Rant & Rave Season 8 [Spoilers]: When you are cool like a cucumber, as evil as the mother of madness, but never as perfect as the pet!

[It_spelt_Magalhaes]

Didn't the NC17 Merc-with-a-Mouth get shelved into Siberia for good long while over that?

That is one of those 'movies that never happened'.

[Beardy the Wildling]

Hey, so I made a little tinfoil theory meets rant for a subject, however, it is likely unapproved by the mods. Anyway, @SeanF said it would fit in here, so fuck it, here's Mini-Mega Rant 2: Electric Boogaloo.

(warning: aluminium headwear may be present)

In this thread, I'm not going to talk about D&D; I'm going to aim the gun squarely at David Benioff's head. Why? Well, I recently found out that pretty much every boneheaded shift from the books (as opposed to pragmatic or neutral changes) were the result of David Benioff having a 'creative vision' shift at the last minute and no-one having the spine to tell him 'no'. Talisa? Turns out David Benioff prefers brown women, and couldn't understand why Robb would lose a kingdom over a non-brown one. TV Dorne including Jaime and Bronn? Benioff's call, along with the infamous bad pussy line; remember, he thinks brown women are inherently sexy and can merely mention genitalia to be arousing. Stannis losing the Battle of Ice and being the one to personally burn his daughter? Benioff's call again, later justifying it as Stannis's ambition overruling his love. Sansa being sold off to the Boltons to be raped? Benioff's idea, with Cogman stuck as the fall guy.

So, with this in mind, it shouldn't surprise you that Jaime going back to Cersei time and time again because 'we can't choose who we love' is an invention of Mr Benioff. DB Weiss may have an infatuation with zombie polar bears, but in all fairness, that's harmless spectacle. Dumb, but not malignant. Only Benioff would actively make the show as toxic as it is. Incest is wincest, it would seem. Well, no, not quite, because it should also be noted that Cersei is considerably consequence-free from blowing up the Vatican, beloved, even. It's not just a ruination of Jaime to facilitate more fun incest, it's a simultaneous whitewashing (in a personal way; the act of blowing up the Vatican in a catholic area is kinda fucked, desperate or otherwise) and plot armouring of Cersei.

But why would he do this? Benioff is an unapologetic misogynist who doesn't care about women (just see Season 6's sophomoric tagline, 'Women on top', as a way to show that women are going to be thrown positions of power but also lolsexjoke) so he's not merely trying to appease the radical feminist crowd. If he wanted to be lazy, the Aegon plot was right there to crib from the books, Cersei could have been toppled early (as would be realistic of a person who blew up the fucking Vatican) and he could have worked with an easy Targ rivalry.

But no, it had to be Cersei. Why? Well, I'll spoil my theory ahead of time: Benioff is Cersei. Specifically, he's the worst of Book-Cersei, and has experienced a life not dissimilar to Show-Cersei. Let's go through the points.

Malignant Narcissism - You know how in Book-Cersei's chapters, a self-aware person reads through the self-congratulatory narration praising Cersei's brilliance and cringes, knowing how utterly delusional Cersei is? Benioff, if he even read Feast (which is being generous, I'll be honest), takes Cersei's brilliance at face value. After all, he loves to revel in his own brilliance; that's just what normal smart people do as far as he's concerned. That's why he can't help but talk a load of shit in the Inside the Episode videos; he's just so eager to show the world how awesome he is, but knows everyone around him is 'too dumb' to comprehend his genius without him explaining it. In addition, he's obsessed with his image. He spent the Battle of the Bastards refreshing IMDb over and over again because that rating is life to him. Every other critic he spurned once they turned sour, but IMDb was his safe haven, the place that would always praise him. Heh. How'd that turn out, eh, Danny Boy? Also, it should be noted that in nominating episodes for writing Emmys, he only nominated episodes written by him and Weiss. Not the better-received eps from Cogman, local fall guy. Only him, because only he is brilliant enough to get Emmys.

Proud Alcoholism - What was it Benioff said about where he'll be after the finale? At an undisclosed location, with lots of alcohol, far away from the internet. He isn't just an alcoholic; he thinks alcoholism is cool enough to make it part of a public statement.

Proud Falseness - Just like how Cersei smugly recounts all the ways she's lied to people and thinks she's the height of cunning, so does David Benioff. He outright revelled in the fact that he has no screenwriting qualifications (which explains his remark about themes being for eighth grade book reports) and how he tricked GRRM into thinking he had a screenwriting degree. This is not something to be proud of, Benioff, this is something you should be hiding in shame over.

An inability to face consequences - When Season 5 ended and there was a massive backlash, what happened at San Diego comic con? Oh yeah, D&D pushed the actors forward, knowing everyone can't reasonably blame them for doing their jobs to the best of their ability, while they dodged the event. I guarantee this will happen again this year. Similarly, this fantasy gets written into Show-Cersei. She blows up the Vatican? No prob, bob, everyone loves her! To be fair, this could have something to do with how coddled David Benioff truly is. See, his father's a wall street tycoon, the ex-owner of Goldman-Sachs. He's kind of a big deal. Hence David could be coddled by daddy while he fails at novel after novel, screenplay after screenplay, and because of daddy's connections, he'll only fail upwards. Maybe this is just what Benioff thinks the real world is?

Idealising toxic masculinity while ironically lacking any of its ideals - Now, I may get flack for this. I assure you, I'm not with the ANTIFA crowd, but I know toxic gender stereotypes exist. REAL MEN FIGHT UNGHHH is a toxic stereotype of how masculinity works, so in my view, that's toxic masculinity (as opposed to how radical feminists seem to see it, that is, any expression of masculinity is itself toxic). I think it's safe to say David Benioff wants to be seen as a 'real man'. He's the guy who said Ramsay is more heroic than Joffrey because he fights, he's the one who had Sam say 'lol, learning is for idiots' (once again, this guy lied about his screenwriting qualifications to GRRM, is it any wonder Sam becomes Grand Maester at the end? Pure projection), he's the one who insists on gratuitous rape and sex scenes. He's trying so hard to be testosterone-poisoned, but, let's be honest, the guy's a chicken shit. He isn't a chiselled action hero, he's a greying, weaselly, alcoholic man. He isn't masculine in the non-toxic sense, let alone the toxic sense. Meanwhile, Book-Cersei spends her whole time being misogynistic and wishing she was born a man, much like how Benioff wishes he was born a fuckboy who could make all the sex jokes he wrote sound cool.

Spiteful towards reasonable criticism and dissent - Through AFFC, Cersei is being given reasonable counsel by Harys Swyft, Pycelle, and Kevan Lannister, but of course, this just makes her view them as her enemy. When Lady Stokeworth brings up legitimate concerns, Cersei has them tortured to death by Qyburn. This pretty much matches how he approached Ros, Barristan, Stannis and Jaime's actors. Ros's actress is an exception here, as her concerns boiled down to 'I don't want nude scenes anymore, either I want a meatier role or I'm not interested'. But David needs his fanservice whore... so he has a brilliant idea. He teases a meatier story for Ros, then has her gruesomely killed by Joffrey, all while gratuitously panning a camera up her corpse. That'll show her. As for Barristan, Stannis, and Jaime, each of their actors had read the books and had concerns about their characters' arcs. Stephen Dillane, bless his soul, outright told the press he had 'no idea why his character was doing what he did'. Let's see how each ended: Barristan died in a pit, denying him a book story where he gets to be heroic, Stannis died alone and deserted upon as a fanatic child-killing monster, and Jaime died renouncing his protectiveness for the people, somehow coming off as less sympathetic than... yes, Cersei.

Utterly sex-obsessed - Is there anything Book-Cersei thinks can't be solved by sexual bribery? Nope. Similarly, David Benioff just thinks sex is inherently cool and fun, and can save any scene.

Overly reliant on a rich daddy to make up for incompetence - As mentioned above, it's only really thanks to his father than Benioff has a writing career at all. When your father is a rich, media industry bankroller, you kind of get jobs handed to you. So just like how Tywin shielded Cersei from her own idiocy with Lannister gold, so too does Benioff's father, enabling the moron to keep failing upwards. Today X Men Origins, tomorrow Star Wars.

Well, I think this is long and detailed enough to make my case. I think that David Benioff liked Cersei because it was like looking in a mirror, so he kept her alive against the odds, and made sure she died a scared, pregnant woman in her lover's arms. What do you guys think?

[It_spelt_Magalhaes]

@Beardy the Wildling, as we say in Portugal?

Dude's ears must be on fire. (From anyone and their auntie talking 'bout 'um) Hell, they've probs since been bbq'ed.

Rant on, brave and loquacious friend, rant on.

[Mystical]

@Beardy the WildlingNice summary with a few corrections. The Lannisters might all be reflections of Benioff's 'wishfulfillment' but Cersei is the wrong one. They just changed her because they love Lena (though Benioff is a narcissist) . Tywin was changed from the books (and Jamie's dyslexia added) because Benioff had a speaking problem since childhood. So Tywin is the father Benioff wished he had when he was younger. Aka a father who saw the problem and helped him like Tywin did with Jamie. He's also on record saying that Tyrion is his self-insert. Benioff was always small for his age and as mentioned had problems so he was the 'black sheep' of the family. in school etc.. This explains why Tyrion can screw up all the time and get millions killed and still come out on top, he is Benioff. That's why for Seasons everyone has been sucking Tyrion's dick, waxing poetic about his brilliance despite Tyrion being an utter failure. He is Benioff.

[The Fattest Leech]

Has this been posted yet? If so, sorry to singe ye eyes fer a second time.

To go along with the 'scripts edition' theme of this thread... ugh... here is more news

Remember when we wanted show Nymeria to actually have meaning? Remember when we wanted show Ghost to actually meaning? Well, we were this close >< until someone (some two?) who didn't read/do not understand the books decided the wolves disposable. Maybe 50 direwolves is a touch of exaggeration, but at least 2 wolves during the Long Nap would have woken things up a bit.

• Game Of Thrones director Miguel Sapochnik revealed a battle scene involving 50 direwolves was dropped from season eight.

The unique beasts would have had their own part to play in the hit show’s last ever season.

Sapochnik explained the sequence would take place in the episode The Long Night, the third episode of season eight where the remaining characters went to war against the Night King and his army of the dead.

The director said the creatures, of which the Stark children had one each, would have got together to attack the Night’s King’s dragon.

However, the idea was binned as he thought it would be boring to watch.

He said: ‘There were many things that happened, that people would have been so happy to have happen. Attack of dire wolves and crazy stuff.

‘At some point you’re like, 50 direwolves attacking an undead dragon does not a good movie make.’

(a little more after the link)

https://metro.co.uk/2019/06/18/game-thrones-writers-scrapped-battle-50-direwolves-best-moment-season-8-10000845/

 

[Dragons Are Real]

26 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

‘At some point you’re like, 50 direwolves attacking an undead dragon does not a good movie make.’

WTF?  How could anyone involved in that project make that statement and actually mean it?  Hell, I'd be willing to chip in for a fund to film JUST that scene, make it last a half hour or so, and will HAPPILY watch it.

What the hell?  Seriously.  WHAT?!

[kissdbyfire]

23 minutes ago, Dragons Are Real said:

WTF?  How could anyone involved in that project make that statement and actually mean it?  Hell, I'd be willing to chip in for a fund to film JUST that scene, make it last a half hour or so, and will HAPPILY watch it.

What the hell?  Seriously.  WHAT?!

I'd chip in too. And we would have had at least a half hour that wouldn't suck. 

[BlackLightning]

On 6/18/2019 at 12:13 PM, Beardy the Wildling said:

Hey, so I made a little tinfoil theory meets rant for a subject, however, it is likely unapproved by the mods. Anyway, @SeanF said it would fit in here, so fuck it, here's Mini-Mega Rant 2: Electric Boogaloo.

(warning: aluminium headwear may be present)

In this thread, I'm not going to talk about D&D; I'm going to aim the gun squarely at David Benioff's head. Why? Well, I recently found out that pretty much every boneheaded shift from the books (as opposed to pragmatic or neutral changes) were the result of David Benioff having a 'creative vision' shift at the last minute and no-one having the spine to tell him 'no'. Talisa? Turns out David Benioff prefers brown women, and couldn't understand why Robb would lose a kingdom over a non-brown one. TV Dorne including Jaime and Bronn? Benioff's call, along with the infamous bad pussy line; remember, he thinks brown women are inherently sexy and can merely mention genitalia to be arousing. Stannis losing the Battle of Ice and being the one to personally burn his daughter? Benioff's call again, later justifying it as Stannis's ambition overruling his love. Sansa being sold off to the Boltons to be raped? Benioff's idea, with Cogman stuck as the fall guy.

So, with this in mind, it shouldn't surprise you that Jaime going back to Cersei time and time again because 'we can't choose who we love' is an invention of Mr Benioff. DB Weiss may have an infatuation with zombie polar bears, but in all fairness, that's harmless spectacle. Dumb, but not malignant. Only Benioff would actively make the show as toxic as it is. Incest is wincest, it would seem. Well, no, not quite, because it should also be noted that Cersei is considerably consequence-free from blowing up the Vatican, beloved, even. It's not just a ruination of Jaime to facilitate more fun incest, it's a simultaneous whitewashing (in a personal way; the act of blowing up the Vatican in a catholic area is kinda fucked, desperate or otherwise) and plot armouring of Cersei.

But why would he do this? Benioff is an unapologetic misogynist who doesn't care about women (just see Season 6's sophomoric tagline, 'Women on top', as a way to show that women are going to be thrown positions of power but also lolsexjoke) so he's not merely trying to appease the radical feminist crowd. If he wanted to be lazy, the Aegon plot was right there to crib from the books, Cersei could have been toppled early (as would be realistic of a person who blew up the fucking Vatican) and he could have worked with an easy Targ rivalry.

But no, it had to be Cersei. Why? Well, I'll spoil my theory ahead of time: Benioff is Cersei. Specifically, he's the worst of Book-Cersei, and has experienced a life not dissimilar to Show-Cersei. Let's go through the points.

Malignant Narcissism - You know how in Book-Cersei's chapters, a self-aware person reads through the self-congratulatory narration praising Cersei's brilliance and cringes, knowing how utterly delusional Cersei is? Benioff, if he even read Feast (which is being generous, I'll be honest), takes Cersei's brilliance at face value. After all, he loves to revel in his own brilliance; that's just what normal smart people do as far as he's concerned. That's why he can't help but talk a load of shit in the Inside the Episode videos; he's just so eager to show the world how awesome he is, but knows everyone around him is 'too dumb' to comprehend his genius without him explaining it. In addition, he's obsessed with his image. He spent the Battle of the Bastards refreshing IMDb over and over again because that rating is life to him. Every other critic he spurned once they turned sour, but IMDb was his safe haven, the place that would always praise him. Heh. How'd that turn out, eh, Danny Boy? Also, it should be noted that in nominating episodes for writing Emmys, he only nominated episodes written by him and Weiss. Not the better-received eps from Cogman, local fall guy. Only him, because only he is brilliant enough to get Emmys.

Proud Alcoholism - What was it Benioff said about where he'll be after the finale? At an undisclosed location, with lots of alcohol, far away from the internet. He isn't just an alcoholic; he thinks alcoholism is cool enough to make it part of a public statement.

Proud Falseness - Just like how Cersei smugly recounts all the ways she's lied to people and thinks she's the height of cunning, so does David Benioff. He outright revelled in the fact that he has no screenwriting qualifications (which explains his remark about themes being for eighth grade book reports) and how he tricked GRRM into thinking he had a screenwriting degree. This is not something to be proud of, Benioff, this is something you should be hiding in shame over.

An inability to face consequences - When Season 5 ended and there was a massive backlash, what happened at San Diego comic con? Oh yeah, D&D pushed the actors forward, knowing everyone can't reasonably blame them for doing their jobs to the best of their ability, while they dodged the event. I guarantee this will happen again this year. Similarly, this fantasy gets written into Show-Cersei. She blows up the Vatican? No prob, bob, everyone loves her! To be fair, this could have something to do with how coddled David Benioff truly is. See, his father's a wall street tycoon, the ex-owner of Goldman-Sachs. He's kind of a big deal. Hence David could be coddled by daddy while he fails at novel after novel, screenplay after screenplay, and because of daddy's connections, he'll only fail upwards. Maybe this is just what Benioff thinks the real world is?

Idealising toxic masculinity while ironically lacking any of its ideals - Now, I may get flack for this. I assure you, I'm not with the ANTIFA crowd, but I know toxic gender stereotypes exist. REAL MEN FIGHT UNGHHH is a toxic stereotype of how masculinity works, so in my view, that's toxic masculinity (as opposed to how radical feminists seem to see it, that is, any expression of masculinity is itself toxic). I think it's safe to say David Benioff wants to be seen as a 'real man'. He's the guy who said Ramsay is more heroic than Joffrey because he fights, he's the one who had Sam say 'lol, learning is for idiots' (once again, this guy lied about his screenwriting qualifications to GRRM, is it any wonder Sam becomes Grand Maester at the end? Pure projection), he's the one who insists on gratuitous rape and sex scenes. He's trying so hard to be testosterone-poisoned, but, let's be honest, the guy's a chicken shit. He isn't a chiselled action hero, he's a greying, weaselly, alcoholic man. He isn't masculine in the non-toxic sense, let alone the toxic sense. Meanwhile, Book-Cersei spends her whole time being misogynistic and wishing she was born a man, much like how Benioff wishes he was born a fuckboy who could make all the sex jokes he wrote sound cool.

Spiteful towards reasonable criticism and dissent - Through AFFC, Cersei is being given reasonable counsel by Harys Swyft, Pycelle, and Kevan Lannister, but of course, this just makes her view them as her enemy. When Lady Stokeworth brings up legitimate concerns, Cersei has them tortured to death by Qyburn. This pretty much matches how he approached Ros, Barristan, Stannis and Jaime's actors. Ros's actress is an exception here, as her concerns boiled down to 'I don't want nude scenes anymore, either I want a meatier role or I'm not interested'. But David needs his fanservice whore... so he has a brilliant idea. He teases a meatier story for Ros, then has her gruesomely killed by Joffrey, all while gratuitously panning a camera up her corpse. That'll show her. As for Barristan, Stannis, and Jaime, each of their actors had read the books and had concerns about their characters' arcs. Stephen Dillane, bless his soul, outright told the press he had 'no idea why his character was doing what he did'. Let's see how each ended: Barristan died in a pit, denying him a book story where he gets to be heroic, Stannis died alone and deserted upon as a fanatic child-killing monster, and Jaime died renouncing his protectiveness for the people, somehow coming off as less sympathetic than... yes, Cersei.

Utterly sex-obsessed - Is there anything Book-Cersei thinks can't be solved by sexual bribery? Nope. Similarly, David Benioff just thinks sex is inherently cool and fun, and can save any scene.

Overly reliant on a rich daddy to make up for incompetence - As mentioned above, it's only really thanks to his father than Benioff has a writing career at all. When your father is a rich, media industry bankroller, you kind of get jobs handed to you. So just like how Tywin shielded Cersei from her own idiocy with Lannister gold, so too does Benioff's father, enabling the moron to keep failing upwards. Today X Men Origins, tomorrow Star Wars.

Well, I think this is long and detailed enough to make my case. I think that David Benioff liked Cersei because it was like looking in a mirror, so he kept her alive against the odds, and made sure she died a scared, pregnant woman in her lover's arms. What do you guys think?

 

On 6/18/2019 at 5:21 PM, Mystical said:

@Beardy the WildlingNice summary with a few corrections. The Lannisters might all be reflections of Benioff's 'wishfulfillment' but Cersei is the wrong one. They just changed her because they love Lena (though Benioff is a narcissist) . Tywin was changed from the books (and Jamie's dyslexia added) because Benioff had a speaking problem since childhood. So Tywin is the father Benioff wished he had when he was younger. Aka a father who saw the problem and helped him like Tywin did with Jamie. He's also on record saying that Tyrion is his self-insert. Benioff was always small for his age and as mentioned had problems so he was the 'black sheep' of the family. in school etc.. This explains why Tyrion can screw up all the time and get millions killed and still come out on top, he is Benioff. That's why for Seasons everyone has been sucking Tyrion's dick, waxing poetic about his brilliance despite Tyrion being an utter failure. He is Benioff.

In any case, Benioff is trash.

I've never really liked him or found him to be particularly impressive or profound but I am on the verge of completely hating his guts

[Dragons Are Real]

13 hours ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

 

In any case, Benioff is trash.

I've never really liked him or found him to be particularly impressive or profound but I am on the verge of completely hating his guts

That's just how great of a writer he is.  He manages to stumble over his own stupidity so often that not only are audiences repulsed by his output, they end up repulsed by the man himself because his output reflects an inner being that is so narcissistic, so empty and bereft of anything resembling goodness, that it can't help but produce utter dreck.

BTW, where I said "how great of a writer?"  Replace the word "great" with any derogative term you care to, and it wouldn't quite cover the scope of what we're talking about.  

[SeanF]

20 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

I'd chip in too. And we would have had at least a half hour that wouldn't suck. 

How about chipping in for a film in which 50 direwolves hunt down Benioff & Weiss?

[divica]

haven t D&D come forward defend their work?

Will they be present in comic cons to talk about why they did this season this way?

[hewman]

1 hour ago, SeanF said:

How about chipping in for a film in which 50 direwolves hunt down Benioff & Weiss?

I’d settle for 1 zombi polar bear. 

[SeanF]

Just now, hewman said:

I’d settle for 1 zombi polar bear. 

I'd prefer the direwolves.  You could have Jon, Sansa, Bran, and Arya all so fed up at the way they were portrayed that they warg into them, and hunt D & D through the Wolfswood.

[hewman]

59 minutes ago, SeanF said:

I'd prefer the direwolves.  You could have Jon, Sansa, Bran, and Arya all so fed up at the way they were portrayed that they warg into them, and hunt D & D through the Wolfswood.

Tallyho then! I could take a wild guess who warged into the one saying “you’ll always be muh queen” just before sinking his fangs into Benioff’s arse.  

[Dragons Are Real]

Direwolves are too good for the Ds.  They need to be gored by a wild boar and then slowly waste away in their beds, ranting inconsolably to no one in particular of the injustices of the world.

[The Fattest Leech]

5 hours ago, divica said:

haven t D&D come forward defend their work?

Will they be present in comic cons to talk about why they did this season this way?

Nope.

Apparently there was a Inside (Behind?) the Episode that was made for the series finale, but for some reason the decision to air it (per ususal after every episode) was scrapped.

Does anyone know why?

Adding link: https://winteriscoming.net/2019/06/19/what-happened-to-the-inside-the-episode-for-the-season-8-series-finale-the-iron-throne/

[SeanF]

1 hour ago, Dragons Are Real said:

Direwolves are too good for the Ds.  They need to be gored by a wild boar and then slowly waste away in their beds, ranting inconsolably to no one in particular of the injustices of the world.

Even that is more than they deserve .

They should be devoured by ravening weasels.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

1 hour ago, SeanF said:

Even that is more than they deserve .

They should be devoured by ravening weasels.

I vote for an eternal showing of Volgon Poetry.  But, they have to be gagged through it as well.  It seems to me the perfect punishment just for all those Inside Their Circle Jerk episodes. 

 

[divica]

1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Nope.

Apparently there was a Inside (Behind?) the Episode that was made for the series finale, but for some reason the decision to air it (per ususal after every episode) was scrapped.

Does anyone know why?

Adding link: https://winteriscoming.net/2019/06/19/what-happened-to-the-inside-the-episode-for-the-season-8-series-finale-the-iron-throne/

My opinion is that people hated those inside the episodes even more than the actual episodes.

I can only imagine the shit they say in that one. Like trying to justify what happened after danny dies or what danny meant when se wanted to go from winterfell to dorne to "liberate" the people...

[kissdbyfire]

9 hours ago, divica said:

haven t D&D come forward defend their work?

Is their work "defendable"?