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Angel Eyes

Why do people ship Sandor and Sansa?

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I understand the archetype people invoke when pairing them (Beauty and the Beast), but on a personal level, I just don’t see the romantic attraction between them, especially on the show. He’s never shown any romantic attraction to her, and none on her side either. 

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I didn't ship them first but I came to appreciate the love story behind, and now I can't wait. These are two very different, yet very similar characters..

Ah....even not shipping them when I was watching the show (I watched the first 4 seaosns before starting the books) I really got that they were trying to create a romantic tension between them in the first seasons.

Edited by Meera of Tarth

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It's absent from the show, but pretty prevalent in the books. They're both a little obsessed with each other. The official app even describes Sandor as being "infatuated" with Sansa from the first time they met.

I think GRRM expected the characters to age more quickly when he first started writing the series. I'm guessing Sansa was originally going to be well into her teens by the Battle of the Blackwater. For what it's worth, Sandor's a good 15-20 years younger in the books than he is in the show. 

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Here's my thoughts:

In my opinion, Sandor has been HUGE in the development of Sansa. It is Sandor that we first see her show genuine compassion to when he tells her his story. It is Sandor that gives her the most crucial advice she ever receives, "give them what they want". That helps her in her dealings with everyone else she meets from that point on. She immediately feels comfortable with him being tactile towards her, without even realizing who it is. GRRM has set this up from the beginning beginning, when everyone was heading towards KL.

Also, from a plot standpoint, the most important thing about this relationship, is that it is secret. From ALL of the big players of the game, but most importantly Littlefinger. Littlefinger has worked to distance her from every influence in her life. Her dad, her friend Jeyne, Dontos, The Tyrells, Tyrion, Myranda Royce, and whoever else might be a threat to him dominating her. He has done nothing to influence her relationship with Sandor, because he doesn't know anything about it! LF has no idea the intimacy Sansa developed with him, or the trust.  I believe The Hound is going to be the one to inform Sansa of his crimes against her family. He's her hidden dagger. LF is confident that he knows everything about Sansa, and for the most part he does. This relationship is literally the only thing he has no clue about. It's a shield he has no idea is there, and will ultimately help end LF IMO.  

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The show has changed a lot of things and characters. In the books, Sandor is in his mid twenties, he is 15 years older than Sansa not 40. I know by our standards this is still too much, but remember what period of time the books cover. Also, we can see that both characters think about each other when they are away. I really hope that they will meet again at some point and help each other again.

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Honestly, I find the ship to be a little gross. I mean, I'm not going to deny that Sandor was a big part of Sansa's life for a little while and helped develop and mature her as a person. Because he did (more so in the books, IMO, than the show) but at the same time he's no great noble guy and frequently scares her on purpose, mocks, and belittles her. And maybe that's part of the character development for some people but for me I just find it gross

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 It is pretty obvious that he, the Hound is the one Sansa dreams about, fantasizes about etc. he is a man, a full size man that is actually taller than her. IE, she digs him and he her.  He did as much as he could to protect her and offered to rescue her out of the city but she refused. She is not bright or was not but her honored her anyway and all he left her was a blood cloak (:rolleyes:).  The question should be, " Why the hell do people ship Sansa and the Imp?"

Edited by A Ghost of Someone

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On 1/6/2019 at 9:39 PM, Pandean said:

Honestly, I find the ship to be a little gross. I mean, I'm not going to deny that Sandor was a big part of Sansa's life for a little while and helped develop and mature her as a person. Because he did (more so in the books, IMO, than the show) but at the same time he's no great noble guy and frequently scares her on purpose, mocks, and belittles her. And maybe that's part of the character development for some people but for me I just find it gross

I never knew it was a ship until I started coming to this site.  At Sansa's age, we meet her pre-puberty, and see her going through literal development.  She is just starting to realize sexual and romantic attraction in her POVs.  Sandor has been one of the males who has consistently shown some kind of interest in her, and he offers her some measure of protections.  I think it's notable that Sansa has been around such abuse and grooming that someone who expresses interest, but "didn't beat her" probably seems the safest of the lot.  Tyrion in the books is not safe for her.  She thinks in the books, that he can decide to take his marital rights at any time, and fears it, when they are together.  LF certainly isn't safe, and she is making the distinction that there is Petyr and Littlefinger, but she is still not quite realizing the danger of Petyr as well.  I think part of why she thinks more on Sandor after leaving KL, is that he is not there - therefore he is safe to be a stand in, in her thoughts, without a realistic threat of harm, while she is developing.

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On 12/10/2018 at 12:33 PM, Angel Eyes said:

I understand the archetype people invoke when pairing them (Beauty and the Beast), but on a personal level, I just don’t see the romantic attraction between them, especially on the show. He’s never shown any romantic attraction to her, and none on her side either. 

Paternal Investment Theory  - I think Ned left a lot of Sansa's upbringing to Catelyn and the Septa, and we see in AGOT how he explains things to Arya about KL and Lannisters but not Sansa.  It could be that he was not as engaged with Sansa growing up.  According to this Theory, his lack of engagement with her would lead her to be less selective in choosing prospective partners as she gets older, as the father-daughter relationship helps the daughter to evaluate the qualities and behavior she is looking for.  I don't see Sansa as interested in the Hound, but as she is starting to have her sexuality develop, and her choices to think on appear to be LF, Tyrion, a fictitious Willas that is quite soon lost to her, and Hound (and because of her birth, he's not even a marriage partner), it might be that he's just the safest to think on.

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I don't understand it either.

- He makes fun of her education and courtesies. She puts efforts into being a lady and he mocks that. "Some septa trained you well. You’re like one of those birds from the Summer isles, aren’t you? A pretty little talking bird, repeating all the pretty little words they taught you to recite." He's always there to discredit her. I can't understand why people find this romantic.

- Sandor insults her intelligence, calling her a stupid bird and empty-headed. This verbal abuse causes her to doubt herself and affects her self-esteem.

- He thinks that the heroine of one of her favorite stories (someone she wishes she could be) is a cunt. So what does that make Sansa? He's always degrading and invalidating her worldview and beliefs. It's not helpful nor is it constructive.

- He physically restrains her to the point of pain and threatens to kill her if she doesn't sing for him. He threatens to beat her to prove a point "Do I need to beat that into you." It's like a creepy guy at a club grabbing a woman, and insisting that she dance for him. Using strength to force her to do things for him is not romantic.

- He wishes he could have fucked her bloody. So yeah, he's saying it in a stressed state. Still doesn't matter. No excuse.

As for her "thinking" about the Hound - it's explained by the situation she's in. She's simply looking for a protector and will take anyone, even Dontos, Tyrion, Lothor, or Littlefinger. She's at the point where she has a favorite King's Guard - the one who doesn't hit her as hard. She wants to ask Dontos to guard her rooms and romanticizes him as her Florian. She uses the same romantic spin with Dontos as she does the Hound. One is too cruel while the other is too weak. She's Goldilocks eating the porridge and swallowing it because she's starved, but neither satisfy.

Edited by Rose of Red Lake

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On 12/10/2018 at 6:33 PM, Angel Eyes said:

I understand the archetype people invoke when pairing them (Beauty and the Beast), but on a personal level, I just don’t see the romantic attraction between them, especially on the show. He’s never shown any romantic attraction to her, and none on her side either. 

On the show - no. In the books you have access to Sansa's thoughts and becomes more obvious. GRRM himself had admitted that "there is something there". 

I'm not a fan of it either, but it is what is. I guess it's supposed to show the complexity of the human psyche.  :dunno:

 

Edited by Takiedevushkikakzvezdy

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The show I nothing. Sansa is different from scene to scene but even there, their will be something. The books is very obvious about it. This show, they have gone places with Sansa that no one ever thought they would have before Season 5. Hell, she may get it on with The Night's King before this is over with, given the way they have written her. However, I think they may have her and The Hound have some connection after all. 

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On 1/20/2019 at 4:00 PM, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

On the show - no. In the books you have access to Sansa's thoughts and becomes more obvious. GRRM himself had admitted that "there is something there". 

In the context of the whole interview, he's talking about what surprised him about reader reactions and one of them is women's reactions to the Hound. He brings it up again in 2015. He's surprised that readers found the Hound a dashing romantic figure. If he's surprised by these reactions he probably didnt intended for it to be romantic. So "there's something there" probably just means something aromantic.

 

Edited by Rose of Red Lake

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11 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

In the context of the whole interview, he's talking about what surprised him about reader reactions and one of them is women's reactions to the Hound. He brings it up again in 2015. He's surprised that readers found the Hound a dashing romantic figure. If he's surprised by these reactions he probably didnt intended for it to be romantic. So "there's something there" probably just means something aromantic.

 

Isn't there a scene in AFFC (I think), where Sansa tries to dream of Loras, but his face keeps turning into the Hound?

Edited by Takiedevushkikakzvezdy

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38 minutes ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

Isn't there a scene in AFFC (I think), where Sansa tries to dream of Loras, but his face keeps turning into the Hound?

It's in Storm - she's having a nightmare:

Quote

 

“That night Sansa scarcely slept at all, but tossed and turned just as she had aboard the Merling King. She dreamt of Joffrey dying, but as he clawed at his throat and the blood ran down across his fingers she saw with horror that it was her brother Robb. And she dreamed of her wedding night too, of Tyrion’s eyes devouring her as she undressed. Only then he was bigger than Tyrion had any right to be, and when he climbed into the bed his face was scarred only on one side. “I’ll have a song from you,” he rasped, and Sansa woke and found the old blind dog beside her once again. “I wish that you were Lady,” she said.”

 

Dogs arent wolves.

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1 hour ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

Dogs arent wolves.

Quote

Sansa woke and found the old blind dog beside her once again. “I wish that you were Lady,” she said.”

Good point. Maybe she meant Sandor, not Lady. The dog is Sandor's ideal:

Quote

Sansa: Why do you let people call you a dog? You won't let anyone call you a knight.
Sandor: I like dogs better than knights... A hound will die for you, but never lie to you. And he'll look you straight in the face.

 

Edited by BalerionTheCat

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Well...taking into account those interviews where GRRM is like WTF? and the fact that this ship isn't sailing on the show, my interpretation is that she wants protection from all the horror and creepy men in her dreams and wishes her direwolf was by her side to do that. A dog isn't a direwolf no matter how much Sandor likes them. Joffrey would like to think he has a "dog" as cool as the Starks' wolves, but he doesn't. He's a poor imitation as far as protectors go. It's pretty interesting that GRRM wanted direwolves and dogs to fight in BotB too, maybe to make this point more clear.

 

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18 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

The show I nothing. Sansa is different from scene to scene but even there, their will be something. The books is very obvious about it. This show, they have gone places with Sansa that no one ever thought they would have before Season 5. Hell, she may get it on with The Night's King before this is over with, given the way they have written her. However, I think they may have her and The Hound have some connection after all. 

I think the same. Plus, as a lot of you previously said, in the books their interaction may be perceived very differently. I can easily understand why people ship it and I personally feel as if Sandor is a key element in Sansa's life from the very beginning, she just didn't realized that at the moment. I also think there's kind of an obsession from both parts (on the books). Nevertheless, I don't know how the end of the series will manage their relationship since it's so different.

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In the show, I see no hints whatsoever. It is absolute nonsense to ship Sansa and the Hound in Game of Thrones. It makes no sense at all.

In the books there are obvious hints. Which does not mean, dreams come true or feelings ever become reality. But at least it makes some sort of sense.

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