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DCEU: Suicidal Insanity

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12 hours ago, Fellaining Da Bruyne said:


The article about what Johns is going to be doing isn't very clear, but if as it seems he's still going to be heavily involved with the DCEU even without the executive position, there's no chance whatsoever that the Cyborg film is cancelled... he looooooooooves that dude.

 

 

OP mentioned Bay as being wanted in relation to a Lobo film, but Lobo is a crap character so that's not really a big deal even if it happened.

Well...there is an off chance Lobo could be a kind of Deadpool like entry for DC. Except, you know, Michael Bay isn't the guy who strikes me as being able to pull off humor. Ever. 

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Comics-wise, Harley Quinn is roughly the DC answer to Deadpool.


Of course, they've handed developing her movie version to David Ayer who has shown no more sign of being suitable for that than Michael Bay would have done.

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On 6/16/2018 at 4:44 PM, Fellaining Da Bruyne said:

Comics-wise, Harley Quinn is roughly the DC answer to Deadpool.


Of course, they've handed developing her movie version to David Ayer who has shown no more sign of being suitable for that than Michael Bay would have done.

Ayer wasn't the problem. The madness involved in the editing of that film has been widely documented.

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15 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

I’d argue Superman Returns was 100009 tines better then Man of Steel

I'd argue strongly the other way and I'm not that big a fan of Man of Steel.

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2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Ayer wasn't the problem. The madness involved in the editing of that film has been widely documented. 


The editing was crazy bad but it was hardly the only problem with Suicide Squad.

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2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

So this happened:

Kevin Feige Points to Richard Donner's 'Superman' as His Advice to the DCEU

Just one problem. They tried that already

They had Jon Peters producing (of Tim Burton's Batman and Batman Returns), Bryan Singer directing, screenwriters from X2 and a first rate cast. The result was "meh".

The problem with calling the cast "first rate" is that Brandon Routh as Superman sucked.  The rest of the cast was top notch, sure, but if ya don't got that ya don't got nothin.  

18 minutes ago, Fellaining Da Bruyne said:


The editing was crazy bad but it was hardly the only problem with Suicide Squad.

Indeed.  Suicide Squad is actually a fine movie to watch at two in the morning.  But the inciting incident --> supervillain --> final battle is farcical, urging you to treat as a Mystery Science Theatre pic.

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40 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

I’d argue Superman Returns was 100009 tines better then Man of Steel

 

24 minutes ago, Slurktan said:

I'd argue strongly the other way and I'm not that big a fan of Man of Steel.

I saw them both in the theater on opening weekend.  I like them both.  Man of steel was better.

16 minutes ago, Fellaining Da Bruyne said:


The editing was crazy bad but it was hardly the only problem with Suicide Squad.

Maybe, maybe not, but it is the single biggest problem.

The example I go to for how editing can make or break a film is The Blues Brothers.  Easily one of my favorite films, which is impressive since it's basically a comedy musical and I don't really like those.

When I bought my first DVD player, I wanted to find a copy of TBB to start my collection.  The only thing available was the collectors edition with 15 minutes of additional footage.  I bought that.  If the theatrical cut was one of my favorite films, the collectors edition was fucking un-watchable.  I couldn't even finish the damn thing.  All the shit they added provided needless exposition and completely destroyed the flow of the movie.

3 minutes ago, DMC said:

The problem with calling the cast "first rate" is that Brandon Routh as Superman sucked.  The rest of the cast was top notch, sure, but if ya don't got that ya don't got nothin.  

You need to lay off them left-handed cigarettes because you're obviously high.

If they were doing not just an homage to the Donner films, but an actual continuation of that story line, Brandon Routh was perfect for that role.

 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

So this happened:

Kevin Feige Points to Richard Donner's 'Superman' as His Advice to the DCEU

Just one problem. They tried that already

They had Jon Peters producing (of Tim Burton's Batman and Batman Returns), Bryan Singer directing, screenwriters from X2 and a first rate cast. The result was "meh".

 

15 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

You need to lay off them left-handed cigarettes because you're obviously high.

If they were doing not just an homage to the Donner films, but an actual continuation of that story line, Brandon Routh was perfect for that role.

 

That's the crux of it. Kevin Feige is pointing to the right path. They just can't simply do an homage and that's it, but a continuation. Have Superman in the modern era and adjust his actions accordingly but let him keep the spirit of Reeve's Superman.

I liked Superman Returns though even if i found it boring in parts. I thought Routh was fine and the opening title sequence filled me with joy. Kate Bosworth was not good as Lois Lane, Parker Posey should have played Lane instead of Luthor's henchwoman. Spacey was great as Luthor but now I can't even enjoy that because Spacey is such a slime.

I hated Man of Steel, it felt like an assault on my senses, it was dreary, it was loud, it was exhausting, and it didn't feel like a Superman movie.

Edited by drawkcabi

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12 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

If they were doing not just an homage to the Donner films, but an actual continuation of that story line, Brandon Routh was perfect for that role.

The disparity in acting prowess between Routh and the actors that have played lead roles in both Batmans and all the Marvel guys - including Hemsworth, although maybe not including Evans - is a veritable chasm.

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36 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

The only thing available was the collectors edition with 15 minutes of additional footage.  I bought that.  If the theatrical cut was one of my favorite films, the collectors edition was fucking un-watchable.  I couldn't even finish the damn thing.  All the shit they added provided needless exposition and completely destroyed the flow of the movie.

I had a similar experience with Donnie Darko. The Director's Cut is terrible, and in some places it's ruined by nothing more than for example the music cutting in a little more abruptly during a particular scene.

However, as much as I won't dispute the power of editing, Suicide Squad also just quite clearly doesn't really understand the characters involved or the whole concept of the Squad. But even past that, regarding my original point about Ayer being unsuited for developing Harley Quinn - even his good films wouldn't make me pick him out as someone to deal with a Harley Quinn solo effort or Gotham City Sirens. I've said in the past, that should be far more the speed of someone like Dan Harmon or Tina Fey or, if you want someone with more proven action chops, at the very least an Edgar Wright or Matthew Vaughan.

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30 minutes ago, drawkcabi said:

 

That's the crux of it. Kevin Feige is pointing to the right path. They just can't simply do an homage and that's it, but a continuation. Have Superman in the modern era and adjust his actions accordingly but let him keep the spirit of Reeve's Superman.

 

Wasn't it actually a continuation?  Didn't they sort of pick up the thread after superman 2 and just pretended 3 & 4 didn't happen?

I was exactly the right age when the Donner films were released.  I'd need all my fingers and toes and probably a few of yours to count the times I've seen those films.  Watching them today though, they don't age well.  There are parts that are actually a bit cringeworthy.

Here's the problem, while Kevin Feige and probably a few people on these boards might feel a great deal of nostalgia for the Donner films, anyone under the age of say, 30, just won't.  And, as I said, it's been tried and the results were not ideal.

30 minutes ago, drawkcabi said:

I hated Man of Steel, it felt like an assault on my senses, it was dreary, it was loud, it was exhausting, and it didn't feel like a Superman movie.

 

No, it didn't feel like a Donner movie. Other criticisms aside, almost all the other incarnations of Superman in animation or TV borrow from the Donner film in some way, whether its the costume or the crystal-palace Fortress of solitude or the depiction of Krypton or the score.  Taken in isolation, these things don't amount to much but together, yeah, it's going to feel different.

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22 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

No, it didn't feel like a Donner movie. Other criticisms aside, almost all the other incarnations of Superman in animation or TV borrow from the Donner film in some way, whether its the costume or the crystal-palace Fortress of solitude or the depiction of Krypton or the score.  Taken in isolation, these things don't amount to much but together, yeah, it's going to feel different. 



Agreed with this bit here. There seems to be an insistence that new films follow the Donner blueprint in a way that doesn't exist for, say, any specific version of Batman (though the Nolanverse has picked up some adherents along the way). It's not the only way to present Superman.

MoS deserves criticism for its treatment of Pa Kent and for other carelesnesses that amplified and caused problems in a big way as the sequels went on but I thought in its own right it was a worthy effort that did some really good things.

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30 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Wasn't it actually a continuation?  Didn't they sort of pick up the thread after superman 2 and just pretended 3 & 4 didn't happen?

I was exactly the right age when the Donner films were released.  I'd need all my fingers and toes and probably a few of yours to count the times I've seen those films.  Watching them today though, they don't age well.  There are parts that are actually a bit cringeworthy.

Here's the problem, while Kevin Feige and probably a few people on these boards might feel a great deal of nostalgia for the Donner films, anyone under the age of say, 30, just won't.  And, as I said, it's been tried and the results were not ideal.

I'm 33.  I know the "Donner" films, if you want to group 2 in that, fine, but it's a bit of stretch.  I would feel that nostalgia, but Routh didn't do it - and especially his chemistry with Bosworth.  That's crucial.  The film's got you rooting for Marsden.

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1 minute ago, Darth Richard II said:

What Snyder did to Pa Kent is a war crime.

War is the province of men. What happened to Pa Kent is the work of the devil.

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3 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

What Snyder did to Pa Kent is a war crime.



Oh well, at least he didn't do anything stupid with the mothe...


Oh.

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