Jump to content
SpaceChampion

Star Trek Discovery #3 [Spoilers] - It's A Wonderful Spock!

Recommended Posts

I've only seen the premier so far and then got caught up on the shorts. The scheduling is punishing show for me. I used to watch it Tuesday evening after work but now it's out on a Friday so I'm less likely to be sitting in watching TV. That and there's a ton of other shows competing and rugby

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

Still a bit all over the place this show isn’t it? I kinda like it, but there’s something so desperate about it ... “hey, you want long haired Klingons? Speaking English? You got it! And more Star Trek type plots, sure ... here’s a ‘trapped in a sphere trying to kill us’, here’s a ‘prime directive’ episode ... but you still want pace! And action, and flashing stuff! Have it all!”

I am more than happy for them to course correct, because there was so much that needed correcting from the first season.  

Personally I'd like Discovery to explode and for there to just be a whole new crew, as outside of Saru I kind of hate everyone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

I am more than happy for them to course correct, because there was so much that needed correcting from the first season.  

Personally I'd like Discovery to explode and for there to just be a whole new crew, as outside of Saru I kind of hate everyone.

If they insist on leaning on enterprise crew they should probably consider just making another show using that ship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The first season was a mess but it was a lot more ambitious than this season. This season has been okay in trying to pull the nostalgia strings, and doing some very "Trek-y" one-offs, but the fact that it's basically mediocre while also being much less ambitious feels like this thing was simply ill-starred from the get-go. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone else see this vid yet? It's a great little take on the state of Star Trek today and why it doesn't look and feel like the Trek we know and love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, King Roberts beard said:

I'd be much more interested in just having a series based on Pikes Enterprise tenure at this point.

It's probably a spin off they have planned given their obsession with making the cbs channel the star trek channel 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, red snow said:

It's probably a spin off they have planned given their obsession with making the cbs channel the star trek channel 

More than possible. Especially as Number 1 is a pretty big name as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quite enjoyed ep 4. I guess this creature that's attached to Tilly is the reason they'll give for the mycelial network being too dangerous to use in the future shows (if it's even connected to TNG, DS9, VOY etc).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I want to like this show more than I actually like it, sadly. It still feels like set-up and not very interesting in the present, but there's potential for interesting things, so I'm just waiting it out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep Episode 4 was a bore. 

How many Star Trek episodes usually involve some large floating 'organism / planet' that is desperately trying to communicate with the crew? It just seems like such an old trope. 

Honestly I don't know what it is I want this show to do now. I'm going back to the earlier comment that the best thing they can do is let everyone except Saru and Pike die and start again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Again, theoretically it was interesting but I wasn't really invested. Glad Culber is back, so tech-babble hand wave away, I don't care.

Also the huge hate boner some people have for this show is ridiculous. As the show starts we see Burnham running down the corridor - two separate podcasts mentioned how ridiculous she looks running (they also call her Mikey because, I guess it's demeaning and all the cool kids are doing it?. I saw her running and thought she had good form (cause she did - you pump those arms girl). I swear I don't seek them out, but youtube throws them at me and I watch everything else so think, well, sure - I'll see what they have to say. Then I remember why they suck. 

It's ok to hate this show, I'd just really rather it be for actual reasons and not because of it being not true Trek enough or too SJW. If you're describing with venom the way a character runs, perhaps you've crossed a line too far.

Edited by Gertrude

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say I disagree with you about Culber - it was looking like a good emotional ending to the episode, with Stamets getting closure and learning to move on, and then the techno-babble hand wave happened.

I did like Pike's callout on Ash's Section 31 comm-badge. They knew none of the viewers would realise we're not at that point in the timeline yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like Culber in that I like Stamets and didn't want him to leave or (more likely) stick around and grieve. Culber himself is meh because we haven't really spent time with him, but I didn't like what his absence was doing to Stamets. I have to agree that in the moment, realizing he couldn't follow was good and made sense. It feels like cheating to have both that moment and also figure out a way to get him back. That and this show is kind of off the rails and their course correction is pretty rough. I just want it to get to a point where the storytelling is coherent and not splashed all over the place  so whatever it takes to get there, fine, just do it soon. I also feel like they are seeding the spin offs too hard to the show's detriment - Sect 31 and Enterprise/Pike, cause that's what the Number One cameo felt like to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’m not sure if my expectations of television have changed and Star Trek was always like this, or whether this was the most ‘Doctor Who’ level of explanation we’ve ever seen. So, one of Culber’s tears dropped onto Stamets, who was ‘connected’ to the mycelial network at the time, which meant that his ‘energy’ was transferred there, and he took on some kind of mycelial form, and then May used that form to rig a mycelial transporter to deliver a flesh and blood Culber back to the regular universe. I mean .... where to start.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

I mean .... where to start.

Don't bother. It was an extra shitty and convoluted explanation so it essentially boils down to 'a wizard did it'. I've just decided to accept it and move on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/20/2019 at 9:23 AM, DaveSumm said:

I’m not sure if my expectations of television have changed and Star Trek was always like this, or whether this was the most ‘Doctor Who’ level of explanation we’ve ever seen. So, one of Culber’s tears dropped onto Stamets, who was ‘connected’ to the mycelial network at the time, which meant that his ‘energy’ was transferred there, and he took on some kind of mycelial form, and then May used that form to rig a mycelial transporter to deliver a flesh and blood Culber back to the regular universe. I mean .... where to start.

Or, what I got from it:

Stamets was existing both in normal space and mycelial space at the time. His close, both physical and emotional, connection to Culber when he died meant that Culber also existed in that super-imposed state to some extent. One which the mycelial locals could transfer to local matter due to the way they are, even when the version in normal space died. Much like any of the previous transporter malfunction episodes where a duplicate was created.

The copy could not move across the barrier (wrong type of matter), but could use the cocoon transporter due to the self-sacrifice of May.

Perfectly in line with decades of techno-babble if that is close to true.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know, I think I realized I expect more from the show than I would from any other Trek. I think it's the production value and the tone set in the first season. I expect tighter writing and more ... wow I guess. This episode was set up last time (two eps ago?) and we got the conclusion here. it still has room to grow and come back to, but the main mystery has been revealed and dealt with. I liked that a lot. I thought the Ba'ul were unnecessarily complex visually, but that's a nitpick. They looked super cool, but unless they become a bigger presence on the show, it was just extra flashy for no reason. I did like this episode, but even these (mostly) self-contained episodes feel like they should be better just because of the expectations this show wants you to have. I imagine this episode as OS or TNG and it's pretty darn good, here it's just good.

They just have so much going on. It looks like we'll see Spock nex time, and really it's about time - that's been a fail as a tease and hype tool as far as I'm concerned. It was drawn out too long for the screentime devoted to it so far. And then we have Tyler who is just hanging about doing nothing and adding nothing to the show. I get that he will probably have a bigger role at some point, but then just wait for his reintroduction a bit instead of dangling him as another potential storyline cluttering things up. Culber is back, and I'm glad we checked in on him but again, this is just a potential story plot waiting its turn. And we were introduced to Number One why again? Bring her in when she's relevant.

Mae is a storyline that isn't done, but done enough for now that I don't consider her a dangling plotline. The Red Angel is a good example of how to do a plot arc. It's there, it's driving the action, but we are getting regular (if not large) bits of information to advance that story.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Gertrude said:

You know, I think I realized I expect more from the show than I would from any other Trek. I think it's the production value and the tone set in the first season. I expect tighter writing and more ... wow I guess. This episode was set up last time (two eps ago?) and we got the conclusion here. it still has room to grow and come back to, but the main mystery has been revealed and dealt with. I liked that a lot. I thought the Ba'ul were unnecessarily complex visually, but that's a nitpick. They looked super cool, but unless they become a bigger presence on the show, it was just extra flashy for no reason. I did like this episode, but even these (mostly) self-contained episodes feel like they should be better just because of the expectations this show wants you to have. I imagine this episode as OS or TNG and it's pretty darn good, here it's just good.

They just have so much going on. It looks like we'll see Spock nex time, and really it's about time - that's been a fail as a tease and hype tool as far as I'm concerned. It was drawn out too long for the screentime devoted to it so far. And then we have Tyler who is just hanging about doing nothing and adding nothing to the show. I get that he will probably have a bigger role at some point, but then just wait for his reintroduction a bit instead of dangling him as another potential storyline cluttering things up. Culber is back, and I'm glad we checked in on him but again, this is just a potential story plot waiting its turn. And we were introduced to Number One why again? Bring her in when she's relevant.

Mae is a storyline that isn't done, but done enough for now that I don't consider her a dangling plotline. The Red Angel is a good example of how to do a plot arc. It's there, it's driving the action, but we are getting regular (if not large) bits of information to advance that story.

The first bit of this post summarises my frustration with the show's reception. People, or rather, Trek fans, aren't disappointed with the show itself but with their expectations of the show. The criticism isn't on the show's failings, but people just being generally pissed that it didn't do this thing or that things or some other random thing the way another version of the franchise would have done.

This isn't directed at you per se but at the general crapstorm that's been the reception. Nostalgia and somewhat misplaced reverence for older versions, in my very humble opinion, have been this show's biggest obstacle. I finished watching the original series for the first time not too long ago and honestly, so much of it was so problematic that I started to believe I actually watched a different show from everyone else. I've been on episode 3 of the one after the orginal series (honestly can't be bothered to check the subtitle) for literally 2+ years now and I don't see myself continuing any time soon. But Discovery, for some reason, really works for me. The Klingons are freaking stupid and I have no idea why they thought that was a good idea to begin with, but everything else has, in my opinion, not been as bad as lamented here and elsewhere. And it's quite honestly the only show I'm genuinely excited about every week. But I'm thinking that's because The Americans is over. Ugh.

Anyway, it's just been interesting observing the reception.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Kyoshi said:

The first bit of this post summarises my frustration with the show's reception. People, or rather, Trek fans, aren't disappointed with the show itself but with their expectations of the show. The criticism isn't on the show's failings, but people just being generally pissed that it didn't do this thing or that things or some other random thing the way another version of the franchise would have done.

This is partly true. I have only ever been able to enjoy Discovery when I pretend it has nothing to do with Star Trek and judge it on its own merits. I did that in Season 1 and it improved my experience. However, the show still fell down because it has some serious storytelling problems and a lack of any real likability amongst the cast. I never got angry at the show but I found watching it tiring, and was only really coming back for the flashy lights and nice views.

6 hours ago, Kyoshi said:

This isn't directed at you per se but at the general crapstorm that's been the reception. Nostalgia and somewhat misplaced reverence for older versions, in my very humble opinion, have been this show's biggest obstacle. I finished watching the original series for the first time not too long ago and honestly, so much of it was so problematic that I started to believe I actually watched a different show from everyone else.

There is a level of nostalgia around the original shows, but I don;t think it's unreasonable for Discovery to accept that it will have to build on what has come before. The show is already trying to draw on sense of nostalgia by including Pike and Spock in the show, so it can't avoid comparisons.

The original shows are a product of their time and we shouldn't be retrofitting 2019 thinking onto them. I love ToS with Kirk and Spock, because it is quite unlike anything that could be produced now, it has a sort of crazy magical surreality that Discovery can never capture, Discovery being a product of 2019 and not really pushing many edges. TNG is also a product of its time, but again it had a sense of awe and wonder about the universe that Discovery doesn't really manage at all.

Discovery is a totally decent sci-fi show, no more than that IMO. It does a servicable job of putting over plot point, engaging the viewer for an episode, but its far from great. I think its because its characters are generally so flat and uninteresting and its tone is so oppressive. I do wish they would just let off the shackles and do something crazy with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×