DMC Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 I think this Mueller conversation can often fall into a binary debate that misses the forest for the trees. While Mueller's findings will not cause removal from office alone, no, they could certainly impact Trump's approval - through what is revealed, how Trump responds to it, how House investigations respond, etc. And if Trump's approval gets and stays into the 30s by election day, it's very unlikely he wins. Probably even more unlikely than the general possibility that Trump gets impeached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMC Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 10 minutes ago, Triskele said: and now other readers might think I'm just a casual Dane-slanderer. You're the most Dane-slandering monkey I've ever come across. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGP Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Texas court ends Obamacare... [low whistle] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMC Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 1 minute ago, JEORDHl said: Texas court ends Obamacare The opinion sounds like a huge middle finger to Roberts' ruling, so I doubt he'll uphold it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted December 15, 2018 Author Share Posted December 15, 2018 24 minutes ago, JEORDHl said: Texas court ends Obamacare... [low whistle] I hate this fucking country so very much sometimes. I had a whole year when I didn't have to worry about my son losing his coverage for cancer. Fuck that judge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted December 15, 2018 Author Share Posted December 15, 2018 27 minutes ago, DMC said: The opinion sounds like a huge middle finger to Roberts' ruling, so I doubt he'll uphold it. You assume that his ruling was in good faith. In a stupid way his ruling set up cover for this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGP Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Kalbear said: I hate this fucking country so very much sometimes. I had a whole year when I didn't have to worry about my son losing his coverage for cancer. Fuck that judge. Even if DMC is right, it's a hell of a thing to cause this kind of fear and stress on individuals and families right before the fucking holidays. How's he doing these days, Kal? Since deleting my FB account several months ago I haven't seen any updates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMC Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Kalbear said: You assume that his ruling was in good faith. In a stupid way his ruling set up cover for this one. His ruling was definitely in good faith inasmuch as it was a clear message he didn't want SCOTUS completely overturning the ACA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted December 15, 2018 Author Share Posted December 15, 2018 10 minutes ago, JEORDHl said: Even if DMC is right, it's a hell of a thing to cause this kind of fear and stress on individuals and families right before the fucking holidays. How's he doing these days, Kal? Since deleting my FB account several months ago I haven't seen any updates. Haven't done a lot of updates for him. Short answer is that he is still with no sign of cancer but due to chemo he was near holocaust level of starvation and had to be hospitalized for months. Which again, wouldn't be covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altherion Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 1 hour ago, DMC said: I think this Mueller conversation can often fall into a binary debate that misses the forest for the trees. While Mueller's findings will not cause removal from office alone, no, they could certainly impact Trump's approval - through what is revealed, how Trump responds to it, how House investigations respond, etc. And if Trump's approval gets and stays into the 30s by election day, it's very unlikely he wins. Probably even more unlikely than the general possibility that Trump gets impeached. I think this is the most likely way for the investigation to make an impact: drag it out for another couple of years and save some indictment or announcement to serve as an October surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMC Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Altherion said: I think this is the most likely way for the investigation to make an impact: drag it out for another couple of years and save some indictment or announcement to serve as an October surprise. Well, I don't think Mueller can wait near that long. MSNBC would use up all the world's supermarkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centrist Simon Steele Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 3 hours ago, Gertrude said: Honestly, I think the thing that has the best chance to bring Trump's support down is if his tax returns show extensive fraud. Not just things that are 'smart business', but a history of out and out, incontrovertible fraud. It's not a high hope, but in talking with my dad (love him) he gets really riled up about the 47% who don't pay federal taxes. I can't logic with him on that, even when I pointed out that as a retiree, he doesn't pay federal taxes. Doesn't matter - it's not fair. Fair is a big trigger with him (again, I can't logic with him about fair/unfair.) He feels this is unfair. If Trump is proven to be a huge cheat and crook and not just a liar, I think there might be enough traction to get his numbers to drop. Maybe I'm just a hopeless optimistic. This situation is interesting. I have family members with the same objections, but you can't reason with them. That 47 percent number is skewed highly by those in retirement (who DID pay federal taxes most of their lives). Still, there are people like me--a single father who worked as a TA the last two years, and my income was low enough I payed next to nothing on federal taxes AND I got a hefty credit back each year which more than erased anything I paid. I am in a higher income bracket now, and I pay taxes. If I could pick between the two positions? I would pick the higher income bracket where I pay taxes. Those years transitioning into higher ed were so difficult and stressful that, if time somehow reversed and I was sitting back in my public school teaching position contemplating jumping to higher ed, I don't think I would do it. Those years of transition were HARD. But to some members of my family--I was a leech on the system. I guess I'm getting at this: I feel like my story is logical and makes sense as to why I might not have paid taxes for two years (and why that was horrid), but certain members of my family can't hear that. So if Trump turned out to be a tax cheater, would his followers hear that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altherion Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 1 hour ago, Simon Steele said: But to some members of my family--I was a leech on the system. I guess I'm getting at this: I feel like my story is logical and makes sense as to why I might not have paid taxes for two years (and why that was horrid), but certain members of my family can't hear that. So if Trump turned out to be a tax cheater, would his followers hear that? I doubt it. There's a significant difference in attitude towards poor people who don't make enough to pay taxes and rich people who play various games with the tax code to minimize their tax exposure. The same goes for poor people who get money from the government via the EITC and similar programs and rich people who get corporate subsidies. For example, the crowd protesting against Amazon's recent $3B subsidies in New York City is quite different from the one that opposes welfare and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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