The Pact of Versailles

[Brad Stark]

I wanted to post a theory.  Leaf said:

"Gone down into the earth … Into the stones, into the trees. Before the First Men came all this land that you call Westeros was home to us, yet even in those days we were few. The gods gave us long lives but not great numbers, lest we overrun the world as deer will overrun a wood where there are no wolves to hunt them. That was in the dawn of days, when our sun was rising. Now it sinks, and this is our long dwindling. The giants are almost gone as well, they who were our bane and our brothers. The great lions of the western hills have been slain, the unicorns are all but gone, the mammoths down to a few hundred. The direwolves will outlast us all, but their time will come as well. In the world that men have made, there is no room for them, or us.

Men would not be sad. Men would be wroth. Men would hate and swear a bloody vengeance. The singers sings sad songs, where men would fight and kill."

 

I was taught in grade school that "The Treaty of Versailles" was one of the causes of World War II.  Germany was treated so harshly that when Hilter offered the people hope of a way back to Germany being an important, respected and prosperous nation, he was overwhelmingly supported, even as they saw the atrocities he committed.  Lesson being that you never want to create a desperate enemy who thinks they have nothing to lose.

I can't find the SSM, but GRRM himself compared the current fighting for the Throne before the arrival of the Others to the political fighting among the French for power before the Germans invaded during World War 2.

 

Suppose men nearly conquered the Children, and forced them to sign a Pact so harsh it nearly guaranteed the end of their race.  The Children honestly agree, feeling they had no choice or would be slaughtered.  But in a thousand years they became angry with their situation, and some of them working in secret without any hurry or danger implemented a plan to wipe out all life in Westerous (or possibly even the whole world) - men, Children of the Forest, Giants, everyone.  They create the first Others, who are immune to normal weapons and can raise their slain foes as allies, control the cold, hate any creature with warm blood and are tasked with ending all life.

Men fight the Others and start losing badly, recognize the Childrens' magic, and send The Last Hero to find them and convince them not to wipe out all life, possibly even offering concessions to the Pact.  At least some of the Children agree, and start killing Others with obsidian, showing men how to do it, and forcing the Others North.  Over a thousand years, the battlefront with temporary fortifications becomes a Wall which every generation makes higher and eventually the Others are weakened enough to stop attacking the Wall and flee to the lands of Always winter.  The surviving Children are no longer angry, and see the now inevitable end of their race as being as much their own fault as the fault of Men.

This fits with the Others not necessarily being evil, as they were created to want to wipe life out.  It also explains how GRRM questions whether the Others are capable of having a culture.

[Ser Uncle P]

Just saw this now. Very good analogy. 

Maybe you should repost it in the general forum to get it discussed? 

[Lady Rhodes]

This is one of the most well-thought explanations that I have read yet.  I am going to say this verges on being true.

I still want to know, though, why the Others have returned now? I think they must have a motive, but what kind?

[Mimessa]

(Whispering: wot does SSM mean?)

[House Cambodia]

2 hours ago, Mimessa said:

(Whispering: wot does SSM mean?)

Take your pick https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SSM

I agree with the OP although I liken the scenario to The Gaia Hypothesis (that DOES have a clear wiki entry). The Treaty of Versailles analogy sees it in a very modern and political sense whereas Gaia Theory is looking at it from the perspective of millions of years. The Children - and other species mentioned in that speech by Leaf lived very long but bred very slowly to reflect the rhythms of deep nature. Human activity has thrown out the balance so severely that Planetos' existence is under threat - hence the Others are not 'evil' but the impersonal forces of nature restoring the planet's balance by wiping out its main threat. Without humans, the CotF, weirwood trees and other species can recover slowly, at a pace consummate with Planetos' post-human recovery. That's why, I kid you not, I'm on the side of the Others in this story!

[Lady Rhodes]

Something that I just recently started thinking about at the conclusion of watching the show is the Russian Revolution and reading Animal Farm. I wonder if we are going to have another parable as well - that even the most just rulers and most just causes can be corrupted. The animals really thought they were building a better world on the farm and they became more and more corrupted.

[House Cambodia]

12 minutes ago, Lady Rhodes said:

Something that I just recently started thinking about at the conclusion of watching the show is the Russian Revolution and reading Animal Farm. I wonder if we are going to have another parable as well - that even the most just rulers and most just causes can be corrupted. The animals really thought they were building a better world on the farm and they became more and more corrupted.

I think there were definitely strong echoes of Animal Farm in Dany's arc - messed up by the rushed scripting, but it will come out in the books.

[Lady Rhodes]

4 minutes ago, House Cambodia said:

I think there were definitely strong echoes of Animal Farm in Dany's arc - messed up by the rushed scripting, but it will come out in the books.

Those are my thoughts as well

[corbon]

On 5/25/2019 at 11:18 AM, Mimessa said:

(Whispering: wot does SSM mean?)

So Spake Martin. A collection of quotes from interviews, readings, Q&As etc etc over the years.
https://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/