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The Citadel


Lady Rhodes

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19 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

At work at the mo, can't look ot up now. It's said somewhere in the books... ASoS maybe? 

I am nearly sure it isn t. I could swear that some theories about the dornish plan include oberin possibly being a part of the brave companions in the past

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11 hours ago, divica said:

My great problem with this theory is that euron shouldn t be able to conquer old town. I don t remember the exact number of men in old town, but at the moment it has a huge army there.

He shouldn't be able to under normal circumstances, but he has magic now. And he doesn't seem to want to conquer yet. He is waiting for dragons. As of the damphair chapter he seems to be content with smashing the redwyne fleet sailing around Dorne.

11 hours ago, divica said:

So either all soldiers go into the boats and die or as long as they have 5K defending old town it should hold (I am assuming that euron has between 15-20K and that 1 man defending a Wall is equal to 3/4 attacking). And with the redwine fleet returning there is no reason to send all the men in the new fleet they are building. 

Euron has been extremely successful. The Redwynes have lost their lands to the reavers so they will send everything they can to take the islands back. I am curious where you are getting your troop numbers. I seem to remember that Garlan Tyrell had to to and raise levies in the reach to defend oldtown but we are not told if he was successful. 

12 hours ago, divica said:

So what if all the mess euron is creating near old town is only a distraction? Because no matter how fierce euron is not even Aegon the conqueror who had dragons dared to destroy oldtown. 

What is it a distraction from? Secret identity fan fic aside, why would he go through all that trouble to sack the arbor and the shield islands as a distraction? We are shown his ruthlessness. We are shown his cruelty. Aegon was a builder. Euron is a destroyer. Damphair's visions show that.

12 hours ago, divica said:

So what if the FM in the citadel is still working for euron in exchange for the dragon egg and euron is just providing the oportunity for him to do his job and staying nearby in order to contact the FM as fast as possible once the job is done?

The Dragon egg was a king's ransom to pay for the killing of King balon. Besides. Jaqen already took pate's face, got the key he wanted from pate and is already inside the citadel moving freely. Why would he need a distraction? 

12 hours ago, divica said:

And also equally interesting. Will we have sam contacting people using a glass candle? for example sending jon information via a candle?

That is a possibility, but I doubt it, as the only man in westeros who knows how to use it is getting on a boat for slaver's bay. But anything is possible. It is a fantasy novel after all

12 hours ago, divica said:

Also, if oldtown is going to be destroyed I would say it may be more credible if obara does it from inside with the help of the brave companions with some clever plot (if oberin was part of the company when he was in essos maybe obara was the one that called them to oldtown).

Please, try to forget anything that preston jacobs rants about. 

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17 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

He shouldn't be able to under normal circumstances, but he has magic now. And he doesn't seem to want to conquer yet. He is waiting for dragons. As of the damphair chapter he seems to be content with smashing the redwyne fleet sailing around Dorne.

We don t really know what magical abilities euron has. It is kind of hard to talk about how usefull they would be in the battle against oldtown. However euron won t be waiting for dragons… First, the dragons are months away from where he is so it would be weird for him to stay put so long. Second, I think Euron knows that if victarion claims a dragon he would use it to kill him and if the horn doesn t work then no dragon is coming to euron. 

So if you want to speculate what euron will do if he doesn t want to attack oldtown I think his best target is the westerlands. The lannister army is basically spent and they will be more preocupied with Aegon than their lands...

 

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18 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

Euron has been extremely successful. The Redwynes have lost their lands to the reavers so they will send everything they can to take the islands back. I am curious where you are getting your troop numbers. I seem to remember that Garlan Tyrell had to to and raise levies in the reach to defend oldtown but we are not told if he was successful. 

While I agree that the redwynes will be attacking euron with everything they have the people in oldtown aren t the redwynes… And my numbers come from remembering Reading somewhere that euron started with 20 to 30K iron islanders and then that there was an army in oldtown, it is the house of the hightowers (a powerfull familly in the reach) and that the guy in charge of the defense wanted to build boats to attack euron (this is what I remember). So there must be several thousand men defending oldtown besides the people that live there that can be used in case of emergency.

25 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

What is it a distraction from? Secret identity fan fic aside, why would he go through all that trouble to sack the arbor and the shield islands as a distraction? We are shown his ruthlessness. We are shown his cruelty. Aegon was a builder. Euron is a destroyer. Damphair's visions show that.

It can be a distraction from several things. We don t know what the fm wants to do in the citadel. We don t know if he will need a distraction to escape from there… Don t Forget that the fm aren t perfect. We have seen one of them in KL prison ( if you don t buy crazy fanfics then you must admit he was sent to prison because of a mistake).

Besides, euron clearly wants to attract the redwyne fleet and destroy it. The only question is what he will do about oldtown afterwards.

32 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

The Dragon egg was a king's ransom to pay for the killing of King balon. Besides. Jaqen already took pate's face, got the key he wanted from pate and is already inside the citadel moving freely. Why would he need a distraction? 

How do you know that killing balon cost a dragon egg? As far as we know the egg might have paid for several jobs from the FM. No ofense, but we are told that a egg can be used to buy an army so wouldn t euron be better served buying an army with the egg and plotting balon's death another way? If euron does have magic and with his loots he should be able to find another way to kill balon… And he would have an extra army!

And as I already said above, the distraction is so that the fm can escape.

39 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

That is a possibility, but I doubt it, as the only man in westeros who knows how to use it is getting on a boat for slaver's bay. But anything is possible. It is a fantasy novel after all

Please, try to forget anything that preston jacobs rants about. 

The dude must have learned it from somewhere or left notes about how to use the candles. There is nothing stoping sam from finding them… The candles just seem like a perfect way to send mensages and sam seems like a guy that will discover 1 or 2 secrets that might be too dangerous to write in a letter...

And I am pretty sure I have read that oberin might have been part of the brave companions in several places. And the part about obara wanting to destroy oldtown and some brave companions going there is in the text (I just read it in the fire and ice wiki trying to remeber info about what is happening in oldtown).

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16 minutes ago, divica said:

We don t really know what magical abilities euron has. It is kind of hard to talk about how usefull they would be in the battle against oldtown.

We do. We get a few characters who drink the shade and we see what it does.

17 minutes ago, divica said:

However euron won t be waiting for dragons… First, the dragons are months away from where he is so it would be weird for him to stay put so long. Second, I think Euron knows that if victarion claims a dragon he would use it to kill him and if the horn doesn t work then no dragon is coming to euron. 

Euron is moving deliberately. He took the shields. He took the Arbor and he is waiting to smash the fleet. Once he does that he can raid with impunity wherever he wants. It will also give him time to wait for his brother. 

23 minutes ago, divica said:

So if you want to speculate what euron will do if he doesn t want to attack oldtown I think his best target is the westerlands. The lannister army is basically spent and they will be more preocupied with Aegon than their lands...

I thought he bypassed the westerlands due to his previous defeat there. I also think the (f)Aegon landing will open up the possibility of a direct assault on Oldtown. 

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3 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

We do. We get a few characters who drink the shade and we see what it does.

Euron is moving deliberately. He took the shields. He took the Arbor and he is waiting to smash the fleet. Once he does that he can raid with impunity wherever he wants. It will also give him time to wait for his brother. 

I thought he bypassed the westerlands due to his previous defeat there. I also think the (f)Aegon landing will open up the possibility of a direct assault on Oldtown. 

The shade of the evening gives visions. It isn t related to his powers. And inside those visions besides some kraken simbolism that can either mean he will use a kraken or be involved in several events (therefore the tentacles) we only know that he will somehow seat on the IT. So far the magical abilities we have seen is euron possibly sumoning favorable winds.

I think he bypassed the westerlands because he wanted to atract the redwyne fleet. what better way to do it than attacking those islands in the reach?

And I completly agree. After the fleet is destroyed he can raid however he wants. however raiding someplace like oldtown that has so many people seems rather dificult. If he wants riches the westerlands at the moment sound much better. Who will even defend them?

 

On the other hand I completly disagree about faegon opening up the possibility of attacking oldtown. People already know about the danger and it is a place too important in westeros to not be defended. So if the locals can t handle euron I think it is even possible that fAegon will go to oldtown and defend it in order to be seen as a hero of the people and the faith. In adition, if marg is found guilty then the tyrells will return to the reach and it becomes defensable once again.

So the longer euron remains near oldtown the less chances he has of conquering it. However if he decides to raid the westerlands nobody will be interested in him besides the lannistes that are spread and spent.

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4 hours ago, divica said:

I am nearly sure it isn t. I could swear that some theories about the dornish plan include oberin possibly being a part of the brave companions in the past

ASOS, Tyrion V

Oberyn Nymeros Martell, Tyrion muttered under his breath as he fell in beside the man. The Red Viper of Dorne. And what in the seven hells am I supposed to do with him?
He knew the man only by reputation, to be sure . . . but the reputation was fearsome. 

<snip>

“That was many years ago, to be sure. The boy of sixteen was a man past forty now, and his legend had grown a deal darker. He had traveled in the Free Cities, leaming the poisoner’s trade and perhaps arts darker still, if rumors could be believed. He had studied at the Citadel, going so far as to forge six links of a maester’s chain before he grew bored. He had soldiered in the Disputed Lands across the narrow sea, riding with the Second Sons for a time before forming his own company.”

 

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3 hours ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

There is nothing to disagree on. You wrote about an idea. I pointed out some holes in said idea. That is how this online discussion works

 

You are completely correct that online discussion is for discussing ideas and you are correct that there is evidence to the contrary to my ideas. However, there are hints that Euron is working with the FM and there are hints that he is after something beyond conquering. You don’t have to agree but to be outright dismissive  is not discussion either. 

@divica I don’t think he formed the Brave companions but I would be interested in this

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14 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

@divica, Oberyn was never w/ the Brave Companions but w/ the Second Sons. Do the Brave Companions even exist anymore?

The BCs exist in small splinter groups and are trying to find ship back to Essos (hence those Brienne kills at the whispers). Iirc those last headed to Oldtown were Zollo and Faithful Urswyck, But could be mistaken

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The idea as i remember it was the brave companions were sown by Dorne on the sly as a seed of anarchy, to do such horrible things and the people would associate them with the crown and lose faith in the crown and be more likely to turn their coats when Dorne made its big push to overturn the Lannisters.  I found it kinda credible in terms of how it fit the facts and explained the inexplicable Companions.

 

Euron's master stroke is coming, people.    We've seen the Oldtown dock patrol has a challenging job.   And why would Euron 'smash' all the redwyne fleet when keeping its ships intact as much as possible could be what gets him in the citadel harbour.   It'll be something like that, a back door unconventional victory that should be impossible.    He dreams larger than being a reaver, remember.  He wants it all.   So the reavings are a distraction to set up larger prizes.   Hitting the coast and surviving isn't what he considers victory.   His moves are all about the opponent's reaction, not about the apparent gains.  It's a game of whackamole to get the continent imbalanced and swinging wildly, so he can step in, onto land, and shove the big name lords over.  

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11 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

anarchy, to do such horrible things and the people would associate them with the crown and lose faith in the crown and be more likely to turn their coats when Dorne made its big push

I could see this as being plausible, and it fits Doran's MO of doing something that doesn't out right come back to him.

 

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On 12/5/2018 at 11:06 PM, Lady Rhodes said:

1. Euron is Urrathon Night-Walker, who has a house in Qarth.

:agree:

Also, probably, he's a parallel to this Urrathon

https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Urrathon_IV_Goodbrother

Could be, that GRRM has already revealed to us, what will happen with Euron - same as in case of Urrathon, there's one son of the previous King - Torgon, who was not present during kingsmoot, in Euron's case that will be Theon.

Though I think, that the reason why FM-Pate and Euron are interested in the Citadel, is not because of glass candles. I think, they both are looking there for documents about Jon's birth. Maybe, when Lyanna was giving birth to Rhaegar's baby, the maester from Dragonstone was present there, and that maester was Marwyn. So in Citadel there should be something like Jon's birth certificate, or documents about Rhaegar's and Lyanna's marriage. Because, if Rhaegar, prior going to Trident, has arrived to KL from the south, then it's possible, that while him and Lyanna were there, they got married in the Starry Sept, and thus, there's a record of that wedding ceremony, hidden somewhere in the Citadel.

I think, that Quaithe is Shiera Seastar, and the Three-Eyed Crow, and maester Marwyn, Mirri Maz Duur, and Euron Greyjoy are Shiera's ex-disciples. But Euron possibly has betrayed her. His nickname is Crow's eye, because he is Three-Eyed Crow's spy, and she's able to see, what he sees with his left black eye, because she has magically enhanced it (thru blood magic). So he's covering it, to prevent her from spying after him.

Or he didn't betrayed her, and thus all the evil that he does, he does with Shiera's blessing, thus she's also evil.

This is from TWOW, fragments of two dreams, seen by Aeron, after he drunk the-shade-of-the-evening:

Spoiler

When he laughed, his face sloughed off, and the priest saw that it was not Urri but Euron, the smiling eye hidden. He showed the world his blood eye now, dark and terrible. Clad head to heel in scale as dark as onyx, he sat upon a mound of blackened skulls as dwarfs capered around his feet and a forest burned behind him.  

“The bleeding star bespoke the end,” he said to Aeron. “These are the last days, when the world shall be broken and remade. A new god shall be born from the graves and charnel pits.”

Then Euron lifted a great horn to his lips and blew, and dragons and krakens and sphinxes came at his command and bowed before him.

~

The dreams were even worse the second time. He saw the longships of the Ironborn adrift and burning on a boiling blood­-red sea. He saw his brother on the Iron Throne again, but Euron was no longer human. He seemed more squid than man, a monster fathered by a kraken of the deep, his face a mass of writhing tentacles. Beside him stood a shadow in woman’s form, long and tall and terrible, her hands alive with pale white fire. Dwarves capered for their amusement, male and female, naked and misshapen, locked in carnal embrace, biting and tearing at each other as Euron and his mate laughed and laughed and laughed...

I think, that in the second dream, a shadow in a woman's form near Euron, is Shiera with a glass candle. And that a new god, that shall be born from the graves and charnel pits, is either Jon Snow, or Dany's son Rhaego. In the first dream, Euron's black eye is described as "blood" eye, even though it's black, and not red. So why is it a bloody eye? Maybe, because it was "created" thru blood magic? Shiera Seastar was a user of blood magic, Egg said so in one of Dunk&Egg novels - that she was bathing in blood.

If Quaithe/Shiera used to be Euron's teacher (or still is), then it explains, why he's so interested in magical artifacts, and from where did he took that Valyrian steel armor - it's a present from Shiera (or he stole it from her).

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4 hours ago, Megorova said:

:agree:

Also, probably, he's a parallel to this Urrathon

https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Urrathon_IV_Goodbrother

Could be, that GRRM has already revealed to us, what will happen with Euron - same as in case of Urrathon, there's one son of the previous King - Torgon, who was not present during kingsmoot, in Euron's case that will be Theon.

Though I think, that the reason why FM-Pate and Euron are interested in the Citadel, is not because of glass candles. I think, they both are looking there for documents about Jon's birth. Maybe, when Lyanna was giving birth to Rhaegar's baby, the maester from Dragonstone was present there, and that maester was Marwyn. So in Citadel there should be something like Jon's birth certificate, or documents about Rhaegar's and Lyanna's marriage. Because, if Rhaegar, prior going to Trident, has arrived to KL from the south, then it's possible, that while him and Lyanna were there, they got married in the Starry Sept, and thus, there's a record of that wedding ceremony, hidden somewhere in the Citadel.

I think, that Quaithe is Shiera Seastar, and the Three-Eyed Crow, and maester Marwyn, Mirri Maz Duur, and Euron Greyjoy are Shiera's ex-disciples. But Euron possibly has betrayed her. His nickname is Crow's eye, because he is Three-Eyed Crow's spy, and she's able to see, what he sees with his left black eye, because she has magically enhanced it (thru blood magic). So he's covering it, to prevent her from spying after him.

Or he didn't betrayed her, and thus all the evil that he does, he does with Shiera's blessing, thus she's also evil.

This is from TWOW, fragments of two dreams, seen by Aeron, after he drunk the-shade-of-the-evening:

  Hide contents

When he laughed, his face sloughed off, and the priest saw that it was not Urri but Euron, the smiling eye hidden. He showed the world his blood eye now, dark and terrible. Clad head to heel in scale as dark as onyx, he sat upon a mound of blackened skulls as dwarfs capered around his feet and a forest burned behind him.  

“The bleeding star bespoke the end,” he said to Aeron. “These are the last days, when the world shall be broken and remade. A new god shall be born from the graves and charnel pits.”

Then Euron lifted a great horn to his lips and blew, and dragons and krakens and sphinxes came at his command and bowed before him.

~

The dreams were even worse the second time. He saw the longships of the Ironborn adrift and burning on a boiling blood­-red sea. He saw his brother on the Iron Throne again, but Euron was no longer human. He seemed more squid than man, a monster fathered by a kraken of the deep, his face a mass of writhing tentacles. Beside him stood a shadow in woman’s form, long and tall and terrible, her hands alive with pale white fire. Dwarves capered for their amusement, male and female, naked and misshapen, locked in carnal embrace, biting and tearing at each other as Euron and his mate laughed and laughed and laughed...

I think, that in the second dream, a shadow in a woman's form near Euron, is Shiera with a glass candle. And that a new god, that shall be born from the graves and charnel pits, is either Jon Snow, or Dany's son Rhaego. In the first dream, Euron's black eye is described as "blood" eye, even though it's black, and not red. So why is it a bloody eye? Maybe, because it was "created" thru blood magic? Shiera Seastar was a user of blood magic, Egg said so in one of Dunk&Egg novels - that she was bathing in blood.

If Quaithe/Shiera used to be Euron's teacher (or still is), then it explains, why he's so interested in magical artifacts, and from where did he took that Valyrian steel armor - it's a present from Shiera (or he stole it from her).

I agree with most of this. I think quaithe is involved as well as well as the three eyes crow. I couldn’t figure out how to parse it all together but this seems right to me. My only change is that I think they are working for the Great Other/Night King/night’s king/whatever the leader of the Others is called and he is the new god. Euron wants to be the new god though, so he is kinda double crossing them, if that makes sense.

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On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

While I agree that the redwynes will be attacking euron with everything they have the people in oldtown aren t the redwynes… And my numbers come from remembering Reading somewhere that euron started with 20 to 30K iron islanders and then that there was an army in oldtown, it is the house of the hightowers (a powerfull familly in the reach) and that the guy in charge of the defense wanted to build boats to attack euron (this is what I remember). So there must be several thousand men defending oldtown besides the people that live there that can be used in case of emergency.

I got the impression that most of the fighting men from the reach are in the armies split between Mace and lord Tarly, leaving very few home. 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

It can be a distraction from several things. We don t know what the fm wants to do in the citadel. We don t know if he will need a distraction to escape from there… Don t Forget that the fm aren t perfect. We have seen one of them in KL prison ( if you don t buy crazy fanfics then you must admit he was sent to prison because of a mistake).

  Why would a man who can change his face at will need a distraction as large as a siege to escape from a place that does not suspect anything. As far as anyone knows, he is pate, like the pig boy. He has a master key that he bought for a gold dragon and access to whatever he is looking for. 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

Besides, euron clearly wants to attract the redwyne fleet and destroy it. The only question is what he will do about oldtown afterwards.

Agreed

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

How do you know that killing balon cost a dragon egg? 

It is said that a dragon's egg is worth enough to let you live your life like a king. Balon was a minor king. Euron claimed he threw it into the sea. It is a bit circumspect but it makes sense considering he hired a FM to kill his brother. He can't admit to it, as kinslaying is a major taboo in westeros and especially with the IB. Vic killed his wife over being dishonored by Euron rather than killing Euron himself. 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

As far as we know the egg might have paid for several jobs from the FM. No ofense, but we are told that a egg can be used to buy an army so wouldn t euron be better served buying an army with the egg and plotting balon's death another way? If euron does have magic and with his loots he should be able to find another way to kill balon… And he would have an extra army!

We have it in text that he hired a faceless man to kill Balon. The ghost of high heart tells the brotherhood and therefore, the readers. Now you  are correct about him buying an army. He did so, at the kingsmoot, with riches and a dragon horn. He does not need to buy another. 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

And as I already said above, the distraction is so that the fm can escape.

This does not make sense considering what the FM is doing. 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

The dude must have learned it from somewhere or left notes about how to use the candles.

He learned it traveling the world learning the magics of different people. He has been to asshai by the shadow, he also knew Mirri Maz Durr and she taught him magic and he taught her anatomy. And he may not leave notes considering the anti-magic sentiment at the citadel as per his conversation about Aemon. 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

The candles just seem like a perfect way to send mensages and sam seems like a guy that will discover 1 or 2 secrets that might be too dangerous to write in a letter...

POV characters rarely get their Chekovs gun. 5 books in and we have only seen dawn in a flashback 

On 12/9/2018 at 12:42 PM, divica said:

And I am pretty sure I have read that oberin might have been part of the brave companions in several places. And the part about obara wanting to destroy oldtown and some brave companions going there is in the text (I just read it in the fire and ice wiki trying to remeber info about what is happening in oldtown).

That is all PJ, master of fan fic. He might as well be writing his own story. All he needs to learn to do is create his own characters 

On 12/9/2018 at 1:00 PM, divica said:

The shade of the evening gives visions. It isn t related to his powers. And inside those visions besides some kraken simbolism that can either mean he will use a kraken or be involved in several events (therefore the tentacles) we only know that he will somehow seat on the IT. So far the magical abilities we have seen is euron possibly sumoning favorable winds.

The shade is his only power, unless you count evil, cruelty and ruthlessness as powers. The shade gives him visions, and he can easily use them to see when the winds are favorable.

On 12/9/2018 at 1:00 PM, divica said:

.I think he bypassed the westerlands because he wanted to atract the redwyne fleet. what better way to do it than attacking those islands in the reach?

Agreed

On 12/9/2018 at 1:00 PM, divica said:

And I completly agree. After the fleet is destroyed he can raid however he wants. however raiding someplace like oldtown that has so many people seems rather dificult. If he wants riches the westerlands at the moment sound much better. Who will even defend them?

He already has riches though. He spent his exile reaving. We saw some of it at the kingsmoot. He wants to conquer and destroy. 

On 12/9/2018 at 1:00 PM, divica said:

On the other hand I completly disagree about faegon opening up the possibility of attacking oldtown. People already know about the danger and it is a place too important in westeros to not be defended. So if the locals can t handle euron I think it is even possible that fAegon will go to oldtown and defend it in order to be seen as a hero of the people and the faith. In adition, if marg is found guilty then the tyrells will return to the reach and it becomes defensable once again.

As of the end of dance, both Reacher armies are in king's landing and the lannister army is in the riverlands.  The hand of the king expects the Redwyne fleet to smash the Ironborn. We know that JuanCon and (f)Aegon take storm's end and either Mace or Tarly march to meet them.  That leaves the reach with whatever troops that Garlan can muster. Oldtown is vulnerable. 

On 12/9/2018 at 1:00 PM, divica said:

So the longer euron remains near oldtown the less chances he has of conquering it. However if he decides to raid the westerlands nobody will be interested in him besides the lannistes that are spread and spent.

 He won't go to the west. After he smashes the fleet, Cersei will probably reach out to him. We  know that she is in charge again after Kevan is killed. 

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On 12/9/2018 at 3:37 PM, Lady Rhodes said:

You are completely correct that online discussion is for discussing ideas and you are correct that there is evidence to the contrary to my ideas. However, there are hints that Euron is working with the FM and there are hints that he is after something beyond conquering. You don’t have to agree but to be outright dismissive  is not discussion either. 

@divica I don’t think he formed the Brave companions but I would be interested in this

We are told he hired a faceless man to kill his brother. And yes, he not only wants to conquer, he also wants to destroy 

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14 hours ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

I got the impression that most of the fighting men from the reach are in the armies split between Mace and lord Tarly, leaving very few home. 

Mace took half the forces to the siege of Storm's End and the other half left with Garlan, Olenna and Alerie. After he dropped off his mother and nana, he was going to head to Brightwater Keep with those same men to try and claim his new seat. When the Shields are attacked, Margaery does say that the better part of their power is with Mace. 

Margaery says that Willas and Garlan can raise 10K men within a fortnight and double that within a month. 

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On 12/11/2018 at 10:22 AM, Alexis-something-Rose said:

Mace took half the forces to the siege of Storm's End and the other half left with Garlan, Olenna and Alerie. After he dropped off his mother and nana, he was going to head to Brightwater Keep with those same men to try and claim his new seat. When the Shields are attacked, Margaery does say that the better part of their power is with Mace. 

Margaery says that Willas and Garlan can raise 10K men within a fortnight and double that within a month. 

Don't forget Lord Tarly's army still in the capital 

 

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