The impact of normal seasons on the North!!

[Stormking902]

IMO I believe at the end of the story magic will be erased forever OR at the very least the death of the WW permantly will bring upon normal seasons which will impact Westeros quite a bit especially the North.

What advantages do you readers believe the North will gain after such a drastic turn in the right direction for day to day living for Northerners? 

 

I believe the land would become a lot more fertile and thus bring in a huge influx of smallfolk wanting to set up shop in the North, poor Northern lords will become rich in decades time and with it their greed. Would this turn house Stark into the strongest family in all of Westeros over a few decades since the North is as large as all the other kingdoms combined?. If the North was ruled from the Iron Throne and they wanted to shrink the Starks land mass to reduce house Starks power and influence would this cause a rebellion? 

[Free Northman Reborn]

While all the kingdoms would benefit from a return to normal seasons, the North would benefit the most. I’d say it would settle firmly  into second spot, just behind the Reach in terms of population.

[Rufus Snow]

But but but ... the Starks would have nothing to talk about

 

"Winter is coming!"

"Yeah, right, grandad. Same as last year. Whatever "

[wia]

Not sure how anything would be that much different. It seems like no part of Westeros is capable of growing anything in the winter, not just the North.

The thing that impacts the fertility of land the most in cold climates is permafrost (I don't think there's much of it if any in the North though) and it shouldn't change, assuming you mean that winter and summer temperatures stay the same and it's only their duration that would change. Otherwise it depends on the type of soil that also shouldn't change and overall weather conditions that also shouldn't change either.

The trade would probably be better in terms of the seas being calmer more often, I guess.

[Ylath's Snout]

12 minutes ago, Rufus Snow said:

But but but ... the Starks would have nothing to talk about

 

"Winter is coming!"

"Yeah, right, grandad. Same as last year. Whatever "

Eeehh, you can still die from a regular winter if you are stuck on a medieval tech-level.

That said the fact that the North must have nearly magical food preservation tech to gather food for years before each winter the Starks and their smallfolk will likely have a easier time of than folk did in ye olden times on Earth.

[Free Northman Reborn]

32 minutes ago, Ylath's Snout said:

Eeehh, you can still die from a regular winter if you are stuck on a medieval tech-level.

That said the fact that the North must have nearly magical food preservation tech to gather food for years before each winter the Starks and their smallfolk will likely have a easier time of than folk did in ye olden times on Earth.

Yes. The Starks dictate that lords store a fifth of every harvest for Winter. That is on top of food used for consumption, trade, feudal taxes to liege lords and surplus activities such as wars.

Since there are no regular seasons, there are probably two or even three harvests a year during spring, summer and autumn. So if you have a 1 year spring, 3 year summer and 1 year autumn thats up to 15 harvests during that period, with a fifth of each stored for Winter. That means the equivalent of 3 full harvests stored away.

Since a normal full harvest has a fifth going into storage, and maybe another significant portion allocated to trade, taxes and wars, the population likely uses less than half of a harvest for feeding itself. Meaning 3 full harvests in storage should theoretically last significantly longer than 3 years, especially if they are on reduced winter rations.

Anything up to a five year Winter should be satisfactorily dealt with, barring spoilage. Unless it was preceded by an abnormally short summer. Then you may be screwed.

[Stormking902]

4 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

Yes. The Starks dictate that lords store a fifth of every harvest for Winter. That is on top of food used for consumption, trade, feudal taxes to liege lords and surplus activities such as wars.

Since there are no regular seasons, there are probably two or even three harvests a year during spring, summer and autumn. So if you have a 1 year spring, 3 year summer and 1 year autumn thats up to 15 harvests during that period, with a fifth of each stored for Winter. That means the equivalent of 3 full harvests stored away.

Since a normal full harvest has a fifth going into storage, and maybe another significant portion allocated to trade, taxes and wars, the population likely uses less than half of a harvest for feeding itself. Meaning 3 full harvests in storage should theoretically last significantly longer than 3 years, especially if they are on reduced winter rations.

Anything up to a five year Winter should be satisfactorily dealt with, barring spoilage. Unless it was preceded by an abnormally short summer. Then you may be screwed.

Which is why them greybeards grabbed there sword or axe and said I'm out family good luck im hittin up the Riverlands lol. Those Dahm Targs ruined everything ahah. 

[Bernie Mac]

2 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

IMO I believe at the end of the story magic will be erased forever OR at the very least the death of the WW permantly will bring upon normal seasons which will impact Westeros quite a bit especially the North.

It is not magic that makes it snow in the summer in the North, it is is position on the hemisphere.  There will be the same amount of summer and winter days over the course of 15 years, just that they will be spread out more.

 

2 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

I believe the land would become a lot more fertile 

How?

The North, thanks to the seasons, enjoys much longer summers than it would do in an earth year cycle, this has had no effect on the fertility. 

[Ylath's Snout]

15 minutes ago, Bernie Mac said:

It is not magic that makes it snow in the summer in the North, it is is position on the hemisphere.  There will be the same amount of summer and winter days over the course of 15 years, just that they will be spread out more.

 

How do you know that?

Summers and winters vary widely in length so clearly there isn't a longer season-cycle. Planetary mechanic and their effect on the seasons don't work like that.

[Bernie Mac]

3 minutes ago, Ylath's Snout said:

How do you know that?

Ibben is adjacent to Winterfell, quite a bit of the North is actually further North than Ibben. Just like in our own world the further north you go the less fertile (farmer friendly) the lands become. 

The North is not going to change that much, it is not going to start rivalling the Reach, Riverlands or even the Vale when it comes to farmland. 

 

[Ylath's Snout]

14 minutes ago, Bernie Mac said:

Ibben is adjacent to Winterfell, quite a bit of the North is actually further North than Ibben. Just like in our own world the further north you go the less fertile (farmer friendly) the lands become. 

I was talking about whether the ducked up seasons on Planetos are magic or not.

[Bernie Mac]

11 minutes ago, Ylath's Snout said:

I was talking about whether the ducked up seasons on Planetos are magic or not.

Whether they are or not is not going to change much, not to the level some have predicted in this thread. The North is going to have shorter seasons but over the course of 20 years (for example) there is going to be the same amount of summer and winter days. 

 

[Stormking902]

1 hour ago, Bernie Mac said:

Ibben is adjacent to Winterfell, quite a bit of the North is actually further North than Ibben. Just like in our own world the further north you go the less fertile (farmer friendly) the lands become. 

The North is not going to change that much, it is not going to start rivalling the Reach, Riverlands or even the Vale when it comes to farmland. 

 

Who claimed that it would ?

[Kienn]

Yea I don’t see a special benefit for the North either...

 

I think maybe OP is under the common misapprehension that the North has permafrost even though that doesn’t start until significantly north of the Wall?

 

Realistically I think the Reach and Dorne would be wastelands from the constant summer heat without seasonal weather patterns giving relief. A return of normal seasons would help those regions in that case... however since they’re apparently fine with the long summers they’ll probably just have no major improvements by shorter seasons either besides the obvious benefit of shorter winters.

[Bernie Mac]

1 hour ago, Stormking902 said:

Who claimed that it would ?

You did. 

7 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

 

 

I believe the land would become a lot more fertile and thus bring in a huge influx of smallfolk wanting to set up shop in the North, poor Northern lords will become rich in decades time and with it their greed. Would this turn house Stark into the strongest family in all of Westeros 

Now the North is 2/3rd the size of South of Westeros and the vast majority of it, given where it lies in the hemisphere, is never going to compete with the Reach while a large clump of the North is made up of the Neck, land that is poor for other factors other than the extended seasons. 

The idea that there will be an influx of southerners looking for work is ridiculous, especially in the timeframe you have given. The South would first have to become over  populated before peasants make their way North.