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Rant & Rave Season 8 [Spoilers]: When you are cool like a cucumber, as evil as the mother of madness, but never as perfect as the pet!


The Fattest Leech

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5 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Benioff/Weiss said Sandra withheld the information from Jon deliberately. I've quoted it on these threads before, and can look for it, but I think it was a video and I just can't watch those anymore.

They said she wanted to keep some power to herself, so she didn't tell him about the Vale knights, and that she had learned to do this from Littlefinger (they kept saying that like it's a good thing).

And I agree, it was cheap shock. All they care about is THE SHOT. That doesn't get them credit for a good scene in my book. That's cheating. And it's not storytelling, it's just a very expensive skit.

Sophie Turner said she withheld the information to get the credit at San Diego Comiccon 2016.  

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The upside down world of this show... where everything human beings always believed is good, is really bad, and everything that's bad, is really good!

It's good to be like Littlefinger. It's bad to be like Ned Stark. Honor is stupid and gets you killed. Psychos are awesome! Who knew? Benioff and Weiss, that's who.

Yay, Benioff and Weiss, you are geniuses.

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1 hour ago, Le Cygne said:

The upside down world of this show... where everything human beings always believed is good, is really bad, and everything that's bad, is really good!

It's good to be like Littlefinger. It's bad to be like Ned Stark. Honor is stupid and gets you killed. Psychos are awesome! Who knew? Benioff and Weiss, that's who.

Yay, Benioff and Weiss, you are geniuses.

Cersei was a tragic heroine.  Rape makes you stronger.  Freeing slaves is immoral.  Tyrion was a genius.  Xenophobia is good.

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5 hours ago, Le Cygne said:

 

It's good to be like Littlefinger. It's bad to be like Ned Stark. Honor is stupid and gets you killed. Who knew? Benioff and Weiss, that's who.

 

Didn't GRRM already tell us that with Ned telling Cersei he knew of her children's parentage?

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9 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

Didn't GRRM already tell us that with Ned telling Cersei he knew of her children's parentage?

No, he didn't. Even w/ Cersei imprisoning Ned, that's not how he lost his head. Cersei didn't expect that, b/c that was little psycho shithead Joffrey. So Martin wasn't saying that honour is dumb and gets you killed, but rather that trying to do the right thing in a ruthless world can have dire consequences.

And on a side note, what the fuck is the deal w/ Dany fans that think Jorah is oh-so-great for her? What the fuck, Jorah is a creepy stalker in the books, and the show, again, changed that, too. :ack: 

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37 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

No, he didn't. Even w/ Cersei imprisoning Ned, that's not how he lost his head. Cersei didn't expect that, b/c that was little psycho shithead Joffrey. So Martin wasn't saying that honour is dumb and gets you killed, but rather that trying to do the right thing in a ruthless world can have dire consequences.

And on a side note, what the fuck is the deal w/ Dany fans that think Jorah is oh-so-great for her? What the fuck, Jorah is a creepy stalker in the books, and the show, again, changed that, too. :ack: 

I don't know if I agree with your arguments about Ned. Technically he lost his head because he was the only one behaving with honor no matter the consequences. Don t forget why Cersei is able to arrest him in the first place. His allies betrayed him not because he was being good but because Ned's course of action wasn t beneficial to them. 

 

I also have no idea how Jorah went from a psycho stalker to a father figure in the show... 

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1 hour ago, kissdbyfire said:

 

And on a side note, what the fuck is the deal w/ Dany fans that think Jorah is oh-so-great for her? What the fuck, Jorah is a creepy stalker in the books, and the show, again, changed that, too. :ack: 

That's the same reason why I don't support Sansa/Sandor. Plus the fact that most of his dialogue with her is mocking her. And he apparently tried to rape her.

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On 1/31/2020 at 11:01 AM, Lord Varys said:

Yeah, one cannot stress this thing enough. They do not adapt a book series. They write scenes for actors (or rather: people who are actors in other productions but 'playing' more or less themselves in this one) doing what they like those actors doing. If they had cast Anthony Hopkins for, say, Doran Martell or Pycelle they would have him do some Hannibal-Lecter-like stuff - or other things they knew or liked him doing in some of the great movies he was in.

There is nothing wrong with casting big names for roles - but then you use the talents of the actor to properly play the fucking role you cast them for. You do not change the role to make it 'worthy of the actor's talents'. And you can see shit like that happening as early as season 2 with those pointless and repetitive Tywin-Arya scenes. Tywin Lannister was a great role and there was a moment when you could shine very bright and dominate the scenes - in season 3 and 4, but not back in season 2. Charles Dance didn't need to be dragged in so many scenes and places he had no point of being in.

It is not bad per se to write additional scenes for characters - to give more detail to some plots, to streamline things, etc. - but they never wrote scenes for characters. They always wrote them for their actors. And this is why there is no consistency to any of the characters in the show - even back when they were still adapting book material.

This is how they work - and it gets worse with their later development of having actors make faces with little to know dialogue to convey 'the plot' rather than actually acting. Even their TV shit show was a complex story, one you cannot really tell with minimal dialogue.

Speaking of Anthony Hopkins, I had a fan cast for Game of Thrones if it started in 2000 (a little more than 10 years before the show first aired), with Hopkins as Barristan Selmy, but with less Hannibal Lector and more Don Diego de la Vega. Imagine Daenerys meeting him in Astapor Like this.

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13 minutes ago, Dalinar said:

I don't know where to beginn to describe how wrong that is...:blink:. And I am not talking about evidence from the books. The concept itself is just wrong. Like really wrong. 

 

San/San is not the strangest 'ship for Sansa.  There's Sansa/Ramsay, Sansa/Tywin, Sansa/Arya, Sansa/Brienne, Sansa/Cersei, in addition to the "mainstream" options like Jon/Sansa, Margaery/Sansa, LF/Sansa, and Daenerys/Sansa.

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39 minutes ago, SeanF said:

San/San is not the strangest 'ship for Sansa.  There's Sansa/Ramsay, Sansa/Tywin, Sansa/Arya, Sansa/Brienne, Sansa/Cersei, in addition to the "mainstream" options like Jon/Sansa, Margaery/Sansa, LF/Sansa, and Daenerys/Sansa.

I vacillate between Jon/Sansa and Podrick/Sansa myself.

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51 minutes ago, SeanF said:

San/San is not the strangest 'ship for Sansa.  There's Sansa/Ramsay, Sansa/Tywin, Sansa/Arya, Sansa/Brienne, Sansa/Cersei, in addition to the "mainstream" options like Jon/Sansa, Margaery/Sansa, LF/Sansa, and Daenerys/Sansa.

You forgot Sweetrobin! And I'm sure there are others as well... Poor Sansa, the most shipped character ever! The main difference between Sandor and everyone else is that there are lots and lots of things in the books connecting him to Sansa, whereas there's fuck all supporting any of the others. IMO. And again IMO the cake (as in, the worst of all) goes to Jonsa. :ack:

Sadly the show destroyed all romance, together w/ the actual story. In the end there was nothing left... nothing left of the actual characters, nothing left of the actual story. Just dumb shocks that were so awfully boring. Yawn. 

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18 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

You forgot Sweetrobin! And I'm sure there are others as well... Poor Sansa, the most shipped character ever! The main difference between Sandor and everyone else is that there are lots and lots of things in the books connecting him to Sansa, whereas there's fuck all supporting any of the others. IMO. And again IMO the cake (as in, the worst of all) goes to Jonsa. :ack:

Sadly the show destroyed all romance, together w/ the actual story. In the end there was nothing left... nothing left of the actual characters, nothing left of the actual story. Just dumb shocks that were so awfully boring. Yawn. 

There are something like 5,000 stories dedicated to Jon/Sansa on Archive of Our Own.  In the books, there is no evidence at all that either thinks of the other romantically, or that they are particularly close.

I think the weirdest ship I've ever come across is one where Jon is married to Daenerys, but Rhaella survived childbirth, and is Jon's mistress.  Rhaella and Daenerys are in turn romantically involved with each other.

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26 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Sadly the show destroyed all romance, together w/ the actual story. In the end there was nothing left... nothing left of the actual characters, nothing left of the actual story. Just dumb shocks that were so awfully boring. Yawn. 

*insert David Hess song*

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2 hours ago, SeanF said:

There are something like 5,000 stories dedicated to Jon/Sansa on Archive of Our Own.  In the books, there is no evidence at all that either thinks of the other romantically, or that they are particularly close.

I think the weirdest ship I've ever come across is one where Jon is married to Daenerys, but Rhaella survived childbirth, and is Jon's mistress.  Rhaella and Daenerys are in turn romantically involved with each other.

The number, as it stands right now, is just over 7,000.

The popularity of Jon/Sansa seemed to have exponentially increased after Season 6. There were about 260 on that from 2010 (when the ship was first recorded) to 2016, then after "Book of the Stranger" (when Jon and Sansa reunited) and "The Winds of Winter" (when Jon's parentage was revealed), its popularity exploded. Why? I have some thoughts here.

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15 hours ago, SeanF said:

San/San is not the strangest 'ship for Sansa.  There's Sansa/Ramsay, Sansa/Tywin, Sansa/Arya, Sansa/Brienne, Sansa/Cersei, in addition to the "mainstream" options like Jon/Sansa, Margaery/Sansa, LF/Sansa, and Daenerys/Sansa.

This sounds more like kinky porn than writing and building up a relationship. But then again, GRRM wrote the "Mhyrish swamp", so what do I know. 

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6 hours ago, Dalinar said:

This sounds more like kinky porn than writing and building up a relationship. But then again, GRRM wrote the "Mhyrish swamp", so what do I know. 

Speaking of which......

I did once encounter a fic (now removed ) which involved Jon as an SS Camp Commander, Daenerys as a Senior Womens' Overseer, his girlfriend, and Sansa and Margaery as a pair of sex slaves.

I strongly suspect it was written by Benioff.

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