Jon's dream in ADwD

[Bowen Marsh]

3 hours ago, EloImFizzy said:

It would be interesting to see him wearing armor similar to Rhaegar, but wouldn't it be unfit for the type of climate he's fighting in? Plus where would be get it? Northerners aren't known for their fancy armor. 

The one wearing Rhaegar's armor is Daenerys.  Remember the dream.  Burning the usurper's ice army on the Trident and lifting Rhaegar's visor. 

Jon is wearing an ice armor that could only have come from the Others.  Totally different armor.

Rhaegar's armor was not Valyrian though.  The only one with Valyrian steel armor is Euron.  

[Megorova]

4 hours ago, Widow's Watch said:

I think it's dragonglass. I'm just not sure where anyone would find/get an armor made from dragonglass. What's interesting with the dream is that the Wall is no longer holding back the wights.

Dragonglass is very brittle. Thus it's impossible to make something complicated out of it. It's one thing to make a sharp shard out of it, formed like a blade, or an arrowhead, but it's totally different thing, to make out of it something as intricate, as body armour.

4 hours ago, EloImFizzy said:

Whilst I do think that would be really cool, how would he get the armor? Are you thinking that Sam smuggles it to Jon, since Euron is heading to Oldtown which is where Sam is. Euron doesn't seem like someone that is going to die anytime soon to me.

Quaithe may steal it for Jon. In Aeron's chapter

Spoiler

in his second dream, caused by drinking evening's shade, when he saw Euron on Iron Throne, he also saw near him a shadow woman with white fire in her hands. That's Quaithe with glass candle. Seems, that she's spying after Euron. So she can steal his Valyrian steel armour, and give it to Jon. She already did tried to contact Jon, thru his dream. He saw her as moon, in his first chapter in ADWD.

 

3 hours ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

Did he already have one that I missed? Or are you saying you think he had one "offscreen"?

Because this is the first I've noticed.

Dead Starks rising as wights in crypts of Winterfell. This nightmares are probably prophetic dreams.

1 hour ago, Bowen Marsh said:

He's wearing an armor made for the Others. 

Others are very thin, they are humanoid, but their bodies are too different. Their armor wouldn't fit on human.

[kleevedge]

6 hours ago, EloImFizzy said:

In ADwD Jon Snow has a dream, I believe its in one of his last chapters, where he is fighting. This is a passage from that dream.

"Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist. As the dead men reached the top of the wall he sent them down to die again. He slew a greybeard and a beardless boy, a giant, a gaunt man with filed teeth, a girl with thick red hair. Too late he recognized Ygritte. She was gone as quick as she'd appeared."

Whenever I look this up I find people going over the red blade he's holding, but what I want to know is whats the black ice he's armored in? 

I feel like this is just him remembering all the people he killed, or feels responsible for their deaths. The black ice would just be him rationalizing what he has done was for the Night's Watch. The red sword was just Longclaw covered in blood the burned because he was wielding it in his burned hand.

[Mon ami]

10 hours ago, EloImFizzy said:

In ADwD Jon Snow has a dream, I believe its in one of his last chapters, where he is fighting. This is a passage from that dream.

"Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist. As the dead men reached the top of the wall he sent them down to die again. He slew a greybeard and a beardless boy, a giant, a gaunt man with filed teeth, a girl with thick red hair. Too late he recognized Ygritte. She was gone as quick as she'd appeared."

Whenever I look this up I find people going over the red blade he's holding, but what I want to know is whats the black ice he's armored in? 

Sometimes a dream is just a dream.  He ate too much of Hobb's stew for supper is all.  

[The Sleeper]

There are a lot of elements in that dream. I think the black ice armor foreshadows wighthood or partial wighthood for Jon and maybe the use of ice magic as the flaming sword points at the use of fire magic. 

I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility that Jon at some point will be wearing actual armor made of ice while wielding an actual flaming sword. 

[BlackLightning]

15 hours ago, Megorova said:

Quaithe may steal it for Jon. In Aeron's chapter

  Reveal hidden contents

in his second dream, caused by drinking evening's shade, when he saw Euron on Iron Throne, he also saw near him a shadow woman with white fire in her hands. That's Quaithe with glass candle. Seems, that she's spying after Euron. So she can steal his Valyrian steel armour, and give it to Jon. She already did tried to contact Jon, thru his dream. He saw her as moon, in his first chapter in ADWD.

 

4

I am 99.99% sure that Quaithe is not the woman standing by Euron, laughing with him at the dwarfs down below. Quaithe is one of the precious few people who have Daenerys' best interests at heart and Euron is clearly set up to be an bitter enemy of Daenerys. Quaithe also has warned Daenerys to be wary of and to distrust krakens so....yeah...

17 hours ago, Widow's Watch said:

I'm not really sure what you mean by offscreen, but I think his crypt dreams are extremely reminiscent of Dany's "wake the dragon" dream. 

You are absolutely right about the spelling of wall. So totally my bad, spelling is very important indeedy. The dream is sort of reminiscent of Mel's vision in her chapter and that vision is reminiscent of Jon's dream of castles burning and dead men getting out of their graves while he is in the Frostfangs.

And there's the dream of the bloody direwolf that he has before he ever finds out about the Red Wedding. Up in the Great Hall, he hears the drums (Jon VIII, ASOS 64).

Jon tends to wake up and never finish his dreams, but the dreams do seem to connect to visions. I think Jon's crypt dreams are dragon dreams. And I think he will have more of them. He seems to be connecting more to his "dragon" side since Mel arrived at the Wall and all the talk of waking dragons from stone started.

I thought the crypt dreams about undead Stark kings and wardens belonged to Bran? My mistake. I misremembered.

But the dream of the bloody direwolf and the drums - yeah, I forgot all about that one.

Now that I think about it, could it be possible for Jon to have green dreams and dragon dreams? What's the difference between the two?

[Bloodraven's Spider]

This dream has always puzzled me. Like why not say Valyrian Steel? Maybe because its not, I like the idea of Sam smuggling Euron's armor to Jon but I dont see Sam getting his hands on that armor. It very well could be Undead Jon in the Armor of Wights. But I foresee him coming back in a way like Beric mixed with Stoneheart. A vengeful spirit but who remembers he has a greater purpose. 

Who know's what Bran will bring back with from Bloodraven's cave? Maybe it's Darksister and some crazy armor Bloodraven had worked upon by the Children. Only time will tell. But Jon will not wield Lightbringer if anything he is most like to continue wielding Longclaw a slight chance at Darksister but I can see him getting a hold of Dawn as he is the next sword of the morning

[BlackLightning]

1 minute ago, Bloodraven's Spider said:

This dream has always puzzled me. Like why not say Valyrian Steel? Maybe because its not, I like the idea of Sam smuggling Euron's armor to Jon but I dont see Sam getting his hands on that armor. It very well could be Undead Jon in the Armor of Wights. But I foresee him coming back in a way like Beric mixed with Stoneheart. A vengeful spirit but who remembers he has a greater purpose. 

Who know's what Bran will bring back with from Bloodraven's cave? Maybe it's Darksister and some crazy armor Bloodraven had worked upon by the Children. Only time will tell. But Jon will not wield Lightbringer if anything he is most like to continue wielding Longclaw a slight chance at Darksister but I can see him getting a hold of Dawn as he is the next sword of the morning

I think Daenerys (or more likely Arya) is going to get her hands on Dark Sister though.

That's just my tinfoil head-canon though.

[Bloodraven's Spider]

51 minutes ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

I think Daenerys (or more likely Arya) is going to get her hands on Dark Sister though.

That's just my tinfoil head-canon though.

out of those 2 I would assume it be Arya. 1 she actually knows how to use a sword and 2 ArYA/VisenYA.

Has Dany ever held a sword? I dont think either of them will wield Dark Sister if anyone does, its probably someone already at the wall, Jon, Val (cough cough)

[BlackLightning]

1 hour ago, Bloodraven's Spider said:

out of those 2 I would assume it be Arya. 1 she actually knows how to use a sword and 2 ArYA/VisenYA.

Has Dany ever held a sword? I dont think either of them will wield Dark Sister if anyone does, its probably someone already at the wall, Jon, Val (cough cough)

Jon already has a Valyrian steel sword...and it's signifcantly bigger than Dark Sister.

Val is cool, I guess. But only if she becomes more of a major player because GRRM is not just going to give an ultra-rare Valyrian steel sword to just any Susie Q.

The question isn't if Dany ever held a sword? The question is has Dany ever swung/wielded a sword? To that question, the answer is almost assuredly a no. But based on Bran's visions in his last chapter in Dance and the sheer necessity Dany will be facing living amongst the Dothraki, Daenerys is due for quite a bit of scythe-swinging, Dothraki-screaming goodness.

[Sea Dragon]

On August 30, 2018 at 7:32 PM, Bowen Marsh said:

The one wearing Rhaegar's armor is Daenerys.  Remember the dream.  Burning the usurper's ice army on the Trident and lifting Rhaegar's visor. 

Jon is wearing an ice armor that could only have come from the Others.  Totally different armor.

Rhaegar's armor was not Valyrian though.  The only one with Valyrian steel armor is Euron.  

No. Jon and Danerys are going to marry, not fight. They both have some parts of Rhaegar. 

[Only 89 selfies today]

15 hours ago, The Sleeper said:

There are a lot of elements in that dream. I think the black ice armor foreshadows wighthood or partial wighthood for Jon and maybe the use of ice magic as the flaming sword points at the use of fire magic. 

I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility that Jon at some point will be wearing actual armor made of ice while wielding an actual flaming sword. 

Flaming is symbolic of valyrian steel.  Longclaw is vs.  The ice part of the armor is clearly not valyrian but rather of an Other origin.  The ice armor will probably stop vs weapons.  Valyrian steel armor does the opposite and stops ice weapons.  

Standing on top of the wall also symbolizes his conflict.  He has always been a confused and conflicted person.  This is akin to the expression sitting on the fence.  He will stand in the world between the living and dead.  His dead kin will call to him but one side will retain his humanity.  He is fighting ice and the Starks one minute but he is also the enemy of the living.  He is simultaneously friend and foe to ice.  He is alone because he betrayed mankind when he chose Arya over the Watch.  Yet his human side still remember part of his duties as a man of the night's watch.

[kissdbyfire]

So, let's see... the description we get for the WWs armour...

AGoT, Prologue

Its armor seemed to change color as it moved; here it was white as new-fallen snow, there black as shadow, everywhere dappled with the deep grey-green of the trees. The patterns ran like moonlight on water with every step it took.

ASoS, Samwell I

“The Other slid gracefully from the saddle to stand upon the snow. Sword-slim it was, and milky white. Its armor rippled and shifted as it moved, and its feet did not break the crust of the new-fallen snow.”

<snip>

“The wights had been slow clumsy things, but the Other was light as snow on the wind. It slid away from Paul’s axe, armor rippling, and its crystal sword twisted and spun and slipped between the iron rings of Paul’s mail, through leather and wool and bone and flesh”

Also, the armour the WWs have doesn't "stop" VS. In fact, it's probably the opposite and VS is one of the few things that are going to prove effective against the WWs. 

 

[Ckram]

The main issue with this armor is not that it's made of ice but that it's black.

As @kissdbyfire noticed, the armor of the other is not like that. So let's not close our eyes to the fact that this armor is not literal armor.

My interpretation is that this is a symbolic armor.

Made of ice, in the sense that Jon would have been picked up by the Others as a wight, so Jon will be one of them and have their powers (mainly to resist the extreme cold of the WWs).

Black, because Jon, despite being a ice wight, would still be fighting against the dead, in accordance with the principles and vows of the Night's Watch.

Jon Coldhands. Lol

[Jeeves]

17 hours ago, The Sleeper said:

There are a lot of elements in that dream. I think the black ice armor foreshadows wighthood or partial wighthood for Jon and maybe the use of ice magic as the flaming sword points at the use of fire magic. 

I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility that Jon at some point will be wearing actual armor made of ice while wielding an actual flaming sword. 

An ice wight wearing an ice armor while using a fire sword.  

[Alexis-something-Rose]

He is wielding a fire sword and armored in black ice.

Symbolically, he is wielding both ice and fire. Ice as protection, and fire as a weapon. It may be no more than a hint to Jon's origins.

Even the armor being black, Rhaegar's armor was black and fire is a Targaryen thing.

[kissdbyfire]

3 minutes ago, Ckram said:

The main issue with this armor is not that it's made of ice but that it's black.

As @kissdbyfire noticed, the armor of the other is not like that. So let's not close our eyes to the fact that this armor is not literal armor.

My interpretation is that this is a symbolic armor.

Made of ice, in the sense that Jon would have been picked up by the Others as a wight, so Jon will be one of them and have their powers (mainly to resist the extreme cold of the WWs).

Black, because Jon, despite being a ice wight, would still be fighting against the dead, in accordance with the principles and vows of the Night's Watch.

Jon Coldhands. Lol

I don't think Jon comes back as a wight. The armour is being described as "black ice" because it's a dream, and it looks like ice to Jon in the dream...  shiny, smooth, reflecting light, and unlike metal, only it's black. And what can look a lot like ice? Glass. That's why I think it's obsidian.

 

[Jeeves]

Just now, Ckram said:

The main issue with this armor is not that it's made of ice but that it's black.

As @kissdbyfire noticed, the armor of the other is not like that. So let's not close our eyes to the fact that this armor is not literal armor.

My interpretation is that this is a symbolic armor.

Made of ice, in the sense that Jon would have been picked up by the Others as a wight, so Jon will be one of them and have their powers (mainly to resist the extreme cold of the WWs).

Black, because Jon, despite being a ice wight, would still be fighting against the dead, in accordance with the principles and vows of the Night's Watch.

Jon Coldhands. Lol

Jon Coldhands.  Part zombie wight and part human.  

1 hour ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

Flaming is symbolic of valyrian steel.  Longclaw is vs.  The ice part of the armor is clearly not valyrian but rather of an Other origin.  The ice armor will probably stop vs weapons.  Valyrian steel armor does the opposite and stops ice weapons.  

Standing on top of the wall also symbolizes his conflict.  He has always been a confused and conflicted person.  This is akin to the expression sitting on the fence.  He will stand in the world between the living and dead.  His dead kin will call to him but one side will retain his humanity.  He is fighting ice and the Starks one minute but he is also the enemy of the living.  He is simultaneously friend and foe to ice.  He is alone because he betrayed mankind when he chose Arya over the Watch.  Yet his human side still remember part of his duties as a man of the night's watch.

It's like Jon wearing the black of the crows but he was never completely part of them because of his devotion to the Starks.  He's a man without a country.  His weaponry and armor reflect his identities.  He is wearing an armor made of ice because the others animated him back from the dead.  He is in a sense part of them.  Longclaw is the part of him that continues to serve the watch.  Both sword and armor are real.  

[Ckram]

@kissdbyfire Of course, this is also possible.

But I would not bet that this is a premonitory, divinatory dream. In which what you see is what you will get. Because, you know, Ygritte is in it, then I think it's all simbolic, even the armor.

@The First Bloodrider that's right.

[Euron III Greyjoy]

But if he comes back as a wight isn't his body just going to start rotting?