"various book deadlines"

[Ran]

Even so. I don't think George considers F&B v2 covering Aegon V as being problematic for his writing more D&E stories. It's the journey, not the destination.

[Lord Varys]

4 minutes ago, Ran said:

Even so. I don't think George considers F&B v2 covering Aegon V as being problematic for his writing more D&E stories. It's the journey, not the destination.

I think the book would give us a huge chunk of the journey, too, don't you think. I mean, imagine his account on Aegon V to be as thorough as the Regency material. It wouldn't be a novel, but it would be so close to a novel that the difference in depth to a grand affair Dunk & Egg novella set in that era would be marginal.

Still, perhaps I just want 700+ pages for the remaining kings of the 2nd century. I'm pretty sure if George keeps the level of depth he achieved during the Dance material - which was then continued for the Regency and Jaehaerys/Alysanne - then FaB II would have to be split into two books, anyway.

[Bael's Bastard]

Personally, I don't think finding out what is widely known/believed in Westeros about the lives and reigns of Aerys I, Maekar I, and Aegon V from Fire and Blood would in any way diminish experiencing what happened during those reigns through the eyes of Ser Duncan in Dunk and Egg books.

[Ran]

3 minutes ago, Bael's Bastard said:

Personally, I don't think finding out what is widely known/believed in Westeros about the lives and reigns of Aerys I, Maekar I, and Aegon V from Fire and Blood would in any way diminish experiencing what happened during those reigns through the eyes of Ser Duncan in Dunk and Egg books.

I agree. It certainly would be the case that a maester's account would be very different from what Dunk actually saw and understood and witnessed. 

[Lord Varys]

I'd agree, in part, for the remainder of the reign of Aerys I - and perhaps even for those chunks of Maekar's reign where Dunk didn't hang out at court - but it was Ran, I think, who told us that George said he had potential for a bunch of novels in the era of Aenys and Maegor, but wouldn't feel a particular need or drive to write them, now that he basically wrote an outline for them.

The same, I fear, could happen for Dunk & Egg. I'm not George, but if I were George and a writer I might not exactly want to write about a bunch of characters whose biography I just gave. Then I could just as well write something else entirely.

It is true that he could have Gyldayn write around key events and the like, or add a twist and another perspective to an event from Dunk's POV. But wasn't a huge part of the fun of Dunk & Egg to also not *really know* what's about to happen? Imagine you had read Yandel's take on the Second Blackfyre Rebellion before TMK. We would have immediately known how it would end - something we did not know when we read that back in the day. It is one thing to know the Targaryens will prevail, and quite another that characters will die. The Third Blackfyre Rebellion is still interesting because we have no idea how Haegon fails and how it comes to the second duel between Bloodraven and Bittersteel (and what all the other guys, especially Dunk, do) but a proper history by Gyldayn would answer most of those questions.

A Gyldayn history after Dunk & Egg could help fill in blank spots and tell us things Dunk didn't witnessed or cared about.

[Ran]

No, George didn't say he wouldn't be able to write it, just not something he was interested in doing given everything else he wants to do.

[The Grey Wolf]

I agree with @Lord Varys. If GRRM kept the Dance's level of detail from adult Aegon III to Aegon V the book would have to be split for sheer length and where better than the Great Spring Sickness?

[Lord Varys]

14 minutes ago, Ran said:

No, George didn't say he wouldn't be able to write it, just not something he was interested in doing given everything else he wants to do.

That is basically what I meant. And I can understand him there. There are other things George could continue. He has two other unfinished novels and a considerable number of aborted shorty story/novellas series he could continue.

7 minutes ago, The Grey Wolf said:

I agree with @Lord Varys. If GRRM kept the Dance's level of detail from adult Aegon III to Aegon V the book would have to be split for sheer length and where better than the Great Spring Sickness?

It would be Aegon III to Aerys II now, so more material, especially if there was a broad and detailed history on the Ninepenny Kings thing.

[The Grey Wolf]

Just now, Lord Varys said:

It would be Aegon III to Aerys II now, so more material, especially if there was a broad and detailed history on the Ninepenny Kings thing.

Which proves my point all the more.

[HexMachina]

1 hour ago, Ran said:

I agree. It certainly would be the case that a maester's account would be very different from what Dunk actually saw and understood and witnessed. 

Yep, as a good example, what could a maester say about TMK? Certainly nothing about howling at the moon that’s for sure  or about the mysterious Maynard Plumm. We wouldn’t get nearly the same perspective on the situation it would be rather brief and lacking the personal touch of D&E. I really don’t think a historical account would ruin Dunk and egg, the charm is in the details

[Adaneth]

7 hours ago, Ran said:

At yesterday's event, he seems to have decided right now that after TWoW he wants to dive right into ADoS.

The mood can change again. I'm not a writer but I make videos and I work on 3-4 projects at the same time. If I work constantly on one project alone, I get a bit tired mentally.

I need to switch between project to keep my mind fresh and creative. Unless of course, I have deadlines or I feel particularly creative and in the mood for a particular project. In that case, I continue. 

[Jussi]

http://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/2018/12/10/two-weeks-to-remember/

Quote

And most of all, my thanks go out to my fans and readers. I know you want WINDS, and I am going to give it to you… but I am delighted that you stayed with me for this one as well. Your patience and unflagging support means the world to me.

Enjoy the read. Me, I am back in my fortress of solitude, and back in Westeros. It won’t be tomorrow, and it won’t be next week, but you will get the end of A SONG OF ICE AND FIRE.

[The Bard of Banefort]

Personally, I think he could very easily break Fire and Blood into three books if he wanted to, with the second book stretching from Aegon III to Daeron II. Not all books need to be 700 pages long (although I'm sure he could write more than that on Aegon IV alone).

As much as I want TWOW, it sounds like George enjoys writing D&E and the histories more. He could probably get a bunch of those out pretty quickly. I suspect that writing ADOS will be a bit grueling, so it wouldn't surprise me if he alternates between that and some of the supplementary material in order to take some of the pressure off. A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms is arguably my favorite book, so I'm down for that :-) 

[kissdbyfire]

9 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

As much as I want TWOW, it sounds like George enjoys writing D&E and the histories more.

I am not sure he necessarily enjoys morewriting them or if it’s just that they’re that much easier to write...

9 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

He could probably get a bunch of those out pretty quickly. I suspect that writing ADOS will be a bit grueling, so it wouldn't surprise me if he alternates between that and some of the supplementary material in order to take some of the pressure off. And Knight of the Seven Kingdoms is arguably my favorite book, so I'm down for that :-) 

I am 100% invested in the main story. That said, I’ll take as much D&E as I can get my paws on.

 

[divica]

1 hour ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

Personally, I think he could very easily break Fire and Blood into three books if he wanted to, with the second book stretching from Aegon III to Daeron II. Not all books need to be 700 pages long (although I'm sure he could right more than that on Aegon IV alone).

As much as I want TWOW, it sounds like George enjoys writing D&E and the histories more. He could probably get a bunch of those out pretty quickly. I suspect that writing ADOS will be a bit grueling, so it wouldn't surprise me if he alternates between that and some of the supplementary material in order to take some of the pressure off. A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms is arguably my favorite book, so I'm down for that :-) 

I might be wrong, but I think george has several D&E stories on an "advanced stage". Besides the rumours about what event each book will focus on in AdwD and feast we had snipets of information about egg (the conversation about aemon and egg about being king and aemon dreams and bran's vision about a possible romance for duncan) that should be related to what will happen in the books. 

 

And if ADoS in really the final book as long as george kills some pov characters in winds it should be easier to write that the last books. I mean, he would have all characters in westeros and they all have a comon objective (fighting the dead). 

[The Bard of Banefort]

Speaking of multiple deadlines, this blog post definitely sends some happy vibes: http://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/2018/12/10/two-weeks-to-remember/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

[The hairy bear]

On 11/20/2018 at 11:59 PM, HelenaExMachina said:

Yep, as a good example, what could a maester say about TMK? Certainly nothing about howling at the moon that’s for sure  or about the mysterious Maynard Plumm. We wouldn’t get nearly the same perspective on the situation it would be rather brief and lacking the personal touch of D&E. I really don’t think a historical account would ruin Dunk and egg, the charm is in the details 

This is what a maester (Yandel in this case) had to say about TMK;

The conspiracy came to a head in 211 AC at the wedding tourney at Whitewalls. (...). At Whitewalls, under pretense of celebrating Lord Butterwell’s marriage and competing in the tournament, many lords and knights had gathered, all of whom shared a desire to place a Blackfyre on the throne. Were it not for the fact that Bloodraven had informants among the conspirators, Daemon the Younger could have launched a troubling rebellion from within the heart of the riverlands, but even before the tourney had concluded, the Hand turned up outside Whitewalls with a host of his own, and the Second Blackfyre Rebellion ended before it could truly be said to have begun. Gormon Peake was among the conspirators executed in the wake of the thwarted rebellion, while others such as Lord Butterwell suffered the loss of land and seats. As for Daemon, he lived on for several more years, a hostage in the Red Keep.

If I had read this before reading TMK, my personal enjoyment of the novella would have been significantly inferior. All the initial suspicions about what's going on in the wedding and the identity of the Fiddler would have been revealed in advance. I remember feeling particularly satisfied with myself when I correctly predicted both. We'd also knew that the attempted rebellion would end in total failure, and the fates of Daemon and Lord Gormon.

And Glyndayn is far more detailed than Yandel.

So, as much as I enjoyed F&B, I wouldn't like the second part to come before the Dunk and Egg saga is completed.

[Bael's Bastard]

That's a bad example, as there isn't likely to be a repeat of a mystery Blackfyre (which you apparently didn't fall for anyways, so it's weird you think it would have lessened your enjoyment) in future rebellions. And we all know the Blackfyre rebellions all failed, so....

[Ran]

I don't think we should assume that "The Mystery Knight" is the only one of the planned D&E stories that depend on some aspect of a mystery or a plot that needs to be unraveled. For example, we don't know why Pennytree is a royal fief. One can expect that the reasons for that would be a D&E story. But F&Bv2 could just up and say why that happened, and maybe it has to do with some Blackfyre Rebellion or some plot against Aegon V or something else we've no idea about. 

 

Now, personally, for me it's the journey rather than the destination that matters. But by revealing plot points as history, any plot depending on a sense of mystery or hidden motives will be less appealing to read for those who want to puzzle it out for themselves, and they may even be less appealing to write for GRRM because of the fact that he "spoiled" them, in a sense.

[Bael's Bastard]

41 minutes ago, Ran said:

I don't think we should assume that "The Mystery Knight" is the only one of the planned D&E stories that depend on some aspect of a mystery or a plot that needs to be unraveled. For example, we don't know why Pennytree is a royal fief. One can expect that the reasons for that would be a D&E story. But F&Bv2 could just up and say why that happened, and maybe it has to do with some Blackfyre Rebellion or some plot against Aegon V or something else we've no idea about. 

 

Now, personally, for me it's the journey rather than the destination that matters. But by revealing plot points as history, any plot depending on a sense of mystery or hidden motives will be less appealing to read for those who want to puzzle it out for themselves, and they may even be less appealing to write for GRRM because of the fact that he "spoiled" them, in a sense.

I am sure the stories will all have their mysteries or twists and turns, I just don't see another Blackfyre pretender hiding under a false identity, though I think a Blackfyre daughter coming into a story under another identity could work .

But even still, many of us take for granted that Lyanna is the Knight of the Laughing Tree, and I don't think that diminishes our anticipation to see how it plays out, or will diminish our enjoyment when it does.

I don't think even a relatively in-depth maester's overview of something like Haegon's rebellion would diminish the things he couldn't possibly convey, which we would experience from Dunk's POV.

We've seen Bittersteel discussed, but no discussion of Bittersteel can match experiencing Bittersteel through one of our beloved character's POVs, or experiencing first hand Bloodraven's feelings for/against Bittersteel.

We've witnessed Aerion being a childish prick to his family and his brother's friend, and have had his cruelty and capriciousness demonstrated and described to us, but we could very well witness an Aerion that is a very competent knight, who is capable of contributing to keeping Daeron's line of Targaryens on the throne against the Blackfyre threat.

And there are various other things we can expect or hope to see from a Dunk and Egg set during the Third Blackfyre Rebellion that, no matter how described in detail by a maester, can't compare to the experience through the eyes of Dunk.

I can understand that detailing it can take away some of the mystery, and perhaps some of the desire of GRRM to write it, but I still think Fire and Blood can do a pretty good job of describing things without taking the emotional impact out of it for us readers. Summerhall is definitely one I'd like to experience in Dunk and Egg before experiencing it in Fire and Blood, but I still think we could find out a good deal of what occurred without it making the experiencing through Dunk's eyes any less emotional and important.