The Anti-Targ Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 17 minutes ago, Rippounet said: Which should be the standard answer given to American corporations and military throughout the world. Nationalism cuts both way. But ever since the Monroe doctrine at least, American nationalism has really been a cover for American imperialism. Which is why immigration is such a sticky issue. You can't plunder countries for centuries and then close your borders to people trying to flee poverty there. If the US wants to close its border to Latino immigration like Europe to African immigration, they should begin by i) erasing all illegal debt the countries have, ii) instoring actually fair trade rules, and iii) stop supporting autocratic/neo-liberal governments. If you want to be a nationalist you need to respect other people's nations. Otherwise you're either a hypocrit or a moron. Privatise the profits and socialise the losses. Works both at the corporatist and nationalist level. Once we find some Alien schleps to economically exploit in the neighbouring solar system globalists will be the next nationalists. Don't let those bug-eye Proximans bring their non-human ways around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 5 hours ago, Frog Eater said: In the first non-war engaged country, which would be Mexico. They should all be applying for asylum in Mexico, not the United States, and should all be sent home or back to Mexico So this is you just making shit up and putting the word ‘should’ in there somewhere? Jews fleeing the German pre-war persecution ‘should’ have been forced to remain in places like Austria, Poland, Czechoslovakia, that kind of thing? Just throwing a dart at the NIMBY board and hitting on ‘proximity’ as the most, scratch that, only priority criteria? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 6 hours ago, Frog Eater said: I'm glad we finally have a President who is proud to put our country first. Never in US history have you not had a President who was proud to put your country first. Absolutely never. No, not that one. Or that one. Every single one of them has put US interests first. They didn't all agree exactly with you on how that was best to be done. Some of them were smart, and understood that selfishness is not the same thing as putting your country first: that your country's interests are sometimes better served by generosity and co-operation. But every single one of them proudly put their country first, and it would be a foolish mistake to think otherwise. ETA - you know what, I'm going to correct myself. You do, right now, have a President who is not proud to put your country first. Donald Trump honestly doesn't care about America. Donald Trump doesn't care about anything but Donald Trump. He bellows the right phrases, but any time it's come down to a choice between America's interests and Donald Trump's personal interests, he hasn't even hesitated before cheerfully lining his pockets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 I would just point out that from what I can see the Presidency has not benefited Donald Trump. He is billions of dollars poorer than before he took office, his family’s businesses and personal brands have suffered as a result and I suspect a lot of his global business interests are severely impacted by his actions as president. I do believe that he is acting on personal conviction as far as his America First policies are concerned. It’s just that the Left absolutely abhors those convictions. It is difficult to see how his policies on immigration, terrorism and other conservative positions are benefiting him commercially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maarsen Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 14 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said: I would just point out that from what I can see the Presidency has not benefited Donald Trump. He is billions of dollars poorer than before he took office, his family’s businesses and personal brands have suffered as a result and I suspect a lot of his global business interests are severely impacted by his actions as president. I do believe that he is acting on personal conviction as far as his America First policies are concerned. It’s just that the Left absolutely abhors those convictions. It is difficult to see how his policies on immigration, terrorism and other conservative positions are benefiting him commercially. Trump is poorer due to his own stupidity. Always has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 It is fairly obvious that our current president does NOT put the country first, blatant appeals to nationalism aside. Trump is about himself first and foremost, make no mistake, he will let the country burn to serve his own interests or save his own ass if it comes to that. His entire existence depends on amplifying divisions (based on race, religion, human rights) by appealing to the lowest common denominator, so he will never make an attempt to unify the country. He is happy to be the president of people who adore and support him, the rest can suffer for all he cares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matrim Fox Cauthon Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 In typical autocratic thinking, Trump believes himself to be America, and if we follow this crazy reasoning, then him putting himself first is putting the US first in the minds of his many crazy-ass cult followers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 It's pretty obvious that what the Frog Eaters of the world like about Trump is not his purported dedication to interests of America, since he's been selling those out for a nickel wherever he can. What appeals is that he's an unreconstructed bigoted boor. Definitely the sort of President these guys can have a beer with, even if he'll refuse the beer and sneer at the poor rubes who lionize him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Wow, I looked into the eyes of the monster and it made me afraid for the world. Hint: the eyes of the monster are not David Pakman. It's over 50 minutes, but I only needed to watch 15 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Free Northman Reborn said: I would just point out that from what I can see the Presidency has not benefited Donald Trump. He is billions of dollars poorer than before he took office, his family’s businesses and personal brands have suffered as a result and I suspect a lot of his global business interests are severely impacted by his actions as president. Wow. This is a new form of denialism. What is your evidence that Trump ever had billions of dollars to lose, to begin with? Since Trump hides his tax returns (and lies about it), we can only guess at his worth. The best guesses indicate that he is worth around $3bn or $4bn, and has lost around $400m since becoming President. http://time.com/money/5188095/donald-trump-net-worth-2018/ You're very confident in stating that he 'is billions of dollars poorer', so I assume you have a different source? It's true that his personal and business brands have suffered since he became President, but not because he became President. They've suffered because he keeps doing things that hurt those brands. In any case, he wouldn't be suffering the same losses if he'd put his businesses in a blind trust. You know, like every other President has done, like every ethical person would do, like Trump himself promised to do. Instead, Trump has used his office to funnel public cash and donations from supporters into his businesses, and peddled influence through his family. Corruption is the only word for it. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/apr/16/trump-businesses-money-campaign-federal-agencies https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/28/trump-collects-on-business-and-presidency-is-boosting-brand.html https://www.economist.com/business/2017/07/20/how-donald-trump-is-monetising-his-presidency 1 hour ago, Free Northman Reborn said: I do believe that he is acting on personal conviction as far as his America First policies are concerned. It’s just that the Left absolutely abhors those convictions. Shouldn't we abhor racism, selfishness and bullying? 1 hour ago, Free Northman Reborn said: It is difficult to see how his policies on immigration, terrorism and other conservative positions are benefiting him commercially. They put him in office. But the question was not whether Trump's stated policies benefit him commercially. The question was whether he puts his own interests above those of the country. Whatever your policies are, if you ignore them when it's personally inconvenient, then you're putting your own interests first. Trump mouths the right words and people can't wait to forgive him for this stuff. But the facts are that Trump is absolutely corrupt. And a corrupt person can never be relied on to put their country first, by definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 10 hours ago, Frog Eater said: In the first non-war engaged country, which would be Mexico. They should all be applying for asylum in Mexico, not the United States, and should all be sent home or back to Mexico The Trump administration is driving thousands of refugees who are in the US under the terms of that treaty, the US being the first non-war engaged country they fled to, out of the US and into Canada. Why doesn’t the US take responsibility for those people admitted as refugees before they complain about people fleeing Central America? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Queen Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 10 hours ago, Frog Eater said: In the first non-war engaged country, which would be Mexico. They should all be applying for asylum in Mexico, not the United States, and should all be sent home or back to Mexico Your location says Bible Belt, USA. Where is your Christian compassion and humanity? Oh, that's right. Another fake holier-than-thou thumper who has never opened a Bible, but shows up on Sundays asking to be forgiven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Barry Whitebeard Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 1 hour ago, mormont said: What is your evidence that Trump ever had billions of dollars to lose, to begin with? Since Trump hides his tax returns (and lies about it), we can only guess at his worth. The best guesses indicate that he is worth around $3bn or $4bn, and has lost around $400m since becoming President. Probably this article, though to be fair it is down 1.4 billion since 2015 when he announced his candidacy, not when he took over the presidancy. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/02/trump-forbes-400-spot-tumbles-as-net-worth-declines.html 1 hour ago, Crazy Cat Lady in Training said: Your location says Bible Belt, USA. Where is your Christian compassion and humanity? Oh, that's right. Another fake holier-than-thou thumper who has never opened a Bible, but shows up on Sundays asking to be forgiven. If you're asking What Would Jesus Do, the answer is that he would travel to South America and minister to the poor there, not import the poor in the millions into Israel and let someone else minister to them. Though as he said himself he came to save the chosen people and not the gentiles, I'm sure he would actually spend his time ministering to the needy in his own country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Queen Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 23 minutes ago, Bold Barry Whitebeard said: If you're asking What Would Jesus Do, the answer is that he would travel to South America and minister to the poor there, not import the poor in the millions into Israel and let someone else minister to them. Though as he said himself he came to save the chosen people and not the gentiles, I'm sure he would actually spend his time ministering to the needy in his own country. As it happens, at the beginning Christ refused to preach to Gentiles and told his disciples to minister only to the "lost sheep" of Israel. Quote “Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” Matthew 10:5-6 However, he does preach to them and help them (see Matthew 15:21-28 and the story of the Canaanite woman. Quote Leaving that place, Jesus withdrew to the region of Tyre and Sidon. A Canaanite woman from that vicinity came to him, crying out, “Lord, Son of David, have mercy on me! My daughter is demon-possessed and suffering terribly.” Jesus did not answer a word. So his disciples came to him and urged him, “Send her away, for she keeps crying out after us.”He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.” The woman came and knelt before him. “Lord, help me!” she said. He replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.” “Yes it is, Lord,” she said. “Even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their master’s table.” Then Jesus said to her, “Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted.” And her daughter was healed at that moment. After the Resurrection (Matthew 28:18-20) specifically says: Quote And Jesus came and said to them, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age." In other words, Christ supposedly came for ALL people, regardless of color, nationality or faith. Peter wasn't happy about this, but we know what happened eventually. For the record, I'm an atheist so Bible study has little meaning for me. But these fake Christians who tout their love of Christ and God yadayadayada really make me angry. They're the worst hypocrites and clearly don't believe the crap they spout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Barry Whitebeard Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 4 minutes ago, Crazy Cat Lady in Training said: As it happens, at the beginning Christ refused to preach to Gentiles and told his disciples to minister only to the "lost sheep" of Israel. Matthew 10:5-6 However, he does preach to them and help them (see Matthew 15:21-28 and the story of the Canaanite woman. After the Resurrection (Matthew 28:18-20) specifically says: In other words, Christ supposedly came for ALL people, regardless of color, nationality or faith. Peter wasn't happy about this, but we know what happened eventually. For the record, I'm an atheist so Bible study has little meaning for me. But these fake Christians who tout their love of Christ and God yadayadayada really make me angry. They're the worst hypocrites and clearly don't believe the crap they spout. Thank you for making my first point for me. Jesus instructed his disciples to go out and make believers of the world, not sit at home and invite the non-believers to come to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 22 minutes ago, Bold Barry Whitebeard said: Probably this article, though to be fair it is down 1.4 billion since 2015 when he announced his candidacy, not when he took over the presidancy. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/02/trump-forbes-400-spot-tumbles-as-net-worth-declines.html Um, that article is largely the same as the one I linked above. I strongly doubt, therefore, that it's the evidence FNR is relying on. 22 minutes ago, Bold Barry Whitebeard said: If you're asking What Would Jesus Do, the answer is that he would travel to South America and minister to the poor there, not import the poor in the millions into Israel and let someone else minister to them. Though as he said himself he came to save the chosen people and not the gentiles, I'm sure he would actually spend his time ministering to the needy in his own country. There is a little parable Jesus told that directly contradicts much of this: the Good Samaritan. Remember it? The point of that parable is that when Jesus talked about 'your neighbour', he did not mean 'people just like you'. Then there's the bit about 'whatever you do for the least of these, you do for me'. Now, being an atheist who was raised in the church, I appreciate that much of the scripture has been edited and altered to reflect the messages believers of the time preferred. Still, it is the case that the modern church in most countries abhors the idea that Christians should care only about their own, or close their doors to the poor and needy. American right-wingers are different, I know: they don't balk at inventing their own facts, so inventing their own scripture is not an obstacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Barry Whitebeard Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 14 minutes ago, mormont said: Um, that article is largely the same as the one I linked above. I strongly doubt, therefore, that it's the evidence FNR is relying on. There is a little parable Jesus told that directly contradicts much of this: the Good Samaritan. Remember it? The point of that parable is that when Jesus talked about 'your neighbour', he did not mean 'people just like you'. Then there's the bit about 'whatever you do for the least of these, you do for me'. Now, being an atheist who was raised in the church, I appreciate that much of the scripture has been edited and altered to reflect the messages believers of the time preferred. Still, it is the case that the modern church in most countries abhors the idea that Christians should care only about their own, or close their doors to the poor and needy. American right-wingers are different, I know: they don't balk at inventing their own facts, so inventing their own scripture is not an obstacle. The very first paragraphs of the article I posted say clearly that President Trump's networth has declined over 1 billion dollars since entering public life. If all you are doing is making a dig at him for not releasing his tax returns, they are irrelevant because his wealth is tied up in real estate l. As for the Good Samaritan, well, it it the Church of Christ, not the Church of the Good Samaritan. You are falling into the error that Pope Leo XIII warned against over a hundred years ago of distilling Christianity down to a socialist economic message and remove spirituality from the equation. Besides that, God abhors a multicultural society. He struck down the Tower of Babel and divided the people of the world by language and nation because He knows that multiculturalism breeds moral relativity, and moral relativity kills faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liffguard Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 6 minutes ago, Bold Barry Whitebeard said: Besides that, God abhors a multicultural society. He struck down the Tower of Babel and divided the people of the world by language and nation because He knows that multiculturalism breeds moral relativity, and moral relativity kills faith. He abhors multiculturalism, so he created multiple cultures? Kind of a dick move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Barry Whitebeard Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Just now, Liffguard said: He abhors multiculturalism, so he created multiple cultures? Kind of a dick move. Yeah God has done a lot of dick moves, like when he hardened the pharoah's heart only to unleash plagues against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.