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Mwm

Is Ser Arthur Dayne considered the best sword fighter in Westeros history?

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Posted (edited)

Jaime obviously had a very high opinion of him, but Martin said it would be a toss up between him an selmy without Dawn.

Then in the world book there a lot of mentions of the best fighters of their age...Daemon Blackfyre, the Dragonknight.

Edited by Mwm

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1 minute ago, Mwm said:

Jaime obviously had a very high opinion of him, but Martin said it would be a toss up between him an selmy without Dawn.

Then in the world book there a lot of mentions of the best fighters of their age...Daemon Blackfyre, the Dragonknight.

Martin said Jaime is one of the greatest swordsmen in Westerosi history. Since Arthur Dayne was by most accounts better than Jaime, he was better than one of the greatest swordsmen in Westerosi history. Making him a definite contender for best ever.

But, before Lord Varys comes hounding me with his passionate “we don’t know” crusade, let me just add that of course we don’t know for sure.

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4 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

But, before Lord Varys comes hounding me with his passionate “we don’t know” crusade, let me just add that of course we don’t know for sure.

This is what I was wondering, if it’s just a toss up in accounts or if there was a standard...

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Posted (edited)

Well, we don't know but neither can our guys in Westeros. Did Maegor the Cruel meet Arthur Dayne to check his abilities? Or did Dunk and the Dragonknight ever meet each other?

No.

People can only judge the abilities of the people they knew - some men, like Selmy, have met and judged the abilities of a lot of warriors, so if he said Arthur Dayne was better than Ser Duncan the Tall (in his later years) or Gregor Clegane would have been no match for Maelys the Monstrous then I would take his opinion on such matters seriously.

Aside from that, every generation of knights would have 'the best knights of Westerosi history' and the best of those (or that with the largest fame) would then enter into the pantheon of the greatest knights ever among who many Kingsguard, royal princes, great knights and lords, etc. find themselves.

The latter are those we learn about, those who end up being mentioned alongside the legendary heroes in song and story.

Edited by Lord Varys

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A better question might be why he was so good, ie if Dayne was a good swordsman because he was a supernaturally good swordsman. I think we've all accepted the idea that being a particularly good animal-handler can be a sign of magical abilities, latent or otherwise, but I don't know if a supernatural affinity for combat has ever been seriously discussed.

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I would say Daemon Blackfyre would be the best in my opinion. The only reason he was slayed was because his kindness towards Corbray, and Bloodraven using the 3 enchanted wierwood arrows. Arthur Dayne would be very high up as well, without Dawn (i believe he's mance rayder and that's why he fucked up Jon so easily with a greatsword). The other 2 that would probably be higher up than these, but we don't have much information on is Brandon of the bloody blade and Symeon Star Eyes.

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With new information now from all the world books i can say he is one of the best but "THE" best i'm not touching that. 

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I would say that Selmy is better than Arthur Dayne, but the only fight we have seen of Arthur Dayne was the one at  the tower of joy. That fight was good , but i don`t think that you can consider their skills after on fight of him. So we can just speculate who`s better.

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10 minutes ago, OneAutumnLeaf said:

I would say that Selmy is better than Arthur Dayne, but the only fight we have seen of Arthur Dayne was the one at  the tower of joy. That fight was good , but i don`t think that you can consider their skills after on fight of him. So we can just speculate who`s better.

Martin said they are equal with normal weapons, but with Dawn Dayne would beat Barristan.

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On 6/22/2018 at 9:55 AM, Mwm said:

Jaime obviously had a very high opinion of him, but Martin said it would be a toss up between him an selmy without Dawn.

Then in the world book there a lot of mentions of the best fighters of their age...Daemon Blackfyre, the Dragonknight.

Lol, subjective rankings in a fantasy novel. Just know that your favorite is the best ever 

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On 8/4/2018 at 8:11 PM, kleevedge said:

I would say Daemon Blackfyre would be the best in my opinion. The only reason he was slayed was because his kindness towards Corbray, and Bloodraven using the 3 enchanted wierwood arrows. Arthur Dayne would be very high up as well, without Dawn (i believe he's mance rayder and that's why he fucked up Jon so easily with a greatsword). The other 2 that would probably be higher up than these, but we don't have much information on is Brandon of the bloody blade and Symeon Star Eyes.

Wasn’t Baelor Breakspear better? 

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18 hours ago, Red Rahloo Connington said:

Wasn’t Baelor Breakspear better? 

I dont think so, he died to Maekar. He was still a good fighter but I don't know if I'd consider him top 5. Top 10 maybe. Daemon was near unstoppable

Quote

Daemon matured into a man of considerable charm and strength, mastering all weapons of the battlefield, but with the sword Blackfyre in hand he was said to fight like the Warrior himself

I'd also say Bittersteel could be a contender though I still believe Daemon the best.

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I think the Hound is the best pound for pound fighter in Westeros at the moment, historically I'd take Criston Cole over Barristan Selmy.  Maybe not better than Arthur Dayne but surely in the same class.  He didn't even have a magical sword.

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On 6/24/2018 at 2:33 AM, Lord Varys said:

Well, we don't know but neither can out guys in Westeros. Did Maegor the Cruel meet Arthur Dayne to check his abilities? Or did Dunk and the Dragonknight ever meet each other?

No.

People can only judge the abilities of the people they knew - some men, like Selmy, have met and judge the abilities of a lot of warriors, so if he Arthur Dayne was better than Ser Duncan the Tall (in his later years) or Gregor Clegane would have been no match against Maelys the Monstrous then I would take his opinion on such matters seriously.

Aside from that, every generation of knights would have 'the best knights of Westerosi history' and the best of those (or that with the largest fame) would then enter the pantheon of the greatest knights ever among who many Kingsguard, royal princes, great knights and lords, etc. find themselves.

The latter are those we learn about, those who end up being mentioned alongside the legendary heroes in song and story.

I totally agree with you! Its the same in football, who is the best Messi or Cruiff/Ronaldo or Maradonna or Pele or George Best? You can never compare Generations, they didnt even have youtube or videos to compare the skills. Every 3 Generations you get the best swordsman. The archievments of Arthur Dayne are lower than those from Barristen Selmy according The world of ice and Fire.  Also is the best swordsman not the best fighter, maybe in a duel One of the Baretheon lords like Rogar or Robert would have crushed him.

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On 12/3/2018 at 7:44 PM, kleevedge said:

I dont think so, he died to Maekar. He was still a good fighter but I don't know if I'd consider him top 5. Top 10 maybe. Daemon was near unstoppable

I'd also say Bittersteel could be a contender though I still believe Daemon the best.

I remember Baelor actually besting Daemon in tourney. Iirc

Edited by Red Rahloo Connington

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7 hours ago, Red Rahloo Connington said:

I remember Baelor actually besting Daemon in tourney. Iirc

Princess Daenerys's wedding tourney. Baelor beat Daemon in the final tilt, earning the appellation "Breakspear" in the process.

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17 hours ago, Red Rahloo Connington said:

I remember Baelor actually besting Daemon in tourney. Iirc

ya that was a joust not a melee. I thought we were comparing swordsmen?

Edited by kleevedge

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