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Rant & Rave Season 8 [Spoilers]: When you are cool like a cucumber, as evil as the mother of madness, but never as perfect as the pet!


The Fattest Leech

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1 hour ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

To be completely fair, D&D were forced to finish a story that the author himself hasn't been able to finish in 30 years. Sure, maybe they should have done a better job, but it was no easy task.

They should have hired other writers to help them.

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On 6/19/2022 at 5:45 PM, The Bard of Banefort said:

I would have to agree. And that’s another big theme, that people felt ripped off, that there was no big secret or meaning at the core of the show too. I’m struck by that myself when I think back on the second half of the show—this pervading sense of emptiness. In the end, there was just no “there” there. Spectacle can’t compensate for a lack of substance. In the words of George Lucas, “a special effect without a story is a pretty boring thing.”

This is why I think that a Jon Snow sequel will probably be an attempt to salvage what they can of GOT’s legacy. People love to say that all HBO cares about is viewers, but I don’t think that’s completely true. For one, merchandise has all but disappeared (this is something I’ve heard a lot of first-hand accounts of from people who work retail). But I’m sure that the people who manage communications/marketing for GOT are also depressed as hell. I work in communications (albeit for a much smaller company), and part of your job is monitoring comments, reviews, etc. and then reporting them to your superiors. And you do get pretty invested in how people respond. Even if the Google analytics are good, there’s no way they’re oblivious to the negativity.

One thing I didn’t realize until after S8 was just how invested people were in the White Walkers. Even the marketing was more focused on the throne, but I guess a lot of people were more interested in the traditional fantasy elements. 

Unfortunately, a lot of readers also are starting to feel used by GRRM. I still have a lot of respect for him, but having a TV show finish your story before you do is a huge blow (and I’m sure he realizes that). And it just looks worse with each new TV project they announce.

To add onto this, one thing I’ve noticed is that a lot of people connected to the show—GRRM, the languages guy, even a make-up artist—are all publicly praising HOTD’s writing specifically. That signals to me that the comms/marketing team is very aware that this is a huge complaint about S8, one that has persisted beyond the petition. Pretty much every comments section on social media is filled with remarks about bad writing.

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Popping back in here for the first time in 2 years to share the news from the GoT news section that Emilia Clarke has confirmed the Jon Snow spinoff...

We will never be free, will we?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-61896580

Quote

And in response to a story in The Hollywood Reporter that Kit Harington will reprise his role as Jon Snow in a Game of Thrones sequel, Clarke says: "He has told me about it. And I know it exists. It's happening."

 

Then, perhaps realising she may have said more than she should have, she adds: "It's been created by Kit as far as I can understand, so he's in it from the ground up. So what you will be watching, hopefully, if it happens, is certified by Kit Harington."

 

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7 hours ago, SeanF said:

At least there’s a chance it will be an FU to Ding and Dong, then.

 

I like it: make it a good show by leaning into the ridiculousness and making it so bad it's good. Cersei's back and she has a machine gun. There is a Britney Spears concert in King's Landing

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I was thinking about how George gave D&D his outline between seasons 3 and 4, and then I vaguely recalled the Ds saying they came up with RamSan back is S2. I looked it up and sure enough, that’s what they said during S5 interviews. So obviously whatever George told them about her plot wasn’t enough to change their minds, but it also didn’t happen specifically because of what they found out from George either.

I tend to think that Sansa will return to King’s Landing before she goes north again (it seems very unlikely that she’ll stay married to Tyrion, and since he probably won’t be dying anytime soon, how else is she going to get annulment without returning to KL?) but there’s also the possibility that she could run into Jaime and Brienne instead. (In this case, Jaime is one of the few people who knows that Tyrion was legally married to Tysha, which would invalidate his marriage with Sansa, albeit less definitively).

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6 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I was thinking about how George gave D&D his outline between seasons 3 and 4, and then I vaguely recalled the Ds saying they came up with RamSan back is S2. I looked it up and sure enough, that’s what they said during S5 interviews. So obviously whatever George told them about her plot wasn’t enough to change their minds, but it also didn’t happen specifically because of what they found out from George either.

I tend to think that Sansa will return to King’s Landing before she goes north again (it seems very unlikely that she’ll stay married to Tyrion, and since he probably won’t be dying anytime soon, how else is she going to get annulment without returning to KL?) but there’s also the possibility that she could run into Jaime and Brienne instead. (In this case, Jaime is one of the few people who knows that Tyrion was legally married to Tysha, which would invalidate his marriage with Sansa, albeit less definitively).

Unless Harry Hardyng rapes Sansa on their wedding night.

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10 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I was thinking about how George gave D&D his outline between seasons 3 and 4, and then I vaguely recalled the Ds saying they came up with RamSan back is S2. I looked it up and sure enough, that’s what they said during S5 interviews. So obviously whatever George told them about her plot wasn’t enough to change their minds, but it also didn’t happen specifically because of what they found out from George either.

I tend to think that Sansa will return to King’s Landing before she goes north again (it seems very unlikely that she’ll stay married to Tyrion, and since he probably won’t be dying anytime soon, how else is she going to get annulment without returning to KL?) but there’s also the possibility that she could run into Jaime and Brienne instead. (In this case, Jaime is one of the few people who knows that Tyrion was legally married to Tysha, which would invalidate his marriage with Sansa, albeit less definitively).

Ram San was stupid, even without his being a monster, because there’s no way she’d willingly agree to marry the son of the man who murdered her family and his soldiers.

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15 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I was thinking about how George gave D&D his outline between seasons 3 and 4, and then I vaguely recalled the Ds saying they came up with RamSan back is S2. I looked it up and sure enough, that’s what they said during S5 interviews. So obviously whatever George told them about her plot wasn’t enough to change their minds, but it also didn’t happen specifically because of what they found out from George either.

I tend to think that Sansa will return to King’s Landing before she goes north again (it seems very unlikely that she’ll stay married to Tyrion, and since he probably won’t be dying anytime soon, how else is she going to get annulment without returning to KL?) but there’s also the possibility that she could run into Jaime and Brienne instead. (In this case, Jaime is one of the few people who knows that Tyrion was legally married to Tysha, which would invalidate his marriage with Sansa, albeit less definitively).

According to Tyrion, the marriage can be set aside by the High Septon or a council of faith.  We haven't been told what a council of faith is; my guess is it's whatever GRRM wants it to be.  And that's assuming she wants the marriage set aside.  Tyrion's not around, so the only reason would be remarriage.  At this point, her interest in remarriage is less than enthusiastic, so I can see her dragging her feet on the issue and using her marriage as a blocking mechanism to avoid being dangled as marriage bait.

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4 minutes ago, Nevets said:

According to Tyrion, the marriage can be set aside by the High Septon or a council of faith.  We haven't been told what a council of faith is; my guess is it's whatever GRRM wants it to be.  And that's assuming she wants the marriage set aside.  Tyrion's not around, so the only reason would be remarriage.  At this point, her interest in remarriage is less than enthusiastic, so I can see her dragging her feet on the issue and using her marriage as a blocking mechanism to avoid being dangled as marriage bait.

According to Ding & Dong, a marriage can just be dissolved in secret, and the children of any new union accepted as unquestionably legitimate.

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8 hours ago, SeanF said:

According to Ding & Dong, a marriage can just be dissolved in secret, and the children of any new union accepted as unquestionably legitimate.

I would reply fully to this, but I think I would have a stroke at the stupidity of that, so I'll keep it very short: BULLSHIT. 

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Show logic was unconsummated = unmarried, but then Sandra chose to marry other family killers, so... Show is like the upside down on Stranger Things.

I think real Sansa will shake the Lannister marriage as soon as humanly or animally possible (maybe do some skinchanging to make it happen!) If she wants to not be married off again, then immediately marry some guy she trusts (hmm, maybe some big guy who protected her before?)

Edited by Le Cygne
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On 6/26/2022 at 4:39 AM, SeanF said:

According to Ding & Dong, a marriage can just be dissolved in secret, and the children of any new union accepted as unquestionably legitimate.

Apparently it's the same in GRRM since nobody's brought up that Tyrion would be a bigamist.

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1 hour ago, Le Cygne said:

Show logic was unconsummated = unmarried, but then Sandra chose to marry other family killers, so... Show is like the upside down on Stranger Things.

I think real Sansa will shake the Lannister marriage as soon as humanly or animally possible (maybe do some skinchanging to make it happen!) If she wants to not be married off again, then immediately marry some guy she trusts (hmm, maybe some big guy who protected her before?)

But who would she trust? I don't trust book Sandor with her at all.

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On 6/26/2022 at 4:51 AM, SeanF said:

Ram San was stupid, even without his being a monster, because there’s no way she’d willingly agree to marry the son of the man who murdered her family and his soldiers.

And no way Littlefinger would hand her over to the Boltons, and no way he wouldn't' be aware of what Ramsay is.

Yet in the show he hands her over to the Boltons and is then surprised when it turns out badly.

Show Littlefinger is such an idiot.

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According to show!Littlefinger, he thought that Stannis would win. So if he wasn't lying (it's never clarified what he was thinking, because nothing really adds up), he would be marrying Sansa into the family Stannis was fighting against and hoping that Stannis would reward her instead of simply taking her straight to him. At the very least, Sansa outright accepted this explanation.

Roose also says in 601 that he's expecting a Lannister invasion (due to marrying Ramsay to an accomplice to regicide) and was thus prepared for a possible two front war and whatever exceedingly small amount of allies he would have after the House upon the Iron Throne stripped him of his rule over the north after less than two years.

Willingly or unwillingly, it doesn't add up however you slice it. At the end of the day it only benefitted their love of edgelord Ramsay by giving the character a forced marriage with a character we'd known since the beginning of the story.

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6 hours ago, Vaith said:

According to show!Littlefinger, he thought that Stannis would win. So if he wasn't lying (it's never clarified what he was thinking, because nothing really adds up), he would be marrying Sansa into the family Stannis was fighting against and hoping that Stannis would reward her instead of simply taking her straight to him. At the very least, Sansa outright accepted this explanation.

Roose also says in 601 that he's expecting a Lannister invasion (due to marrying Ramsay to an accomplice to regicide) and was thus prepared for a possible two front war and whatever exceedingly small amount of allies he would have after the House upon the Iron Throne stripped him of his rule over the north after less than two years.

Willingly or unwillingly, it doesn't add up however you slice it. At the end of the day it only benefitted their love of edgelord Ramsay by giving the character a forced marriage with a character we'd known since the beginning of the story.

More likely, Sansa would have burned at the stake by Melisandre, had Stannis won, to give thanks for victory.  She would simply be deemed a traitor.

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