Rant & Rave Season 8 [Spoilers]: When you are cool like a cucumber, as evil as the mother of madness, but never as perfect as the pet!

[sweetsunray]

5 hours ago, Corvinus said:

One of my favorite shows of the last several years is Black Sails. Despite that all the main characters are pirates or are strongly linked to pirates, the writers made you root for them or against them, depending on how the story went. It's possible to make heroic characters out of the characters in Dance, or at least characters who have heroic traits but are intertwined with deep flaws.

The writers of Black Sails could actually pull DotD off imo. What a show!

[kissdbyfire]

11 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Did a coach tour during Titancon at the end of late August. Been ranting about the show since the start of S5, but the sets are lovely, because the island is just beautiful!!!!

Beat me to it! 

And this talk brings me again to... wasted, squandered opportunities. I mean, the sets, the astonishingly gorgeous landscape in NI, the blood, sweat and tears that the cast and crew put into it all... so much talent and passionate dedication, all for naught, because David and Dan.

 

 

[kissdbyfire]

3 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

The writers of Black Sails could actually pull DotD off imo. What a show!

AWESOME. Start to finish, great consistent characters, character development - it is possible!!!! - coherent plots and arcs, beautifully shot. And of course Toby Stevens!

[sweetsunray]

1 minute ago, kissdbyfire said:

AWESOME. Start to finish, great consistent characters, character development - it is possible!!!! - coherent plots and arcs, beautifully shot. And of course Toby Stevens!

And dealing with sensitive issues - slavery, sexual exploitation, rape, piracy, women (including poc) seeking their role befitting their dreams and personality either in a society ruled by machismo or patriarchy, LGBT, violence, but also love... and yes, of course Toby Stevens!  And Luke Roberts And Ray Stevenson in the most intense scene I've ever watched    

[sweetsunray]

22 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Beat me to it! 

And this talk brings me again to... wasted, squandered opportunities. I mean, the sets, the astonishingly gorgeous landscape in NI, the blood, sweat and tears that the cast and crew put into it all... so much talent and passionate dedication, all for naught, because David and Dan.

When Martin the extra talked so passionately about his experiences at the feast, while we were eating our Frey Pies (for those not there - vegan Frey Pies), it just felt bittersweet. At least it wasn't meaningless to him. 

[illrede]

On 10/28/2019 at 5:21 PM, Le Cygne said:

Another article (I love the titles of the articles, this one is "‘Game Of Thrones’ Showrunners David Benioff And D.B. Weiss Confirmed The Worst Suspicions Of The Fanbase"):

The Faceless Men, the Lord of Light, the Night King; all magical elements of the story that were never resolved, despite clearly being vital to the story. Hence, “the Prince that was promised” never showed up, and Beric Dondarrion’s grand destiny was teased, but never delivered. 

Benioff and Weiss were elevated to success by HBO’s polished infrastructure, the architecture of George R.R. Martin’s books, and the immense talent of every individual that surrounded them, particularly the actors.

They were exposed only when they ran out of material, and had to finish the story themselves. Amusingly, the two never went online to read criticisms of the show from fans, who clearly understood the books better than they did.

It seems that the Game of Thrones writer’s room was a “safe space,” shielded from criticism and outsider perspective. In a way, it’s a relief to finally understand why the show went in such a bizarre direction; there was no one there to tell Benioff and Weiss that their ideas were nonsensical. 

Nobody was there to tell them to stop inserting random rape scenes for shock value, or that Euron Greyjoy was dreadful, or that the Great Houses of Westeros finally putting aside their differences and crowning a wheelchair-bound shaman as king was immensely, indescribably stupid. 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danidiplacido/2019/10/28/game-of-thrones-showrunners-david-benioff-and-db-weiss-confirmed-the-worst-suspicions-of-the-fanbase/

To paraphrase von Falkenhayn on the collapse of the German pre-war plan during the Great War at the Marne; "Schlieffen's Notes no long obtain, and so von Moltke has lost his brain."

[SeanF]

4 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

Did a coach tour during Titancon at the end of late August. Been ranting about the show since the start of S5, but the sets are lovely, because the island is just beautiful!!!!

Northern Ireland is a place of remarkable beauty.

What did your fellow attendees think of the show?

[sweetsunray]

4 hours ago, SeanF said:

Northern Ireland is a place of remarkable beauty.

What did your fellow attendees think of the show?

I tried not to talk too much about the show itself. Overall the sentiment and vibe in Belfast is one of gratitude towards the show for the economical boost. Can't blame them. Some of the attendees were extras on the show. For them it was a life experience that they were part of something big for years, not a tv-experience. No matter how badly it was written and produced by D&D, their life experience isn't any less for it. So, I would keep mum to them about my opinion of the show, and just listen to them and smile at them glowing when they talked about it.

Some attendees were disappointed and did feel it wasn't up to par to the books, others were obvious fans and only miffed about Dany's demise, and several weren't there for aSoIaF or GOT and cared little.

The one retrospective panel about the show had a majority of panelists defending the show with the usual arguments, especially when it came to female exploitation, and only one panelist had a somewhat critical voice.

[kissdbyfire]

More on the Star Wars thing:

https://variety.com/2019/film/features/star-wars-kathleen-kennedy-david-benioff-db-weiss-1203388611/

[SeanF]

1 hour ago, sweetsunray said:

I tried not to talk too much about the show itself. Overall the sentiment and vibe in Belfast is one of gratitude towards the show for the economical boost. Can't blame them. Some of the attendees were extras on the show. For them it was a life experience that they were part of something big for years, not a tv-experience. No matter how badly it was written and produced by D&D, their life experience isn't any less for it. So, I would keep mum to them about my opinion of the show, and just listen to them and smile at them glowing when they talked about it.

Some attendees were disappointed and did feel it wasn't up to par to the books, others were obvious fans and only miffed about Dany's demise, and several weren't there for aSoIaF or GOT and cared little.

The one retrospective panel about the show had a majority of panelists defending the show with the usual arguments, especially when it came to female exploitation, and only one panelist had a somewhat critical voice.

Fair enough.  I wouldn't want to tell someone who worked on it what I thought of the final seasons, unless they initiated criticism themselves. 

[Angel Eyes]

1 hour ago, SeanF said:

Fair enough.  I wouldn't want to tell someone who worked on it what I thought of the final seasons, unless they initiated criticism themselves. 

Plenty have, mostly disappointment; Lena Headey’s expressed some that she died anticlimactically, Kit Harington was disappointed that he didn’t kill the Night King, and Peter Dinklage remarked on the idiocy of putting all the civilians in the crypts. You might as well have put Macguyver in a store cupboard. 

I personally think that the final two seasons were a myriad of wasted opportunities to make things worthwhile.

[Angel Eyes]

I’ve actually had a nagging feeling that some more characters like Arya, Brienne, Podrick and Gendry were not supposed to survive the Long Night, since they contribute little to the story for the last half of the season, and their survival was tacked on for some reason.

[Le Cygne]

12 hours ago, illrede said:

To paraphrase von Falkenhayn on the collapse of the German pre-war plan during the Great War at the Marne; "Schlieffen's Notes no long obtain, and so von Moltke has lost his brain."

Indeed, and to carry the analogy further...

 

[Le Cygne]

3 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

More on the Star Wars thing:

https://variety.com/2019/film/features/star-wars-kathleen-kennedy-david-benioff-db-weiss-1203388611/

This is some pretty wild spinning:

“I’m sure there are fans of Benioff and Weiss who would have loved to see them do something with the Star Wars world,” said Eric Handler, an analyst with MKM Partners. “But are they going to boycott all Star Wars movies because of it? Probably not. It’s a lost opportunity, but there are other people down the road who will come into the brand and do something new and exciting.”

[SeanF]

14 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Indeed, and to carry the analogy further...

 

LOL!

 

10 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

This is some pretty wild spinning:

“I’m sure there are fans of Benioff and Weiss who would have loved to see them do something with the Star Wars world,” said Eric Handler, an analyst with MKM Partners. “But are they going to boycott all Star Wars movies because of it? Probably not. It’s a lost opportunity, but there are other people down the road who will come into the brand and do something new and exciting.”

There are fans of D & D?

[Le Cygne]

So I'm getting that the spin from the Benioff/Weiss camp is they didn't want to deal with the Star Wars fandom, after the Game of Thrones fandom blasted them. So they blamed it on the fandom.

If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Especially if you are cooking up stinky slop.

[Le Cygne]

5 minutes ago, SeanF said:

LOL!

 

There are fans of D & D?

Ha ha ha. These articles are a master class in spin.

[Le Cygne]

"We can't handle the criticism of the fans when they hate what we did" along with "we can only focus on one thing at a time" has got to be be reassuring to the execs at Netflix.

[SeanF]

6 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Ha ha ha. These articles are a master class in spin.

Unfortunately, I can't attach things to my posts.

There are some lovely memes.  I think my favourite is one on Freefolk, which just has Walter White, saying:

"I won" in response to the news that Disney fired them.

[SeanF]

Spoiler

 

I loved this on Freefolk, too:-

"I think it was reading the first draft of the script that killed the deal.  It ends with Rey killing pretty much everyone, and at the end, she is alone in the Emperor's Throne Room, staring at the Throne, and hesitantly preparing to sit on it.  She monologues about how she will now reign as a tyrannical mad Queen, her Force power unrivalled throughout the Universe.  

Suddenly, Yoda enters the room and warns her of the Dark Side.  She sneers "What are you going to do Yoda, kill me?" 

Yoda squints his eyes, "Come all this way, why do you think I did?" before he unsheathes his light sabre and drives it through her heart.