Varys' Genitals

[Legitimate_Bastard]

Did the 'certain man' who castrated Varys seek him out specifically? There is no mention of a description of the guy. But I am intrigued by the voice that answered the mans chants after he burned Varys junk in the brazier.

Quote

A Clash of Kings - Tyrion X

"Nor do I, but . . ." This pause was longer than the one before, and when Varys spoke again his voice was different somehow. "I was an orphan boy apprenticed to a traveling folly. Our master owned a fat little cog and we sailed up and down the narrow sea performing in all the Free Cities and from time to time in Oldtown and King's Landing.

"One day at Myr, a certain man came to our folly. After the performance, he made an offer for me that my master found too tempting to refuse. I was in terror. I feared the man meant to use me as I had heard men used small boys, but in truth the only part of me he had need of was my manhood. He gave me a potion that made me powerless to move or speak, yet did nothing to dull my senses. With a long hooked blade, he sliced me root and stem, chanting all the while. I watched him burn my manly parts on a brazier. The flames turned blue, and I heard a voice answer his call, though I did not understand the words they spoke.

"The mummers had sailed by the time he was done with me. Once I had served his purpose, the man had no further interest in me, so he put me out. When I asked him what I should do now, he answered that he supposed I should die. To spite him, I resolved to live. I begged, I stole, and I sold what parts of my body still remained to me. 

I am trying to think of a character who could be that 'certain man'.

We do not know how old Varys is - but could it be Bloodraven? Perhaps that would make Varys waaaay to old?

Who else is alive that we know about who could be that old, or who would have sought a means to stay young. Surely the sacrifice of genitalia would be for the lengthening of life? The only other time I remember a scene with 'voices', is when Mirri is in the tent doing her magic and it appears there are more beings in the tent than just her.

What are your thoughts?

Is this likely to come up again? Was someone trying to stop Varys from procreating? Is Varys from some line that we are unaware of? 

[Loose Bolt]

I suspect that E.T  just wanted to ring home.

[Euron III Greyjoy]

I cant see it coming up again to be honest. I think this "Certain Man" was probably just some random sorcerer, maybe he was from Asshai. Maybe this whole backstory was to show us that Varys has some special blood. We know that he was born in Lys, which just so happens to be where Aerion Brightflame was sent to exile, and we know that he fathered some children there. Maybe Varys is Brightflame's grandson. 

[John Suburbs]

1 hour ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

Did the 'certain man' who castrated Varys seek him out specifically? There is no mention of a description of the guy. But I am intrigued by the voice that answered the mans chants after he burned Varys junk in the brazier.

I am trying to think of a character who could be that 'certain man'.

We do not know how old Varys is - but could it be Bloodraven? Perhaps that would make Varys waaaay to old?

Who else is alive that we know about who could be that old, or who would have sought a means to stay young. Surely the sacrifice of genitalia would be for the lengthening of life? The only other time I remember a scene with 'voices', is when Mirri is in the tent doing her magic and it appears there are more beings in the tent than just her.

What are your thoughts?

Is this likely to come up again? Was someone trying to stop Varys from procreating? Is Varys from some line that we are unaware of? 

I think the answer may be in the quote you posted: "...when Varys spoke again, his voice was different somehow."

Ned notices this same thing in the black cells, suddenly Varys is no longer the twittering, giggling effeminate that he is at court, but his voice becomes deeper, more masculine.

So my theory is that Varys is not a eunuch at all, just another character by a master mummer who alternately appears as a be-stubbled gaolor named Rugen or a finely dressed woman. So this whole story is bunk.

[rotting sea cow]

4 hours ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

Did the 'certain man' who castrated Varys seek him out specifically? There is no mention of a description of the guy. But I am intrigued by the voice that answered the mans chants after he burned Varys junk in the brazier.

I am trying to think of a character who could be that 'certain man'.

We do not know how old Varys is - but could it be Bloodraven? Perhaps that would make Varys waaaay to old?

Who else is alive that we know about who could be that old, or who would have sought a means to stay young. Surely the sacrifice of genitalia would be for the lengthening of life? The only other time I remember a scene with 'voices', is when Mirri is in the tent doing her magic and it appears there are more beings in the tent than just her.

What are your thoughts?

Is this likely to come up again? Was someone trying to stop Varys from procreating? Is Varys from some line that we are unaware of? 

Some people have suggested that Varys has king's blood and that sorcerer recognized him. Some believe tha Varys is the son of the missing Maegor son of Aerion, others a Blackfyre descendant.

As for the identity of the wizard. I myself tend to believe he is the same man that Euron charged to hatch that dragon egg and subsequently killed because got bored.

Others believe the man was Marwyn who may also be the son of Maegor ( or not)

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

I don't know if this means anything but Ramsay Bolton's flaying knife is described as hooked: "a small curved flaying knife with a hooked point and a razor-sharp edge "

And the weirwood sacrifice was done with a hooked blade: "The woman grabbed the captive by the hair, hooked the sickle round his throat, and slashed."

I think the ritual was to the old gods, and the sorcerer was "no-one," and Varys mentions the "old powers" when he is telling the story to Tyrion.  And that fits with the blue flame and Varys hearing voices, and voices in his dreams to this day.  The 3 eyed crow comes to people named after crows--Varys means crow in finnish, Bran means crow in welsh, joj means crow in mayan, Euron crow's eye, did I miss any?  This one might be a stretch but havran means crow and corone means crow-- corone havran = Qhorin Halfhand

Check out my theory on Varys from the other day.

[Legitimate_Bastard]

55 minutes ago, rotting sea cow said:

Others believe the man was Marwyn who may also be the son of Maegor ( or not)

Daaaaaamn haven't heard that one.

 

21 minutes ago, By Odin's Beard said:

I don't know if this means anything but Ramsay Bolton's flaying knife is described as hooked: "a small curved flaying knife with a hooked point and a razor-sharp edge "

And the weirwood sacrifice was done with a hooked blade: "The woman grabbed the captive by the hair, hooked the sickle round his throat, and slashed."

I think the ritual was to the old gods, and the sorcerer was "no-one," and Varys mentions the "old powers" when he is telling the story to Tyrion.  And that fits with the blue flame and Varys hearing voices, and voices in his dreams to this day.  The 3 eyed crow comes to people named after crows--Varys means crow in finnish, Bran means crow in welsh, joj means crow in mayan, Euron crow's eye, did I miss any?  This one might be a stretch but havran means crow and corone means crow-- corone havran = Qhorin Halfhand

Check out my theory on Varys from the other day.

This is awesome stuff.

[The Mother of The Others]

8 hours ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

could it be Bloodraven? [Who cut Varys]  Or would that make Varys waaaay to old?

Awwww, that would have had so much going for it!   BloodRaven striking at the Blackfyres like a continued vendetta to prevent them from reproducing, and turning Varys so he'd be influenced by his boss the 3 Eyed Crow, the voice in the flames, so that Varys becomes another lifelong agent of the Others like Raven, hearing voices.

Also, it's rare that i just apologize in advance, but Sorry for this:

Does the voice coming out of Varys' junk qualify his penis to be one of the Talking Trees of the Summer Isles?   Like, what if the wizard then took Varys' junk and planted it in his garden and watered it, you know?   Would it resume speaking after it sprouted anew is what I'm getting at.   .....Ran?   Is it possible to get a ruling on that?

[Lord Varys]

Varys' balls and stem are in a jar on my night table.

[bent branch]

I have speculated that the man who cut Varys was Marwyn, and although I have some reasons for thinking that, it is quite a stretch.

[Lady Barbrey]

Just train of thought: the whole thing reminds me of Euron.  Port city.  Blue flame. The Undying. Torture. Psychopathic attitude towards people as tools to be used. Communicating with the unidentified him that Euron wants to be worthy of. Unknown language (Other language?).

Euron is too young I believe but if he weren't I'd be tempted to speculate about him, not Bloodraven, though I suppose most sorcerors can also fit the bill.

[Dorian Martell's son]

2 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Varys' balls and stem are in a jar on my night table.

Oooops! I thought those were pickles...... My bad 

 

[867-5309]

Magic happened that night but was it due to Varys and his balls.  I don't think we will ever know.  Lady Larra Rogare is my best guess for his ancestor.  

[zandru]

Then there's the school of thought that argues this is just a story Varys likes to tell when people get too curious; he isn't really a eunuch, but it's a great disguise and makes people both discount him and keep away from him**. Another theory, recently hammered out on this group, is that Varys is a woman.

---------

** Much like Wyman Manderly's fat, but not as unhealthful or handicapping. Varys CAN sit a horse! And get around in those "little bird"*** tunnels.

------------

*** Varys calls his child spies "little birds." This, plus the "parrot" allusion, is undoubtedly why the Hound calls Sansa "little bird." She not only parrots back all the polite words, she's also a tattletale.

[The Mother of The Others]

Could you really go around telling people you're a eunuch for five minutes before the Grand Maester would ask to see it, though?  Out of medical curiosity, of course.  An inspection would help keep things healthy, while expanding the knowledge base.   Various implements would be employed to gently prod the area and verify that Varys hadn't merely been confused about his status for the last 2 decades.    You can't ever have too much science.  And what kind of suspicious individual would refuse a kind offer like that?   Someone with something to hide.  

[Legitimate_Bastard]

1 minute ago, The Mother of The Others said:

Could you really go around telling people you're a eunuch for five minutes before the Grand Maester would ask to see it, though?  Out of medical curiosity, of course.  An inspection would help keep things healthy, while expanding the knowledge base.   Various implements would be employed to gently prod the area and verify that Varys hadn't merely been confused about his status for the last 2 decades.    You can't ever have too much science.  And what kind of suspicious individual would refuse a kind offer like that?   Someone with something to hide.  

LOL wasn't Pycelle too busy with female genitalia to worry about Varys?

[John Suburbs]

21 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

Awwww, that would have had so much going for it!   BloodRaven striking at the Blackfyres like a continued vendetta to prevent them from reproducing, and turning Varys so he'd be influenced by his boss the 3 Eyed Crow, the voice in the flames, so that Varys becomes another lifelong agent of the Others like Raven, hearing voices.

Also, it's rare that i just apologize in advance, but Sorry for this:

Does the voice coming out of Varys' junk qualify his penis to be one of the Talking Trees of the Summer Isles?   Like, what if the wizard then took Varys' junk and planted it in his garden and watered it, you know?   Would it resume speaking after it sprouted anew is what I'm getting at.   .....Ran?   Is it possible to get a ruling on that?

Maybe not Bloodraven, but perhaps Shiera Seastar, who may or may not have been Maggy the Frog?

[Clegane'sPup]

On 10/30/2018 at 10:26 AM, Legitimate_Bastard said:

Did the 'certain man' who castrated Varys seek him out specifically? There is no mention of a description of the guy. But I am intrigued by the voice that answered the mans chants after he burned Varys junk in the brazier.

TL;DR is at the bottom.

There is a valid mystery about Varys. One is the quibble about what Illyrio told Tyrion in DwD.   Keep in mind that Arya while lost or wandering in GoT overheard two men which I assume to be V & I discussing stuff.  Anyway what Illyrio tells Tyrion in DwD is:

A Dance with Dragons - Tyrion II     Just so. I grew so respectable that a cousin of the Prince of Pentos let me wed his maiden daughter, whilst whispers of a certain eunuch's talents crossed the narrow sea and reached the ears of a certain king. A very anxious king, who did not wholly trust his son, nor his wife, nor his Hand, a friend of his youth who had grown arrogant and overproud. I do believe that you know the rest of this tale, is that not so?"    "Much of it," Tyrion admitted. "I see that you are somewhat more than a cheesemonger after all."/

I assume the ^ above is about when Varys went to KL to serve Aerys, the mad king.

Backtracking to CoK,   Varys talks with Tyrion as displayed below.

A Clash of Kings - Tyrion X    "One day at Myr, a certain man came to our folly. After the performance, he made an offer for me that my master found too tempting to refuse. I was in terror. I feared the man meant to use me as I had heard men used small boys, but in truth the only part of me he had need of was my manhood. He gave me a potion that made me powerless to move or speak, yet did nothing to dull my senses. With a long hooked blade, he sliced me root and stem, chanting all the while. I watched him burn my manly parts on a brazier. The flames turned blue, and I heard a voice answer his call, though I did not understand the words they spoke./

Out of all the boys the man mentioned ^ above could have mutilated, why did he pick Varys?   Okay, its part of the backstory whether it be lie or truth. Except, there is this Marwyn guy being mentioned on and off in the books starting in GoT.

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys VII     Ser Jorah Mormont spoke up. "A maester?"    "Marwyn, he named himself," the woman replied in the Common Tongue. "From the sea. Beyond the sea. The Seven Lands, he said. Sunset Lands. Where men are iron and dragons rule. He taught me this speech."     "A maester in Asshai," Ser Jorah mused. "Tell me, Godswife, what did this Marwyn wear about his neck?"  "A chain so tight it was like to choke him, Iron Lord, with links of many metals."/

Then in SoS Qyburn drops a name.   For brevity I have been chopping the quotes -- iffin' you want full context read the chapters.

A Storm of Swords - Jaime VI    "The archmaesters did not like my thinking, though. Well, Marwyn did, but he was the only one."/

It appears that ole Marwyn and Qyburn got on well enough during their tenure at the Citadel.

Rumors about Marwyn say:

A Feast for Crows - Prologue     The Mage was not like other maesters. People said that he kept company with whores and hedge wizards, talked with hairy Ibbenese and pitch-black Summer Islanders in their own tongues, and sacrificed to queer gods at the little sailors' temples down by the wharves. Men spoke of seeing him down in the undercity, in rat pits and black brothels, consorting with mummers, singers, sellswords, even beggars. Some even whispered that once he had killed a man with his fists./

The above and below quotes makes what Mirri Maz Duur said in GoT quite plausible. It also suggests the possibility that Marwyn cut Varys.

Don't know when Marwyn started his travels nor when Marwyn ended his travels.   Nor do Iknow who Vinegar Vaellyn is.   As an aside, the posh Ironborn dude was reading Marwyn's book in an Asha chapter.    Musta took the scribes a while to write that.

A Feast for Crows - Prologue     When Marwyn had returned to Oldtown, after spending eight years in the east mapping distant lands, searching for lost books, and studying with warlocks and shadowbinders, Vinegar Vaellyn had dubbed him "Marwyn the Mage."/

I am aware that Illryio and Varys have been hatching a plot since the first book GoT.  Now, Sarella is supposedly posing as Alleras and she is in the chambers of Marwyn.  They seem right chummy.

A Feast for Crows - Samwell V   "What will you do?" asked Alleras, the Sphinx.   "Get myself to Slaver's Bay, in Aemon's place. The swan ship that delivered Slayer should serve my needs well enough. The grey sheep will send their man on a galley, I don't doubt. With fair winds I should reach her first." Marwyn glanced at Sam again, and frowned./

It would seem to me Marwyn, although a minor character is involved with a number of ASOIAF characters.

TL:DR      Marwyn cut Varys root and stem. Tis fictional fantasy --- that's why Varys didn't bleed out. The master of whisperers who brought down Keven Lannister & Pycelle.  Varys has not been found, as of yet.

I gotta wonder whether Varys' mutilation was happenstance or was Varys' junk special as the CoK Tyrion chapter suggests. No, just more frekking bs that isn't gonna be answered.

 

Edit: I'm gonna do the edit before the edit. If I didn't get the grammar correct and if I left out a word or had a duplicate word I begs ye pardon, It's just odd sometimes that I read the post once, twice, thrice then submit and read over it again and BOOM there is a glaring snafu. Glasses, I must get my prescription rechecked.   

 

 

 

 

[Lady Barbrey]

1 hour ago, Clegane'sPup said:

TL;DR is at the bottom.

There is a valid mystery about Varys. One is the quibble about what Illyrio told Tyrion in DwD.   Keep in mind that Arya while lost or wandering in GoT overheard two men which I assume to be V & I discussing stuff.  Anyway what Illyrio tells Tyrion in DwD is:

A Dance with Dragons - Tyrion II     Just so. I grew so respectable that a cousin of the Prince of Pentos let me wed his maiden daughter, whilst whispers of a certain eunuch's talents crossed the narrow sea and reached the ears of a certain king. A very anxious king, who did not wholly trust his son, nor his wife, nor his Hand, a friend of his youth who had grown arrogant and overproud. I do believe that you know the rest of this tale, is that not so?"    "Much of it," Tyrion admitted. "I see that you are somewhat more than a cheesemonger after all."/

I assume the ^ above is about when Varys went to KL to serve Aerys, the mad king.

Backtracking to CoK,   Varys talks with Tyrion as displayed below.

A Clash of Kings - Tyrion X    "One day at Myr, a certain man came to our folly. After the performance, he made an offer for me that my master found too tempting to refuse. I was in terror. I feared the man meant to use me as I had heard men used small boys, but in truth the only part of me he had need of was my manhood. He gave me a potion that made me powerless to move or speak, yet did nothing to dull my senses. With a long hooked blade, he sliced me root and stem, chanting all the while. I watched him burn my manly parts on a brazier. The flames turned blue, and I heard a voice answer his call, though I did not understand the words they spoke./

Out of all the boys the man mentioned ^ above could have mutilated, why did he pick Varys?   Okay, its part of the backstory whether it be lie or truth. Except, there is this Marwyn guy being mentioned on and off in the books starting in GoT.

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys VII     Ser Jorah Mormont spoke up. "A maester?"    "Marwyn, he named himself," the woman replied in the Common Tongue. "From the sea. Beyond the sea. The Seven Lands, he said. Sunset Lands. Where men are iron and dragons rule. He taught me this speech."     "A maester in Asshai," Ser Jorah mused. "Tell me, Godswife, what did this Marwyn wear about his neck?"  "A chain so tight it was like to choke him, Iron Lord, with links of many metals."/

Then in SoS Qyburn drops a name.   For brevity I have been chopping the quotes -- iffin' you want full context read the chapters.

A Storm of Swords - Jaime VI    "The archmaesters did not like my thinking, though. Well, Marwyn did, but he was the only one."/

It appears that ole Marwyn and Qyburn got on well enough during their tenure at the Citadel.

Rumors about Marwyn say:

A Feast for Crows - Prologue     The Mage was not like other maesters. People said that he kept company with whores and hedge wizards, talked with hairy Ibbenese and pitch-black Summer Islanders in their own tongues, and sacrificed to queer gods at the little sailors' temples down by the wharves. Men spoke of seeing him down in the undercity, in rat pits and black brothels, consorting with mummers, singers, sellswords, even beggars. Some even whispered that once he had killed a man with his fists./

The above and below quotes makes what Mirri Maz Duur said in GoT quite plausible. It also suggests the possibility that Marwyn cut Varys.

Don't know when Marwyn started his travels nor when Marwyn ended his travels.   Nor do Iknow who Vinegar Vaellyn is.   As an aside, the posh Ironborn dude was reading Marwyn's book in an Asha chapter.    Musta took the scribes a while to write that.

A Feast for Crows - Prologue     When Marwyn had returned to Oldtown, after spending eight years in the east mapping distant lands, searching for lost books, and studying with warlocks and shadowbinders, Vinegar Vaellyn had dubbed him "Marwyn the Mage."/

I am aware that Illryio and Varys have been hatching a plot since the first book GoT.  Now, Sarella is supposedly posing as Alleras and she is in the chambers of Marwyn.  They seem right chummy.

A Feast for Crows - Samwell V   "What will you do?" asked Alleras, the Sphinx.   "Get myself to Slaver's Bay, in Aemon's place. The swan ship that delivered Slayer should serve my needs well enough. The grey sheep will send their man on a galley, I don't doubt. With fair winds I should reach her first." Marwyn glanced at Sam again, and frowned./

It would seem to me Marwyn, although a minor character is involved with a number of ASOIAF characters.

TL:DR      Marwyn cut Varys root and stem. Tis fictional fantasy --- that's why Varys didn't bleed out. The master of whisperers who brought down Keven Lannister & Pycelle.  Varys has not been found, as of yet.

I gotta wonder whether Varys' mutilation was happenstance or was Varys' junk special as the CoK Tyrion chapter suggests. No, just more frekking bs that isn't gonna be answered.

 

Edit: I'm gonna do the edit before the edit. If I didn't get the grammar correct and if I left out a word or had a duplicate word I begs ye pardon, It's just odd sometimes that I read the post once, twice, thrice then submit and read over it again and BOOM there is a glaring snafu. Glasses, I must get my prescription rechecked.   

 

 

 

 

I think you've made a convincing case for Marwyn as a good possibility if it is someone we've met in the books already!

The blue fire still perplexes me.  Jaime and Brienne's swords burning blue in that sending almost seemed purity, purpose or hope.  So mixed symbols here, likely.

It is slightly telling that the fire dies not burn blue till after Varys's junk has been added.  Leaving me to wonder if the blue flame was more representative of the sorceror, the voice or Varys himself. 

Ah well, I'm going with your Marwyn theory till he shows up again.

 

 

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

1 hour ago, Clegane'sPup said:

sacrificed to queer gods at the little sailors' temples down by the wharves

Whoa, I never realized Marwyn is in the Cult of Starry Wisdom, that changes everything.

Quote

"If I tell you, they may need to kill you too." Marywn smiled a ghastly smile, the juice of the sourleaf running red between his teeth. "Who do you think killed all the dragons the last time around? Gallant dragonslayers armed with swords?" He spat. "The world the Citadel is building has no place in it for sorcery or prophecy or glass candles, much less for dragons. Ask yourself why Aemon Targaryen was allowed to waste his life upon the Wall, when by rights he should have been raised to archmaester. His blood was why. He could not be trusted. No more than I can."

Marwyn is saying that he can't be trusted because of his blood, and it sounds like he is not on board with the Citadel's plan to eradicate magic, if he is a follower of the Bloodstone Emperor, he could be very bad news.