If Robb had declared for Stannis, would he have dismissed Melisandre?

[Canon Claude]

The power that Mel has over Stannis would have been severely undercut if the North and Riverlands had defied her predictions and declared for Stannis. Plus it would have given Stannis the power of two kingdoms as well as the Royal Fleet. But given her influence amongst Stannis’ followers, I wonder if it would have changed anything.

[Hodor the Articulate]

Well, he wouldn't have been happy with her idea to burn the weirwood trees. So maybe not dismissal, but the Northmen wouldn't like or trust her, and the alliance would fracture at some point.

[Barbrey Dustin]

Stannis already chose his god.  No alliance is possible until Robb gives up his plan to make the north an independent kingdom.  

[Rufus Snow]

i've just been thinking about this in another thread:

Quote

A Dance with Dragons - Melisandre I

The wooden man she had glimpsed, though, and the boy with the wolf's face … they were his servants, surely … his champions, as Stannis was hers.

Who dismisses who, depends on who's in the driving seat...

[Giant Ice Spider]

If Robb doesn't crown himself, and ends up declaring for Stannis, I reckon Mel would foresee that. If anything, such a prediction could INCREASE Stannis' faith in Mel.

[Canon Claude]

2 hours ago, Giant Ice Spider said:

If Robb doesn't crown himself, and ends up declaring for Stannis, I reckon Mel would foresee that. If anything, such a prediction could INCREASE Stannis' faith in Mel.

Would she, though? She’s been mistaken about visions before, and a slip-up that early might prevent Stannis from taking her seriously, especially if he now has the North and Riverlands on his side.

[hodorisfaclessman]

She stays! he never  really that religious but his wife is

[Ylath's Snout]

1 hour ago, hodorisfaclessman said:

She stays! he never  really that religious but his wife is

Hmm that was bound to be a source of trouble down the line for a Stannis-Robb alliance.

Stannis seems like he takes is marriage vows deadly serious so he won't set Selyse aside. As true belive at some point I foresee her and Melisandre driving Robb and his bannermen up the walls with their zealotry.

One "solution" for Stannis would be to leave his wife and her witch on Dragonstone to avoid aggravating his allies.

[The Sunland Lord]

Not a huge problem, as it's not one now since northmen-Stannis alliance is already in function. 

[Giant Ice Spider]

20 hours ago, Canon Claude said:

Would she, though? She’s been mistaken about visions before, and a slip-up that early might prevent Stannis from taking her seriously, especially if he now has the North and Riverlands on his side.

She is often wrong, but her visions aren't. A girl in grey on a dying horse DID arrive at Castle Black, for instance.

But, let's say for argument's sake she didn't see Robb joining Stannis, that doesn't change the fact "she has power". So Stannis still might keep her around for that.

[Legitimate_Bastard]

On 9/18/2018 at 7:08 PM, Canon Claude said:

The power that Mel has over Stannis would have been severely undercut if the North and Riverlands had defied her predictions and declared for Stannis. Plus it would have given Stannis the power of two kingdoms as well as the Royal Fleet. But given her influence amongst Stannis’ followers, I wonder if it would have changed anything.

I think that Stannis would have demanded conversion to R'hllor as a requisite. Robb would not have done it, plus his Lords would have had a paddy.

[Ylath's Snout]

22 minutes ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

I think that Stannis would have demanded conversion to R'hllor as a requisite. Robb would not have done it, plus his Lords would have had a paddy.

Yeah, demanding something like that would either result in a break between Robb and Stannis or a uprising among Robb's bannermen if he agreed.

[Legitimate_Bastard]

3 minutes ago, Ylath's Snout said:

Yeah, demanding something like that would either result in a break between Robb and Stannis or a uprising among Robb's bannermen if he agreed.

Agreed. The best they could have done would have been to compromise and postpone fighting each other until they had defeated mutual enemies. Perhaps if they had done that, by the time they had eliminated those mutual foes they would not have had the appetite to go to war again and fight one another.

[Ylath's Snout]

6 minutes ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

Perhaps if they had done that, by the time they had eliminated those mutual foes they would not have had the appetite to go to war again and fight one another.

That seems very optimistic. Stannis would feel that he is within his rights as king to demand that sort of things from Robb while Westerosi who are not followers of the Red God would rightly expect their right of religious freedom to be respected.

Basically unless the Red God gets a huge groundswell then Stannis and the R'hllorists are getting thrown out of Westeros once his intentions become clear.

[Legitimate_Bastard]

1 minute ago, Ylath's Snout said:

That seems very optimistic. Stannis would feel that he is within his rights as king to demand that sort of things from Robb while Westerosi who are not followers of the Red God would rightly expect their right of religious freedom to be respected.

Overly optimistic indeed. That's why it didn't happen LOL. If Renly (the more pliable brother) couldn't ally with Robb, Stannis the stickler def wouldn't.

Seems like the Red God does more damage to his cause then help.

[zandru]

On 9/18/2018 at 5:08 PM, Canon Claude said:

The power that Mel has over Stannis would have been severely undercut if the North and Riverlands had defied her predictions and declared for Stannis. Plus it would have given Stannis the power of two kingdoms as well as the Royal Fleet. But given her influence amongst Stannis’ followers, I wonder if it would have changed anything

Robb might possibly have bent the knee to Stannis, if he had first been assured that he didn't have to convert to fire worship. This would mean Stannis would need to set aside Melisandre. We suspect that he's only keeping her around because Selyse believes Mel has powers, and Stannis has seen enough that he thinks so, too. Will the indisputed military power of the North (and the vast extent of the Northern kingdom) override Melisandre's hocus pocus? Maybe.

Mel's magic depends largely on blood sacrifice and other morally reprehensible acts. Burning people alive. Burning the competing gods. The whole "kings blood" schtick. And, apparently, sex - with her. Okay, probably that last wouldn't be considered immoral in Westeros, where anything a man wants to do is fine by the gods and everybody else. It depends on how fastidious Stannis is. The text says, very.

Would dropping Melisandre and R'hllor lose Stannis a lot of followers? When you consider that, aside from Selyse, it seems everybody on Melisandre's side is in it for the political benefits, and to kiss up to King Stannis, I'd say no.

Robb might have worked a deal where the North would support Stannis, but have greater autonomy than the other kingdoms. They would have been wise to lock in a deal with, say, Bran marrying Shireen.