Lumosaca Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 Or is it not going to happen at all? Stannis being defeated and Jon starting a whole second campaign to take Winterfell back seems like a terrible choice. It creates an extremely prectitable plot and an unnecessary waste of time. I mean, we do not need to see the Wildlings or the Knights of the Vale destroying House Bolton when Stannis and Wyman Manderly are already there, with thousands of men around them, trying to do the exact same thing. I believe that "King Roose" will meet his destiny pretty soon, during the first half of the sixth book. After the lost of Winterfell, Ramsay will betray his father and take his place as King in the North and Lord of the Dreadfort. Then, when the Wall be destroyed by the Horn of Joramun, Jon and Tormund will lead the Wildlings to Winterfell through the kingsroad, where their caravan will be attacked by Ramsay during a surprise attack. However, there is an ice dragon inside the Wall and Roose is actually a vampire, so everything gets more confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 Dammit! Here I thought we were going to be talking about Bloodraven and Bittersteel! /s Remember the words of your house: Mods are Coming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lumosaca Posted May 31, 2018 Author Share Posted May 31, 2018 40 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: Dammit! Here I thought we were going to be talking about Bloodraven and Bittersteel! /s Remember the words of your house: Mods are Coming They probably are, but my question and my predictions have nothing to do with elements outside the books. The "Battle of Ice" and the "Battle of the Bastards" have been discussed since A Dance with Dragons was released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kandrax Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 There will be no Battle of Bastards in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevets Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 I doubt that there will be a Battle of the Bastards. Jon is going to have to recover from his wounds/get resurrected and then sort things out at the Wall before he can even think of taking on the Boltons. Meanwhile, I expect that Stannis and the Great Northern Conspiracy (in whatever form that takes0 will take on the Boltons. Given the number of enemies surrounding them, I don't expect them to last too long, although I can see one or both holing up in the Dreadfort. I think Jon's main role will be leading the fight against the Others when they finally decide to make their attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoodedCrow Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 I would like to comment on your topic when it gets sorted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmberEmpress Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 Doesn't Sam have the Horn of Joraman? How could he destroy the Wall from Oldtown? I think there will be a Battle of the Bastards. Stannis' army is weak and at a great disadvantage and we don't know when Manderly&Friends will strike. I think they're waiting for Rickon to rally behind him so they may defend Winterfell. As the Pink Letter claims to have Mance captured a Wilding force, adapted to harsh winter conditions and led by Jon may come to Stannis' aid to save Mance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 1 hour ago, AmberEmpress said: Doesn't Sam have the Horn of Joraman? How could he destroy the Wall from Oldtown? I think there will be a Battle of the Bastards. Stannis' army is weak and at a great disadvantage and we don't know when Manderly&Friends will strike. I think they're waiting for Rickon to rally behind him so they may defend Winterfell. As the Pink Letter claims to have Mance captured a Wilding force, adapted to harsh winter conditions and led by Jon may come to Stannis' aid to save Mance. Jon tried the horn already, before giving it to Sam. To the OP, Stannis will defeat the Boltons, no "battle of the bastards" in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexis-something-Rose Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 Never mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 The wall is the ice dragon, it shatters and becomes an animated dragon of ice with an iron skeleton, powered by Shireen's and Stannis' shadow souls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmberEmpress Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 11 hours ago, kissdbyfire said: Jon tried the horn already, before giving it to Sam. To the OP, Stannis will defeat the Boltons, no "battle of the bastards" in the books. The horn was cracked and broken, that's why it didn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 13 hours ago, AmberEmpress said: Doesn't Sam have the Horn of Joraman? How could he destroy the Wall from Oldtown? I think there will be a Battle of the Bastards. Stannis' army is weak and at a great disadvantage and we don't know when Manderly&Friends will strike. I think they're waiting for Rickon to rally behind him so they may defend Winterfell. As the Pink Letter claims to have Mance captured a Wilding force, adapted to harsh winter conditions and led by Jon may come to Stannis' aid to save Mance. Stannis outnumbers the force attacking him by more than 2:1, before you even account for the Manderly force changing sides. He also holds the defensive ground and knows the attack is coming. Last, the attacking force is led by a man known as Ser Stupid. I find it really inaccurate to say that Stannis is at a disadvantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmberEmpress Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 Just now, aryagonnakill#2 said: Stannis outnumbers the force attacking him by more than 2:1, before you even account for the Manderly force changing sides. He also holds the defensive ground and knows the attack is coming. Last, the attacking force is led by a man known as Ser Stupid. I find it really inaccurate to say that Stannis is at a disadvantage. He may have a large army but they're all starving. By weak, I mean physically weak from weeks of malnutrition. Plus their horses are dead so they have no sizeable cavalry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 3 minutes ago, AmberEmpress said: He may have a large army but they're all starving. By weak, I mean physically weak from weeks of malnutrition. Plus their horses are dead so they have no sizeable cavalry. The point about them not eating is fair, but I think it is really the only point in their favor, and is not true of the bulk of Stannis' army anyway. The southerns are having a hard time, but the northern clans are not, and neither are the Umber men. The garoons used by these men may not be able to go head to head with destriers in a heavy cavalry charge, but such a thing is not practical in waist deep snow anyway, not to mention on a lake filled with holes. Then consider that Manderlys force is entirely heavy horse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 20 minutes ago, AmberEmpress said: The horn was cracked and broken, that's why it didn't work. And Sam's gonna fix it w/ super glue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azarial Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 56 minutes ago, aryagonnakill#2 said: The point about them not eating is fair, but I think it is really the only point in their favor, and is not true of the bulk of Stannis' army anyway. The southerns are having a hard time, but the northern clans are not, and neither are the Umber men. The garoons used by these men may not be able to go head to head with destriers in a heavy cavalry charge, but such a thing is not practical in waist deep snow anyway, not to mention on a lake filled with holes. Then consider that Manderlys force is entirely heavy horse. And lets not forget the mountain clans love of hiding in the trees, while dressed as shrubs for ambushes, and have horses that are suited to the terrain and are trained to wear bears paws negating the waist deep snow issue for the northmen, unlike the Freys. I fully believe the pink letter was a fake (likely a code used by Mance and Stannis, who is shooting down all birds, but in the blizzard one got missed) and the Freys are riding into a trap. Now, we all know Stannis the Mannis can't hold the north, but he can win this battle, and take all the nice fresh supplies that the Freys are bringing him. It's Mance who Jon will have to fight, this was foreshadowed when the sparred at the wall and Mance said, "I didn't even break and sweat." And Jon replied, "NEXT TIME you will. We need that pay off." So if someone is going to kill Stannis, my money is on Mance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmberEmpress Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 35 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: And Sam's gonna fix it w/ super glue? I'm sure Marwyn would be interested in it at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moiraine Sedai Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 18 hours ago, Lumosaca said: Or is it not going to happen at all? Stannis being defeated and Jon starting a whole second campaign to take Winterfell back seems like a terrible choice. It creates an extremely prectitable plot and an unnecessary waste of time. I mean, we do not need to see the Wildlings or the Knights of the Vale destroying House Bolton when Stannis and Wyman Manderly are already there, with thousands of men around them, trying to do the exact same thing. I believe that "King Roose" will meet his destiny pretty soon, during the first half of the sixth book. After the lost of Winterfell, Ramsay will betray his father and take his place as King in the North and Lord of the Dreadfort. Then, when the Wall be destroyed by the Horn of Joramun, Jon and Tormund will lead the Wildlings to Winterfell through the kingsroad, where their caravan will be attacked by Ramsay during a surprise attack. However, there is an ice dragon inside the Wall and Roose is actually a vampire, so everything gets more confusing. Maybe the battle of the bastards is a show only creation. The show was playing to popularity and wrote their own fan fiction. Jon has more fans than Stannis so they killed Stannis to make room in the plot for Snowhead. The book battle makes more sense if it's between Roose and Stannis. Two men of proven skills at battle planning. A battle between the two bastards is not going to be a battle fought with cunning and intelligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphis Baratheon Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I can remember a time when people believed Stannis would at least make it to the war with the Others. Now no one believes the King of the painted table will even make it past the first battle with the Boltons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 21 hours ago, Lumosaca said: Or is it not going to happen at all? Stannis being defeated and Jon starting a whole second campaign to take Winterfell back seems like a terrible choice. It creates an extremely prectitable plot and an unnecessary waste of time. I mean, we do not need to see the Wildlings or the Knights of the Vale destroying House Bolton when Stannis and Wyman Manderly are already there, with thousands of men around them, trying to do the exact same thing. I believe that "King Roose" will meet his destiny pretty soon, during the first half of the sixth book. After the lost of Winterfell, Ramsay will betray his father and take his place as King in the North and Lord of the Dreadfort. Then, when the Wall be destroyed by the Horn of Joramun, Jon and Tormund will lead the Wildlings to Winterfell through the kingsroad, where their caravan will be attacked by Ramsay during a surprise attack. Have you read Theon I, Winds? In that chapter, Spoiler the George sets up the means for Stannis to continue fighting with support from the Iron Bank, and he suggests that Stannis will effect a ruse in which the world will assume he is dead, as revealed in the so-called pink letter. (Keep in mind that Theon I, Winds occurs before Jon XIII, Dance.) The George also foreshadows in other places Northmen marching south to save their families from additional mouths to feed in winter. Why set that up if Stannis is going to die? Of course, the author might intend for Jon to take Stannis's place in that part of the developing plot, but I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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