Giant Ice Spider Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 7 minutes ago, Bernie Mac said: battles clearly happen in the city, just look at Ned and Jaime. City watch would have their fair share of need of bravery and a peasant is unlikely to have risen so high if the likes of Jon Arryn (the man who made him commander) and Robert thought him a coward. Corrupt is one thing, but there is no way Robert would allow a coward to command the capital's military nor would the likes of Thorne support him. It wasn't a heroic situation, he was being executed for shooting his mouth off. Of course he was asking for mercy, you would have to be an idiot to not do so. Him asking for mercy is not a sign of cowardice, most humans would do so in his position. I certainly would, are you telling me you would not? You'd just accept your fate, execution for saying something stupid? The Sack of King's Landing may have a legitimate instance of gold cloak bravery, but no one has thus far bothered what they did so we'll never know. The fight between Ned and Jamie was barely a skirmish, and by the time the gold cloaks got there all of Ned's men were dead. Vis-à-vis Slynt's last words, it's one thing to ask for mercy, and another to start quaking and quivering. This is, however, just my interpretation of the text, and interpretations will always be different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Mac Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 1 minute ago, Giant Ice Spider said: The Sack of King's Landing may have a legitimate instance of gold cloak bravery, but no one has thus far bothered what they did so we'll never know. The fight between Ned and Jamie was barely a skirmish, and by the time the gold cloaks got there all of Ned's men were dead. My point was there is fighting, Robert enjoys throwing tourneys, this attracts knights, lords and their entourages from across the realm and they break out in battle, it would be the Gold Cloaks jobs to keep the peace and that would involve being in the fray. There is little reason to think that someone who has risen as high in a military order such as the Gold Cloaks. 1 minute ago, Giant Ice Spider said: Vis-à-vis Slynt's last words, it's one thing to ask for mercy, and another to start quaking and quivering. No, it really is not. First of all quaking and shivering are body reactions to stress, being brave does not come into it. Secondly, and more importantly, he never actually starts quacking or quivering in that moment (and quivering has a different meaning to what you are thinking, though Janos is not described as quivering in that scene his fat jowels are often described as quivering, even when he is talking down to Tyrion and Jon), but he is struggling At the cage, Slynt wrenched loose for a moment and tried to make a fight of it, but Iron Emmett caught him by the throat and slammed him back against the iron bars until he desisted. By then all of Castle Black had come outside to watch... "Unhand me ... you cannot ... when Tywin Lannister hears of this, you will all rue - " Emmett kicked his legs out from under him. Dolorous Edd planted a foot on his back to keep him on his knees as Emmett shoved the block beneath his head. "This will go easier if you stay still," Jon Snow promised him. "Move to avoid the cut, and you will still die, but your dying will be uglier. This is pretty much the basic struggle to about to be executed, the majority of living creatures would struggle in that situation, I guarantee you that braver men than Slynt would have struggled in similar positions. 1 minute ago, Giant Ice Spider said: This is, however, just my interpretation of the text, and interpretations will always be different. but it is not the text, you have kind of added your own head canon of what happened to make an antagonist of the Starks seem more cowardly than he actually is. It frequently happens in this fandom because in fantasy fiction we are so used to seeing the villains being 'cowardly', 'greedy' or who only rule through 'fear' that people just assume that the Starks antagonists fits all these boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giant Ice Spider Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Bernie Mac said: My point was there is fighting, Robert enjoys throwing tourneys, this attracts knights, lords and their entourages from across the realm and they break out in battle, it would be the Gold Cloaks jobs to keep the peace and that would involve being in the fray. There is little reason to think that someone who has risen as high in a military order such as the Gold Cloaks. No, it really is not. First of all quaking and shivering are body reactions to stress, being brave does not come into it. Secondly, and more importantly, he never actually starts quacking or quivering in that moment (and quivering has a different meaning to what you are thinking, though Janos is not described as quivering in that scene his fat jowels are often described as quivering, even when he is talking down to Tyrion and Jon), but he is struggling At the cage, Slynt wrenched loose for a moment and tried to make a fight of it, but Iron Emmett caught him by the throat and slammed him back against the iron bars until he desisted. By then all of Castle Black had come outside to watch... "Unhand me ... you cannot ... when Tywin Lannister hears of this, you will all rue - " Emmett kicked his legs out from under him. Dolorous Edd planted a foot on his back to keep him on his knees as Emmett shoved the block beneath his head. "This will go easier if you stay still," Jon Snow promised him. "Move to avoid the cut, and you will still die, but your dying will be uglier. This is pretty much the basic struggle to about to be executed, the majority of living creatures would struggle in that situation, I guarantee you that braver men than Slynt would have struggled in similar positions. but it is not the text, you have kind of added your own head canon of what happened to make an antagonist of the Starks seem more cowardly than he actually is. It frequently happens in this fandom because in fantasy fiction we are so used to seeing the villains being 'cowardly', 'greedy' or who only rule through 'fear' that people just assume that the Starks antagonists fits all these boxes. Yeah, I fully admit that I misread the text. It happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varysblackfyre321 Posted June 30, 2018 Author Share Posted June 30, 2018 8 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: He's a commoner who had risen to the position of Commander of the Kingsguard, he would have done so based on merit rather than birth. Quote True. I mean it's made not multiple times he was the son of a butcher. He's one of the few peasant charachters we really see in the series actively working and succeeding in rising through the ranks of society-other examples being, Bronn, and Ramsey, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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