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What if Tywin joined Robert's Rebellion (properly)

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If Tywin had joined Robert's Rebellion before the battle of the bells. Perhaps the Westerlands forces could help the other rebels to obliterate the royal forces there.

 

Would there have been arranged a marriage between Tywin and one of the Tully sisters in the prelude to Tywin joining the rebellion? Which of the Tylly sisters would Tywin have gotten most likely? If Lysa's coupling with Petyr had been known would Tywin refuse her? How may Tywin and Eddard's reputations influence which man he marries his daughters too? Would Cersei be married to Robert Baratheon or perhaps even Jon Arryn? Would a marriage alliance be neccesary for Tywin to join the rebellion?
 

If Tywin had rebelled would the Iron Islanders prefer to attack the Westerlands instead of the Reach?

 

Would House Frey feel safer to commit themselfes to the rebel cause?

 

How would Jaime be impacted by such a divergence from canon? Assuming Tywin thought Jaime would die, would it not be likely that he would look to wed. Perhaps a internal Westerlands match or a marriage with important rebell houses.

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1 hour ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Would there have been arranged a marriage between Tywin and one of the Tully sisters in the prelude to Tywin joining the rebellion?

Tywin wasn't interested in marrying again. And anyway, the Tully sisters were closer in age to Jaime and Tyrion.

I think a marriage between Lysa and Tyrion (both 'marred' material, in a way, could have been possible. Although from the Tully's side a marriage to a Lord is a much better prize than a dwarf who isn't likely to inherit.

 

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49 minutes ago, The hairy bear said:

Tywin wasn't interested in marrying again. And anyway, the Tully sisters were closer in age to Jaime and Tyrion.

I think a marriage between Lysa and Tyrion (both 'marred' material, in a way, could have been possible. Although from the Tully's side a marriage to a Lord is a much better prize than a dwarf who isn't likely to inherit.

 

That match was proposed and spurned.

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2 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

If Tywin had joined Robert's Rebellion before the battle of the bells. Perhaps the Westerlands forces could help the other rebels to obliterate the royal forces there.

Nothing would change. He would still show up  at KL, asks Aerys to open the gates and then sacks the city. 

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1 hour ago, Valyrian Lance said:

That match was proposed and spurned.

That was back before Lysa was soiled, though. Before her pregnancy and abortion, Lysa could do much better than Tyrion. After that, it would have been an acceptable match.

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Tywin wouldn't be Tywin Lannister if he had sided with the rebellion at that early stage.  TL is a shrewd man and committing that early would have been stupid.  

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Tywin's all about getting the maximum benefit with the minimum investment, while keeping his options open as long as possible. Joining the war early costs men men, money and flexibility. 

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4 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

If Tywin had joined Robert's Rebellion before the battle of the bells. Perhaps the Westerlands forces could help the other rebels to obliterate the royal forces there.

 

Would there have been arranged a marriage between Tywin and one of the Tully sisters in the prelude to Tywin joining the rebellion? Which of the Tylly sisters would Tywin have gotten most likely? If Lysa's coupling with Petyr had been known would Tywin refuse her? How may Tywin and Eddard's reputations influence which man he marries his daughters too? Would Cersei be married to Robert Baratheon or perhaps even Jon Arryn? Would a marriage alliance be neccesary for Tywin to join the rebellion?
 

If Tywin had rebelled would the Iron Islanders prefer to attack the Westerlands instead of the Reach?

 

Would House Frey feel safer to commit themselfes to the rebel cause?

 

How would Jaime be impacted by such a divergence from canon? Assuming Tywin thought Jaime would die, would it not be likely that he would look to wed. Perhaps a internal Westerlands match or a marriage with important rebell houses.

Jaime would have been killed in the most tortured, publicly humiliating way imaginable.

Everything Tywin did was out of fear that the MK would kill Jaime. It's why he stayed neutral until the royal army was defeated, why he feigned friendship with the crown even after the Trident, why he initiated the sack (to get his men close enough to the Red Keep to get Jaime out quickly). It was all about Jaime.

So none of the other scenarios are plausible because as long as the MK held Jaime, Tywin could do nothing in defiance of him. 

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7 minutes ago, John Suburbs said:

Jaime would have been killed in the most tortured, publicly humiliating way imaginable.

Everything Tywin did was out of fear that the MK would kill Jaime. It's why he stayed neutral until the royal army was defeated, why he feigned friendship with the crown even after the Trident, why he initiated the sack (to get his men close enough to the Red Keep to get Jaime out quickly). It was all about Jaime.

So none of the other scenarios are plausible because as long as the MK held Jaime, Tywin could do nothing in defiance of him. 

Maybe Tywin could accept Jaime's death?

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3 hours ago, The hairy bear said:

Tywin wasn't interested in marrying again. And anyway, the Tully sisters were closer in age to Jaime and Tyrion.

I think a marriage between Lysa and Tyrion (both 'marred' material, in a way, could have been possible. Although from the Tully's side a marriage to a Lord is a much better prize than a dwarf who isn't likely to inherit.

 

Perhaps if Tywin had thought that he would not get Jaime back then he would marry again, seeing as Tywin does not want for Tyrion to inherit.

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55 minutes ago, The hairy bear said:

@norwaywolf123

Perhaps, but I doubt it. He'd have likely preferred for House Lannister to continue through Tommen, or even Kevan's line.

 

Tommen would not have been born at the time of Robert's Rebellion. Therefore since Tommen(Joffrey and Myrcella) had never been born and Tywin did not want Tyrion to inherit, then Kevan would have to inherit unless Tywin married again. 

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1 hour ago, Lord Lannister said:

Tywin's all about getting the maximum benefit with the minimum investment, while keeping his options open as long as possible. Joining the war early costs men men, money and flexibility. 

This and because rebellion is illegal. 

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10 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

If Tywin had joined Robert's Rebellion before the battle of the bells. Perhaps the Westerlands forces could help the other rebels to obliterate the royal forces there.

 

Would there have been arranged a marriage between Tywin and one of the Tully sisters in the prelude to Tywin joining the rebellion? Which of the Tylly sisters would Tywin have gotten most likely? If Lysa's coupling with Petyr had been known would Tywin refuse her? How may Tywin and Eddard's reputations influence which man he marries his daughters too? Would Cersei be married to Robert Baratheon or perhaps even Jon Arryn? Would a marriage alliance be neccesary for Tywin to join the rebellion?
 

If Tywin had rebelled would the Iron Islanders prefer to attack the Westerlands instead of the Reach?

 

Would House Frey feel safer to commit themselfes to the rebel cause?

 

How would Jaime be impacted by such a divergence from canon? Assuming Tywin thought Jaime would die, would it not be likely that he would look to wed. Perhaps a internal Westerlands match or a marriage with important rebell houses.

The combined forces would mean the rebellion would have been over quicker , less lords would be less willing to side vs tywin plus his family frey links woulda prob helped swing lord frey to the much larger rebellion forces.

Thex factor  question would be jamie , seeing the way the wind was blowing and knowing his fathers reaction rhaeggar prob would have moved to send him away before the mad king had him captured.

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If Tywin decided to join early he would NEED exactly what he got by not joining until the last minute and thats Cersie to marry who ever sits the Iron throne in the end whether its Rhegar or Robert or Viserys it doesnt matter as long as every lord present agrees the Queen is Cersie. 

 

To bind house Lannister to the rebels cause a wedding between Lancel and lady Lysa Tully would suffice as long as Lancel is raised to a lord of a decent status and a castle which im sure wouldnt be hard, hell Tywin has enough money he could build a new castle if he dahm well wanted to. If I was Jon Arryn id ask for a few Lannister wards(hostages) to further deter betrayal maybe Devann Lannister and a few BIG Lannisters bannermans sons marry Riverlanders and Northerners.

 

Jamie is tortured to death of course but oh well its not like Jamie is his only heir LOL...... 

 

 

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8 hours ago, John Suburbs said:

Never. Jaime is the reason for everything he did.

Agreed. If Jaime went the way of Rickard Stark Tywin would have called his banners and immediately joined the rebels. Killing Jaime would take away the only leverage Aerys had over Tywin and motivate Tywin to join the rebellion to avenge his son. Something that Aerys failed to realize at the start of the war when he killed Jon Arryn's nephew and heir instead of keeping him as a hostage.

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On 11/13/2018 at 7:59 AM, The hairy bear said:

Tywin wasn't interested in marrying again. And anyway, the Tully sisters were closer in age to Jaime and Tyrion.

I think a marriage between Lysa and Tyrion (both 'marred' material, in a way, could have been possible. Although from the Tully's side a marriage to a Lord is a much better prize than a dwarf who isn't likely to inherit.

 

I wonder how that would go.

Tywin would likely want some deal right away, such as breaking off Jaime’s Kingsguard appointment. 

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10 hours ago, Ralphis Baratheon said:

Agreed. If Jaime went the way of Rickard Stark Tywin would have called his banners and immediately joined the rebels. Killing Jaime would take away the only leverage Aerys had over Tywin and motivate Tywin to join the rebellion to avenge his son. Something that Aerys failed to realize at the start of the war when he killed Jon Arryn's nephew and heir instead of keeping him as a hostage.

Aerys killing Jons nephew was well insane and then he murdered a few innocent Vale and Riverland nobles to top it off...??? The fact Jon had some resistence to his rebellion confuses me as well since both house Arryn and Royce lost kin so two of the most powerful houses in the Vale and the lords of Gull town decide to chose team Targaryan? He didnt realise he was surrounded. 

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On 11/13/2018 at 9:16 AM, Dorian Martell's son said:

Nothing would change. He would still show up  at KL, asks Aerys to open the gates and then sacks the city. 

What that man said.

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