UK Politics: This Country is Going to the Moggs

[mormont]

 

 

 

[Jen'ari]

7 hours ago, mormont said:

I'd favour being in Europe and out of the UK, so my opinions on who should be PM of the UK are coloured by that. But the current crop of party leaders are probably the worst I've seen in my lifetime. May has no perceptible ambitions or principles beyond surviving the week. Corbyn is prickly, divisive and too willing to cast blame instead of lead. Every Lib Dem I know yearned for Vince Cable to be leader and now he is, he's led the party into total obscurity. The Labour and Tory front benches are not appointed on talent but on factional politics, so I don't see any prospects there. 

Basically, politics in this country is in a bigger mess than I have ever seen it in my lifetime. I'm just glad that at least we get some protection from the worst of it here in Scotland. 

I can see where your coming from and for the most part agree, the current crop of politicians are truly that bad!.

Im not sure if an independent Scotland that was part of the EU would be a tenable position though?, if it could work I’d not blame the Scots for wanting to leave the U.K. at all, but the logistics of actually doing it would surely be a complicated nightmare-although probably not any more of a mess than is being made of Brexit!.

[john]

I was looking forward to the Russian response to the announcement of these arrests for supposedly spying on an OPCW lab in Switzerland.  So far they just said it was “false.” Boring.

[williamjm]

2 hours ago, Lord Sidious said:

Im not sure if an independent Scotland that was part of the EU would be a tenable position though?, if it could work I’d not blame the Scots for wanting to leave the U.K. at all, but the logistics of actually doing it would surely be a complicated nightmare-although probably not any more of a mess than is being made of Brexit!.

Independence would have been easier if both the UK and Scotland were in the EU, otherwise many of the issues currently about the Irish border are also relevant to the Scottish border.

1 hour ago, john said:

I was looking forward to the Russian response to the announcement of these arrests for supposedly spying on an OPCW lab in Switzerland.  So far they just said it was “false.” Boring.

Give them some time, someone in Moscow is probably frantically looking up Swiss tourist attractions on Wikipedia.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

3 hours ago, williamjm said:

Independence would have been easier if both the UK and Scotland were in the EU, otherwise many of the issues currently about the Irish border are also relevant to the Scottish border.

Wasn't the Better Together campaign (really hard to believe the IndyRef folks could lose to a campaign with that name - I bet this is one of the more embarassing things in @mormont political CV), basically saying, if you leave the UK, you would also automatically leave the EU (no idea, if those bloody Europeans would let you in (somewaht unspoken, we also have a veto about new members)), you would also lose the strong and stable Pound (and propped up the Euro as the inferior alternative).

Anyway, I still think, depending on how bad Brexit will hit the British, rebuilding Hadrian's wall might look pretty tempting.

[mankytoes]

43 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Anyway, I still think, depending on how bad Brexit will hit the British, rebuilding Hadrian's wall might look pretty tempting.

Yeah, I don't feel there's much worth keeping in most of Northumbria. Maybe move Newcastle airport a bit south though?

[The BlackBear]

We'll keep the Geordies, thanks.

[BigFatCoward]

4 hours ago, mankytoes said:

Yeah, I don't feel there's much worth keeping in most of Northumbria. Maybe move Newcastle airport a bit south though?

Northumbria is the most beautiful county, geordies are the best people, though Newcastle airport is shite. 

[mankytoes]

We shouldn't be ceding territory to the bloody jocks. Lets rebuild the Antonine Wall and claim Glasgow and Edinburgh! They can keep the wilderness. 

[Spockydog]

5 minutes ago, mankytoes said:

We shouldn't be ceding territory to the bloody jocks. Lets rebuild the Antonine Wall and claim Glasgow and Edinburgh! They can keep the wilderness. 

...and the oil.

[mankytoes]

12 minutes ago, Spockydog said:

...and the oil.

I'd consider Edinburgh a fair price for that, it's really lovely. 

[john]

yeah, i’ll gladly take Northumbria. Beautiful part of the world.  You can have Edinburgh.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

13 hours ago, mankytoes said:

Yeah, I don't feel there's much worth keeping in most of Northumbria. Maybe move Newcastle airport a bit south though?

*Must not make inappropriate joke about that it was Scotland some centuries ago, and what (doesn't) work(s) in the middle east, will work for Britain.*

9 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

Northumbria is the most beautiful county, geordies are the best people, though Newcastle airport is shite. 

Yeah, but their dialect is just weird.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Anyway, almost forgot why I came here over the Geordie Shore thing.

Can anyone tell me what BoZo is doing? I mean, his it's about chucking chequers, not about getting rid of May routine looks so half arsed. Does the Chubby Checker want to make May's position untennable and hopes to inherit it, when she resigns, rather than kniving her?

It looks somewhat pathetic, even by BoZo's standards.

[BigFatCoward]

2 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

 

Yeah, but their dialect is just weird.

My accent is why my wife fell in love with me. 

[Werthead]

5 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Can anyone tell me what BoZo is doing? I mean, his it's about chucking chequers, not about getting rid of May routine looks so half arsed. Does the Chubby Checker want to make May's position untennable and hopes to inherit it, when she resigns, rather than kniving her?

I think this week did a lot of damage to the hard Brexiteers. They were expected to make a serious challenge, but instead they half-arsed it. They've put back a leadership challenge to April - after Brexit - because they were unable to muster the support needed to unseat her, and BoJo doesn't want to become PM ahead of Brexit so he is responsible for it. His plan is to come in afterwards and be able to explain any issues by saying he wasn't in charge and none of it is his fault. Then the hard Brexiteer alternative plan was laughed out of the room (even by some Brexit supporters) as being unworkable and naive.

Essentially this week was an admission by the hard Brexiteers that they don't have a viable, strong alternative to May's position. If May gets Brussels to agree to the Chequers plan (even in principle and a lot of the fine detail is watered down later on), that may solidify her position further and get her through until at least we see some kind of economic blowback after Brexit, at which point her position may become untenable.

That could all change a week on Tuesday, of course, but it does feel like this was a watershed moment that the Brexiteers failed to capitalise on, and have lost some momentum as a result.

[Maltaran]

In other political news, Gladstone the Treasury cat has gone missing. Hopefully he'll turn up soon, perhaps he's decided to move on from hunting mice and is out looking for a workable Brexit plan.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

I think he is on his way to the ROI to start a new life there. You know the saying the mice are always greener on the other island.

[Which Tyler]

18 months ago, I was very much against a second referendum (whilst bitching about the result), but with all the misinformation and, quite honestly, the lack of anything representing progress for the last 18 months, it really would get my approval now, notnthat I think the needle willmhave changed much; people just don't like admitting that they were wrong, and really do seem to prefer jumping off a cliff instead

[williamjm]

On 9/15/2018 at 7:21 PM, Werthead said:

I think this week did a lot of damage to the hard Brexiteers. They were expected to make a serious challenge, but instead they half-arsed it. They've put back a leadership challenge to April - after Brexit - because they were unable to muster the support needed to unseat her, and BoJo doesn't want to become PM ahead of Brexit so he is responsible for it. His plan is to come in afterwards and be able to explain any issues by saying he wasn't in charge and none of it is his fault. Then the hard Brexiteer alternative plan was laughed out of the room (even by some Brexit supporters) as being unworkable and naive.

Essentially this week was an admission by the hard Brexiteers that they don't have a viable, strong alternative to May's position. If May gets Brussels to agree to the Chequers plan (even in principle and a lot of the fine detail is watered down later on), that may solidify her position further and get her through until at least we see some kind of economic blowback after Brexit, at which point her position may become untenable.

That could all change a week on Tuesday, of course, but it does feel like this was a watershed moment that the Brexiteers failed to capitalise on, and have lost some momentum as a result.

It does feel like they've completely messed up their timing. If they were going to launch a coup they should have done it earlier, at least some of them seem to have belatedly come to the realisation that embarking on a lengthy leadership contest at the exact time the final negotiations are meant to be going on might not be a good look. They can probably depose May next year sometime, but that seems to defeat the purpose of them wanting to decide the Brexit deal themselves (not that they can apparently agree on what they want from a deal).