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lavthelonewolf

TURNING POINT?? - A song of ice and fire

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i would love to know what was the turning point or transition moment for you guys in the book. like u realize this book is surely not what we expect.

a lot have said ned stark's death and even though i agree mine was totally different.

it was measter luwin's death that changed my whole perspective of this book. and i swear only GRR Martin can make a reader shed tears for a bloody castle!!

but when in bran's POV in COK, we see that winterfell was gone it was endgame for me. they find luwin dying near the heart tree and he gives instruction to osha to split the boys and take them somewhere safe. that scene made me realize what a folly everything else was.  we were more focused on the drama happening down south,the war and its game of thrones while the real threat was beyond the wall. the destruction of winterfell made me realize the importance of starks and stark blood against the others war against mankind. this was the time for men to rally around each other and unite against the cold threat and winter that was looming.. osha said as much to robb that he was marching the wrong way.but i kinda realised the importance of that too only after winterfell was gone and luwin's death. 

this death also marks the end of childhood for bran.he is no longer a kid and he should be more brave as ever to face his destiny.. sobs 

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Also for me, that was the fall of Winterfell by Ramsay - it was the very biggest surprise I had during my first reading - and following that, the disaster of the Mormont's expedition beyond the Wall. I found there the same tragic way that I had found in Silmarillion.

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I remember my first read through when Ned died - I threw the book down and screamed "FUUUUUUUUUU*********KKKKKKKK".

Blew. My. Mind.

Since then there have been mega shocks, but nothing on Ned level.

I  expect to be shocked in this way again.

Come on Winds!!

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There was no turning point.  I slowly got really interested in a few characters and had to read on to see what happens to them.  That is still the reason why I invests time and effort on this series.  I want to know what happens.  

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4 hours ago, King Aegon I Targaryen said:

When Jaime pushed Bran out of the window and crippled him. 

Yeah me too. Fantasy changed to horror.  That was the first turning point anyway. There are so many that I find myself more looking at turning points for characters. Jaime's when he turns back to go rescue Brienne at Harrenhal was spectacular!  My favorite character turning point, because most are kind of dismal where likeable characters turn towards a more ambiguous darker side instead.  I hang on in hopes they find another turning point.

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1 hour ago, Lady Barbrey said:

Jaime's when he turns back to go rescue Brienne at Harrenhal was spectacular!  My favorite character turning point, because most are kind of dismal where likeable characters turn towards a more ambiguous darker side instead.  I hang on in hopes they find another turning point.

Agreed! I always thought that Jaime saw Brienne as what he always wanted to be, the true and noble knight that Arthur Dayne  would be proud of. That by going back to rescue Brienne Jaime was symbolically and unconsciously rescuing and bringing to the service that good and honorable knight inside him that he set out to be when he first was knighted.

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Bran being pushed out the window. That brought out attempted child murder and royal insect in one moment. I definitely knew these books were “different” after that. 

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12 hours ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

I remember my first read through when Ned died - I threw the book down and screamed "FUUUUUUUUUU*********KKKKKKKK".

Blew. My. Mind.

Since then there have been mega shocks, but nothing on Ned level.

I  expect to be shocked in this way again.

Come on Winds!!

Unfortunately for me, my stupid friend had already spoiled ned’s death. So i kinda expected it all along. But i can see how shocking it could be. Gosh,when he died i decided anyone was indispensable in the novel. And his death still hurts

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11 hours ago, King Aegon I Targaryen said:

When Jaime pushed Bran out of the window and crippled him. 

Ugh,yeah i swear at that time all i wanted was a slow painful death for jaime. I hated him so. But now though, i want him to be happy as much as starks. Damn you GRRM

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11 hours ago, Hugorfonics said:

Catelyns back. I still remember where I was when I read that. I basically froze

That was a real shocker. I had to read it several times to be sure it was really CAT! 

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2 hours ago, lavthelonewolf said:

Unfortunately for me, my stupid friend had already spoiled ned’s death. So i kinda expected it all along. But i can see how shocking it could be. Gosh,when he died i decided anyone was indispensable in the novel. And his death still hurts

I think spoiling should be a crime, at least a tort LOL. You can't unring a bell ya know. Especially when people do it intentionally just to be dicks.

Edited by Legitimate_Bastard

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My most shoking moment was when Baelish threw down Lysa Tully through the Moondoor and she revealed to be Jon Arryn's murderer moven by Littlefinger. From the first pages we all questioned about Jon Arryn's death so thatrevelation was certainly one of the main turning points 

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5 hours ago, Legitimate_Bastard said:

I think spoiling should be a crime, at least a tort LOL. You can't unring a bell ya know. Especially when people do it intentionally just to be dicks.

Throw the book at em!

8 hours ago, lavthelonewolf said:

That was a real shocker. I had to read it several times to be sure it was really CAT! 

I was curious on who Stormheart was because she was mentioned a few times, but I certainly did not connect the dots. Its right after Sansa and the moon door, after realizing this character is the only hope Starks have left, and then bam!

 

The outlaws parted as she came forward, saying no word. When she lowered her hood, something tightened inside Merrett's chest, and for a moment he could not breathe. No. No, I saw her die. She was dead for a day and night before they stripped her naked and threw her body in the river. Raymund opened her throat from ear to ear. She was dead.

 

Crazy. Ned and the RW was predictable, this was not. I also feel like asoiaf was always good but not Theon adwd good

 

 

 "Go," he mumbled, through broken teeth and broken fingers, his eyes closed tight against the terrible bright light. "Please, you can have the rat, don't hurt me ..."

"Reek, " said the larger of the boys. "Your name is Reek. Remember?" He was the one with the torch. The smaller boy had the ring of iron keys. Reek?

Tears ran down his cheeks. "I remember. I do." His mouth opened and closed. "My name is Reek. It rhymes with leek." In the dark he did not need a name, so it was easy to forget. Reek, Reek, my name is Reek. He had not been born with that name. In another life he had been someone else, but here and now, his name was Reek. He remembered.

He remembered the boys as well. They were clad in matching lambs-wool doublets, silver-grey with dark blue trim. Both were squires, both were eight, and both were Walder Frey.

 

 

Crazy, changing the game so far into the story. Its one thing to take characters away but to bring them back

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23 hours ago, lavthelonewolf said:

i would love to know what was the turning point or transition moment for you guys in the book. like u realize this book is surely not what we expect.

a lot have said ned stark's death and even though i agree mine was totally different.

it was measter luwin's death that changed my whole perspective of this book. and i swear only GRR Martin can make a reader shed tears for a bloody castle!!

but when in bran's POV in COK, we see that winterfell was gone it was endgame for me. they find luwin dying near the heart tree and he gives instruction to osha to split the boys and take them somewhere safe. that scene made me realize what a folly everything else was.  we were more focused on the drama happening down south,the war and its game of thrones while the real threat was beyond the wall. the destruction of winterfell made me realize the importance of starks and stark blood against the others war against mankind. this was the time for men to rally around each other and unite against the cold threat and winter that was looming.. osha said as much to robb that he was marching the wrong way.but i kinda realised the importance of that too only after winterfell was gone and luwin's death. 

this death also marks the end of childhood for bran.he is no longer a kid and he should be more brave as ever to face his destiny.. sobs 

I still don't see Ned's death as all that shocking or unusual. Literary history is chock full over older, wiser father/teacher figures who end up dying so that the young hero can fulfill his destiny: Dante's unnamed mentor in The Divine Comedy, Abbe Faria in the Count of Monte Cristo, Robert Stadler in Atlas Shrugged and Henry Cameron in the Fountainhead, Bishop Digne in Les Mis, Merlin, Obi Wan Kenobi... All of these characters had massive face-time with the reader before they were killed off. The only difference is that we were never inside their heads POV-style.

I was about to give up on the book when I hit the chapter with Sansa's and Joffrey's unsupervised ride into the unknown countryside (which, in retrospect, is perfectly logical even though it never would have been allowed in a real medieval society). But then I hit Old Nan's story to Bran about the Others. Frankly, I had mostly forgotten about them with all the chapters about the Starks and King Robert and Dany and the rebellion, and that was when it hit me that this story was about way more than these petty houses and their petty Iron Throne.

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Ned’s execution was a statement of intent.

”Look bitches I don’t fuck around, if I’m willing to kill off the character that in any other story would be the main hero, imagine what else I’m willing to do!”

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The first Targaryen chapter got me hooked into the story.  The interaction between Princess Daenerys and her brother, the King Viserys III, made me realize this is not comfort fiction that you read casually just to pass the time.  The author went to a lot of trouble to create unique characters.  I immediately took interests in the Targaryen siblings.  The Dothraki wedding could be my favorite chapter in aGoT.

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9 hours ago, Wm Portnoy said:

The first Targaryen chapter got me hooked into the story.  The interaction between Princess Daenerys and her brother, the King Viserys III, made me realize this is not comfort fiction that you read casually just to pass the time.  The author went to a lot of trouble to create unique characters.  I immediately took interests in the Targaryen siblings.  The Dothraki wedding could be my favorite chapter in aGoT.

I agree.. the world grrm has created is so rich and he has indeed spent years years creating this world of his and its culture. When i read the first dany chapter i too was captivated by the characters and wanted to know about the dothraki,their culture,their people. 

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19 hours ago, Littlefinger's crewman said:

My most shoking moment was when Baelish threw down Lysa Tully through the Moondoor and she revealed to be Jon Arryn's murderer moven by Littlefinger. From the first pages we all questioned about Jon Arryn's death so thatrevelation was certainly one of the main turning points 

I have read a lot of thriller novels. Mediocre and great ones. So i kinda pride myself on figuring out the riddles more often than not before the big revelation. 

So i had already zeroed upon the suspect(s) and the motives for jon arryn’s murder. Never did i once think about lisa arryn thou. So it took me by surprise. And it proved two things. I was not an expert in figuring out these things as i thot i was and GRRM is an absolute master storyteller in providing us with the unexpected. 

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