knight or lord she'd be much different IMO. As a man she'd never get away with stuff because she's a girl - which is the biggest irony of her life. She'd be Joffrey but not king so she wouldn't be able to do all the stuff he does either.

[Lucius Lovejoy]

Hmmm, this is an odd idea if you take it to it's literal extreme.  I think characters like Asha, Bran, Arya, Tommen, Myrcella, Daenerys, and Penny stay mostly the same.  Margaery and Loras essentially switch places and become each other.  Tyrion would have a far crueler fate as a female dwarf, and though I can't imagine he'll run off marrying anyone and besmirching the Lannister name, he'd probably end up ill treated by a husband marrying him only for the dowry.  Robb becomes Sansa, Sansa becomes Robb.  Catelyn is an even bigger fool in King's Landing than Ned, and even more self righteous.  Edmure would probably be fine as a lady.

[300 H&H Magnum]

There are plenty of role reversals going on even if not technically gender bending.  Strong females who carry brass balls and do not allow themselves to be limited by expectations and traditions.  Which is good.  Daenerys, Brienne, Cersei, Arya, and Asha are the most prominent examples.  

[Floki of the Ironborn]

Robert as a woman would be another Amerei Frey.

[shameeka]

A female Jon would probably be married off to a lesser house or become a septa. I think Bran would become as fairytale-loving and looking-for-my-true-prince as Sansa. Brienne would be knighted and probably become a Kingsguard.

I wonder if female Littlefinger would be able to become a master player as well.

[JaneSnow]

1 hour ago, shameeka said:

A female Jon would probably be married off to a lesser house or become a septa. I think Bran would become as fairytale-loving and looking-for-my-true-prince as Sansa. Brienne would be knighted and probably become a Kingsguard.

I wonder if female Littlefinger would be able to become a master player as well.

I think a female Littlefinger would be a lot like Cersei

[Yukle]

If Cersei was a man Tywin would be much more different. It wouldn't have mattered to him as much the Jaime was taken to the Kingsguard. He'd have been able to go on ignoring Tyrion as he had always wanted.

[JaneSnow]

16 hours ago, Yukle said:

If Cersei was a man Tywin would be much more different. It wouldn't have mattered to him as much the Jaime was taken to the Kingsguard. He'd have been able to go on ignoring Tyrion as he had always wanted.

I think perhaps Cersei would be a better, nicer person if she were a man. A lot of her attitude seems to stem from her resentment towards not being a male. In the absence of her severe penis-envy she'd be a lot more amiable I think. 

[Therae]

34 minutes ago, JaneSnow said:

I think perhaps Cersei would be a better, nicer person if she were a man. A lot of her attitude seems to stem from her resentment towards not being a male. In the absence of her severe penis-envy she'd be a lot more amiable I think. 

I wonder. If Cersei had been a man, she would have had to train at arms and leadership and would have been expected to excel at it--and she is not as smart as she thinks she is. We haven't seen any evidence at all of the kind of monomaniacal work ethic it takes to make a warrior at Jaime's level or a politician at Tywin's. We've seen her pull rank whenever things get sticky, but we've never really seen her actually work really hard at anything. I suspect she would be just as resentful as a man--probably of girl-Jaime for not having to do much but be beautiful and please and still get betrothed to a king. She certainly would not have been Tywin, or even Jaime. I think @Sigella is on the money--she'd be more like Joffrey than anyone else--and without an indulgent parent, Joffrey would just be a seething sulk monster.

[The Marquis de Leech]

Cersei Lannister > Cerwin Lannister. Cerwin may not have been so great a swordsman as Jaime is, and with Jaime as an acceptable spare, it's entirely possible that Aerys never appoints Tywin's son to the Kingsguard. Moreover, with Cerwin unable to marry Rhaegar, we see some of the key Aerys/Tywin battles getting defused. Tywin may back Aerys in Robert's Rebellion, potentially leading to the awkward situation of the rebels crushed in the South, and running free in the North. So Cerwin potentially ends up marrying someone from the Reach or Dorne, and probably being a good deal happier.

Jaime Lannister > Jeyne Lannister. Poor Jeyne ends up a second bargaining chip for Tywin's machinations. With Cersei going to Robert, perhaps Jeyne gets married to Stannis? Dear oh dear.

Robert Baratheon > Roberta Baratheon. The quintessential tomboy, and potentially a better-looking Brienne figure, depending on her upbringing. Likely destined for Rhaegar, or, failing that, Brandon Stark. It is unclear if Rhaegar abandons Roberta for Lyanna.

Stannis Baratheon > Stanna Baratheon. Likely destined for Rhaegar. Dour and dutiful, she makes a seriously unpopular partner to the Crown Prince. Rhaegar running off with Lyanna g arners more sniggers. 

Renly Baratheon > Renna Baratheon. Perhaps enough to make Loras go straight? Likely results in Stannis becoming King.

Eddard Stark > Ellaria Stark. Ruler of Winterfell during the Rebellion, and likely married to Edmure Tully.

Jon Snow > Joanna Snow. No Silent Sisters (wrong religion!). As a bastard girl, she has no great worth to anyone, and while hilarious to imagine her falling for Theon Greyjoy, that's probably out due to the Westermarck Effect. She stays in Winterfell, and bad things happen.

Robb Stark > Roberta Stark. Guess who gets Joffrey? Meanwhile, there is pressure to legitimise Jon Snow, with Bran crippled and unable to have children. This causes real headaches for Catelyn and Ned.

Sansa Stark > Sandor Stark. Arya gets Joffrey. Sandor helps Robb in his wars, and gets offed at the Red Wedding.

Arya Stark > Arthur Stark. Arthur helps Robb in his wars, and gets offed at the Red Wedding. Arthur has less time fighting social conventions, however.

Bran Stark > Brienne Stark. A gender flip makes little difference to either plot or character, except that Rickon potentially becomes more important.

Asha Greyjoy > Qarl Greyjoy. Shipped off to Winterfell as hostage. Qarl and Theon have each other, and as such keep their Ironborn identity much more.

Theon Greyjoy > Thea Greyjoy. Balon's lost his male heirs, so Thea remains at Pyke. Likely cared for by Big Sister, and potentially under threat from Euron.

Daenerys Targaryen > Aerys Targaryen. Aerys and his brother are subject to a much more concerted effort to hunt them down. No Dothraki plot, and no hatched dragons.

Viserys Targaryen > Visenya Targaryen. Potentially ends up with Rhaegar, though 17 years might push it. Failing that, Visenya becomes very Cersei-like in exile.

Joffrey Baratheon > Joffra Baratheon. Likely inherits some truly toxic ideas from her mother, but not on the throne, so fewer problems. Likely married to Robb Stark.

[JaneSnow]

3 hours ago, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said:

Cersei Lannister > Cerwin Lannister. Cerwin may not have been so great a swordsman as Jaime is, and with Jaime as an acceptable spare, it's entirely possible that Aerys never appoints Tywin's son to the Kingsguard. Moreover, with Cerwin unable to marry Rhaegar, we see some of the key Aerys/Tywin battles getting defused. Tywin may back Aerys in Robert's Rebellion, potentially leading to the awkward situation of the rebels crushed in the South, and running free in the North. So Cerwin potentially ends up marrying someone from the Reach or Dorne, and probably being a good deal happier.

Jaime Lannister > Jeyne Lannister. Poor Jeyne ends up a second bargaining chip for Tywin's machinations. With Cersei going to Robert, perhaps Jeyne gets married to Stannis? Dear oh dear.

Robert Baratheon > Roberta Baratheon. The quintessential tomboy, and potentially a better-looking Brienne figure, depending on her upbringing. Likely destined for Rhaegar, or, failing that, Brandon Stark. It is unclear if Rhaegar abandons Roberta for Lyanna.

Stannis Baratheon > Stanna Baratheon. Likely destined for Rhaegar. Dour and dutiful, she makes a seriously unpopular partner to the Crown Prince. Rhaegar running off with Lyanna g arners more sniggers. 

Renly Baratheon > Renna Baratheon. Perhaps enough to make Loras go straight? Likely results in Stannis becoming King.

Eddard Stark > Ellaria Stark. Ruler of Winterfell during the Rebellion, and likely married to Edmure Tully.

Jon Snow > Joanna Snow. No Silent Sisters (wrong religion!). As a bastard girl, she has no great worth to anyone, and while hilarious to imagine her falling for Theon Greyjoy, that's probably out due to the Westermarck Effect. She stays in Winterfell, and bad things happen.

Robb Stark > Roberta Stark. Guess who gets Joffrey? Meanwhile, there is pressure to legitimise Jon Snow, with Bran crippled and unable to have children. This causes real headaches for Catelyn and Ned.

Sansa Stark > Sandor Stark. Arya gets Joffrey. Sandor helps Robb in his wars, and gets offed at the Red Wedding.

Arya Stark > Arthur Stark. Arthur helps Robb in his wars, and gets offed at the Red Wedding. Arthur has less time fighting social conventions, however.

Bran Stark > Brienne Stark. A gender flip makes little difference to either plot or character, except that Rickon potentially becomes more important.

Asha Greyjoy > Qarl Greyjoy. Shipped off to Winterfell as hostage. Qarl and Theon have each other, and as such keep their Ironborn identity much more.

Theon Greyjoy > Thea Greyjoy. Balon's lost his male heirs, so Thea remains at Pyke. Likely cared for by Big Sister, and potentially under threat from Euron.

Daenerys Targaryen > Aerys Targaryen. Aerys and his brother are subject to a much more concerted effort to hunt them down. No Dothraki plot, and no hatched dragons.

Viserys Targaryen > Visenya Targaryen. Potentially ends up with Rhaegar, though 17 years might push it. Failing that, Visenya becomes very Cersei-like in exile.

Joffrey Baratheon > Joffra Baratheon. Likely inherits some truly toxic ideas from her mother, but not on the throne, so fewer problems. Likely married to Robb Stark.

What about Brienne?

[The Marquis de Leech]

2 hours ago, JaneSnow said:

What about Brienne?

No-one ever hears of Bran of Tarth, who faces nothing like the obstacles Brienne does, but who is still committed to the ideals of knighthood.

[Ylath's Snout]

7 hours ago, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said:

Jaime Lannister > Jeyne Lannister. Poor Jeyne ends up a second bargaining chip for Tywin's machinations. With Cersei going to Robert, perhaps Jeyne gets married to Stannis? Dear oh dear.

I don't know about that match, would it not be prudent to try for a wider set of allies for both the Baratheons and Lannisters? Sure guaranteeing that the king and spare-prince marry Lannister girls is nice it might be seen by every other House as overreaching.

Also with no Jamie to stop him wouldn't Aerys rebrand Kings Landing as Kings Huge-Crater, likely taking out Tywin in the process? Would Kevan or whoever became the head of House Lannister really prioritise royal matches for Tywin's children over their own?

How would Tywin take it if Tyrion was his only male heir right from the get go? Maybe he would marry off Cersei and Jeyne long before the rebellion in the hopes of a male grandchild he could foster as the next heir of the Rock or would he feel forced to remarry?

7 hours ago, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said:

Sansa Stark > Sandor Stark. Arya gets Joffrey. Sandor helps Robb in his wars, and gets offed at the Red Wedding.

Arya Stark > Arthur Stark. Arthur helps Robb in his wars, and gets offed at the Red Wedding. Arthur has less time fighting social conventions, however.

I think one or both of them might have gone south with Ned, the plan was to bring Brann to KL before his fall. Hard to say how that would impact events.

[The Wolves]

Where are we getting the idea that a female Jon Snow would be sent to the Silent Sisters or fall for Theon Greyjoy? First off, a female Jon Snow worships the Old Gods not the Seven. Second, I’m pretty sure that a female Jon Snow would dislike and distrust Theon Greyjoy as much as Jon Snow would. also I think female Jon Snow would go to Essos and make her destiny there. Female Jon Snow would not stay in the North and marry some lesser lord. 

[norwaywolf123]

My list of genderbends and their potential consequences

Jaime Lannister -> Jaina Lannister

I think Jaina would somehow be much more likely to marry Rhaegar than Cersei, i am not sure why? Also if Jaime was born female, and Cersei was still female, then Tywin would try for a son as soon as possible.

 

Cersei Lannister -> Cerion Lannister

Would likely be like Joffrey, allthough a stricter upbringing might round the edges a bit.

 

Tyrion Lannister -> Tyrany Lannister

Would have a even worse life than Tyrion did. Probably alot more spitefull too. Tyrany's confidence would likely be even lower than Tyrion's.

 

Robert Baratheon -> Roberta Baratheon

Roberta would likely be set to marry Rhaegar due to her being Rhaegars closest related female relative. ROberta would also likely be able to give Rhaegar the children that he desires. Robert after all was very fertile as a man.

 

Stannis Baratheon -> Stanna Baratheon

Stanna would be a just and dutifull queen. Almost proper to fault, which in itself may lead to problems.

 

Renly Baratheon -> Renna Baratheon

Would most likely be married off to a Stormlord, but if her brother is king then she might get a more exotic match. Stannis would also be in charge of Storm's End, and if twincest combined with Stannis discovering it happens, then Stannis likely to win the WotFK.

Rhaegar Targaryen -> Rhaena Targaryen

She would have even more suitors than Rhaegar did. Many would hope to become the king by marrying her. Tywin may become even more aggressive in his power grab in King's landing. Maybe Tywin could attempt to wed Rhaena himself after Joanna dies?