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Bufo

True Heir to the Throne

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I'm late to the party. I didn't start watching GoT until this year and now I'm totally obsessed with it and have watched it several times. I'm in the middle of the first book too. I can't get enough of it!

I apologize if this topic has already been posted but I couldn't find it anywhere.

I'm confused as to who the real heir to the iron throne is. Cercei is sitting on it now. If she should die without giving birth and it stands as it did at the end of season 7 then:

Wouldn't Jaimie be the true heir? Just like if Prince William didn't have children, Harry would be next in line.

Or if it should go to a Baratheon heir because she was Robert's wife, then it should fall to Gendry as his son.

Or if Robert was truly a usurper, then it should go to Jon.

What do y'all think?

 

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, Bufo said:

I'm late to the party. I didn't start watching GoT until this year and now I'm totally obsessed with it and have watched it several times. I'm in the middle of the first book too. I can't get enough of it!

I apologize if this topic has already been posted but I couldn't find it anywhere.

I'm confused as to who the real heir to the iron throne is. Cercei is sitting on it now. If she should die without giving birth and it stands as it did at the end of season 7 then:

Wouldn't Jaimie be the true heir? Just like if Prince William didn't have children, Harry would be next in line.

Or if it should go to a Baratheon heir because she was Robert's wife, then it should fall to Gendry as his son.

Or if Robert was truly a usurper, then it should go to Jon.

What do y'all think?

 

 

 

 

It depends on the opinions of the lords and ladies of the realm as to who they’d consider the true heir, and they’ll have different opinions like people on this forum do. I’d consider Jon, as a legitimate son of Rhaegar Targaryen, to be the true heir to the throne. But one could argue Daenerys is the true heir, because Queen Rhaella crowned Viserys III on Dragonstone and he named Daenerys his heir. Those who support the Baratheon Rebellion may consider Gendry the heir, as the legitimate Baratheon line is extinct. Cersei also has a claim, not only through conquest but also through proximity, in which case Jaime could put forward a claim as her eldest brother. There may even be a claim for Brienne’s father Lord Selwyn Tarth as House Tarth has recent ties to House Baratheon and House Targaryen and so they *might* be the legitimate heirs to both House Targaryen (after Jon and Daenerys) and to House Baratheon. 

So long story short, there is no “true heir,” just claims. Jon has the best claim to me, but if I was a lord I might not believe the evidence and so consider the true heir to be Daenerys, and even then I might consider her too brutal and choose to support another claimant even if I believe their claim weaker. 

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Posted (edited)
On 6/27/2018 at 7:38 AM, Bufo said:

What do y'all think?

I don't know who is the true heir. All I know is, that Cersei cannot sit (by right) on the Iron Throne, as she is a woman. 

In the books I would say Edric Storm is the heir of Robert. In the show ? Who knows. i would argue against Gendry, as he is not acknowledged. But in the end ... D&D will declare it "was all based on a lie". *depressing look*

Edited by SirArthur

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AS FAR AS THE SHOW IS CONCERNED

Technically, Jon is the true heir.

However, if there is no hard evidence to attest to Jon's bloodline, then the right belongs to Daenerys. The proof of her Targaryen blood is self-evident. If I was any person in Westeros - highborn or lowborn - then I'd lean in favor of Daenerys. As far as most people would be concerned, Jon is the Dornish-born bastard son of Ned Stark. So, the thought of him on the Throne? No way.

Cersei has no right to sit on the Iron Throne. Her sex (and her blood ties to the previous king) has a little to do with it but it has more to do with the fact that none her children are legitimate Baratheons - they are illegitimate Lannisters. They couldn't even inherit Casterly Rock.

That's one of the worst aspects about season 7. People should be protesting her reign and conspiring against her either openly or secretly...for a whole slew of reasons. Conquest? Please but whatevs I guess.

Gendry has more right than she does and Gendry had never been acknowledged.

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25 minutes ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

AS FAR AS THE SHOW IS CONCERNED

Technically, Jon is the true heir.

However, if there is no hard evidence to attest to Jon's bloodline, then the right belongs to Daenerys. The proof of her Targaryen blood is self-evident. If I was any person in Westeros - highborn or lowborn - then I'd lean in favor of Daenerys. As far as most people would be concerned, Jon is the Dornish-born bastard son of Ned Stark. So, the thought of him on the Throne? No way.

Cersei has no right to sit on the Iron Throne. Her sex (and her blood ties to the previous king) has a little to do with it but it has more to do with the fact that none her children are legitimate Baratheons - they are illegitimate Lannisters. They couldn't even inherit Casterly Rock.

That's one of the worst aspects about season 7. People should be protesting her reign and conspiring against her either openly or secretly...for a whole slew of reasons. Conquest? Please but whatevs I guess.

Gendry has more right than she does and Gendry had never been acknowledged.

You’re right. Jon doesn’t even have immunity to fire. 

I’m surprised by the smallfolk’s approval of Cersei comes from, considering she’s done: 

  • Slept with her brother and bore three incest-born bastards, one of which was one of the most notable examples of the Caligula in living Westeros memory, 
  • Had the Great Sept of Baelor blown up with wildfire, which also counts her as a kinslayer since Kevan and Lancel were among the victims, as well as the popular Tyrells, which blew up a bunch of smallfolk as well
  • Allied with Euron Greyjoy, who is Ironborn (one of the most disliked Seven Kingdoms)

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On 6/28/2018 at 4:06 PM, Angel Eyes said:

You’re right. Jon doesn’t even have immunity to fire. 

I’m surprised by the smallfolk’s approval of Cersei comes from, considering she’s done: 

  • Slept with her brother and bore three incest-born bastards, one of which was one of the most notable examples of the Caligula in living Westeros memory, 
  • Had the Great Sept of Baelor blown up with wildfire, which also counts her as a kinslayer since Kevan and Lancel were among the victims, as well as the popular Tyrells, which blew up a bunch of smallfolk as well
  • Allied with Euron Greyjoy, who is Ironborn (one of the most disliked Seven Kingdoms)

Toss in that destroying the Sept would be akin to blowing up the Vatican, as well as killing the High Septon (she called him the sparrow) as well as all the High Church Officials and she killed Queen Maergery and probably a fair amount of the nobility.  She has absolutely no right to the throne.  There must be a Baratheon cousin somewhere with a claim.  After all, if you look at HenryVIth of England, despite his being deposed Margaret of Anjou never became, or was seriously considered a ruler in her own right.  Failing a Baratheon heir then undoubtedly it would pass to Dany, or to Jon since, once his story is told, he is the true heir.  I always felt that his story would wind up being Arthurian in nature.

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17 hours ago, Byfort of Corfe said:

Toss in that destroying the Sept would be akin to blowing up the Vatican, as well as killing the High Septon (she called him the sparrow) as well as all the High Church Officials and she killed Queen Maergery and probably a fair amount of the nobility.  She has absolutely no right to the throne.  There must be a Baratheon cousin somewhere with a claim.  After all, if you look at HenryVIth of England, despite his being deposed Margaret of Anjou never became, or was seriously considered a ruler in her own right.  Failing a Baratheon heir then undoubtedly it would pass to Dany, or to Jon since, once his story is told, he is the true heir.  I always felt that his story would wind up being Arthurian in nature.

So Rhaegar is Uther Pendragon, with all the questionable consent to boot?

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On 6/28/2018 at 10:37 PM, Jabar of House Titan said:

Cersei has no right to sit on the Iron Throne. Her sex (and her blood ties to the previous king) has a little to do with it but it has more to do with the fact that none her children are legitimate Baratheons - they are illegitimate Lannisters. They couldn't even inherit Casterly Rock.

Didn't you read all those articles last year that declared Cersei the heir of Tommen, because she is a very distant relative of Robert ? And then I think it is very fair to argue that Cersei's children are definitly her's, definitly "acknowledged" by her and definitly raised by her. Which is more or less an adoption and should also count for Lannister inheritance. Else I guess some bastard of Jaime has the best claim. Oh wait. 

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If we are talking technically, it is hard to say. It started off belonging to House Targaryen, they lost it to House Baratheon through right of conquest, but technically since Robert Baratheon's grandmother was a Targaryen, you could argue that once the Targaryens were dead he was next in line to the throne anyway, after Viserys and Daenerys. (and unknowingly Jon) 

If there was a Great Council then the Lords would probably choose Jon are the rightful King, since:

A.) He is the son of Rhaegar, who everyone loved.

B.) He grew up in Westeros.

C.) He has experience in ruling, even if it is only the Nights Watch. 

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