Jump to content
Wolfkin

the Pact of Ice and Fire

Recommended Posts

I have found this very interesting while reading Fire & Blood.

Jacaerys Velaryon visits Winterfell in 129AC and meets with Cregan Stark, Lord of Winterfell
Jacaerys was ½ a year away from his 15th nameday, when he visited the North as his mother’s ambassador

Mushroom’s version of the story:
A young maiden, or ‘wolf girl’, with the name of Sara Snow. So smitten was Prince Jacaerys with the creature, a bastard daughter of the late Lord Rickon Stark, that he lay with her of a night. On learning that his guest had claimed the maidenhead of his bastard sister, Lord Cregan became most wroth, and only softened when Sara Snow told him that the prince had taken her for his wife. They had spoken their vows in Winterfell’s own godswood before a heart tree, and only then had she given herself to him, wrapped in furs amidst the snows as the old gods looked on.

Mushroom also claims that Vermax left a clutch of dragon’s eggs at Winterfell.

Cregan Stark and Jacaerys Velaryon reach an accord and signed and sealed the agreement that Grand Maester Munkun call ‘the Pact of Ice and Fire’ in his True Telling. Like many such pacts, it was sealed with a marriage. Prince Jacaerys was as yet unmarried and childless, but it was assumed that he would sire children of his own once his mother sat the Iron Throne. Under the terms of the pact, the prince’s firstborn daughter would be sent north at the age of seven, to be fostered at Winterfell until such a time as she was old enough to marry Lord Cregan’s heir.

Okay so, Sara Snow just told her 1/2 brother that she and Jacaerys were wed before the heart tree, yet these guys sign a pact stating that when he weds and sires his first daughter she is to journey to Winterfell and eventually wed the heir. Uhm, didn't he just wed Sara? A wedding before a heart tree is a 'legal' wedding in the North.  So he can't marry another!

And if I remember correctly, he doesn't live through the war, to marry another or have any children. So what if Jacaerys and Sara made a daughter on their wedding night? She would be at Winterfell already. Maybe it wasn't what they initially planned, but if Sara has a daughter by Jacaerys, well then that will be his only child. The daughter could certainly wed Winterfell's heir, and the pact would then be done/complete/sealed or whatever wording should be used.

And Vermax leaves a clutch of eggs.
With the knowledge a child was conceived? With a Targaryen bloodline?
Do the dragons know more than they are given credit for?
Yeah I know it's far-fetched, but it's a thought.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There does seem to be a pattern of these "near miss" Targaryen-Stark marriages, and they seem to be important. Either they are not "misses" after all, and the Targ-Stark bloodline has resulted in descendants (as you theorize about a possible daughter of Sara Snow and Prince Jacaerys) or someone wants to negotiate a legitimate union between these families, perhaps because a mix of the bloodline will result in special qualities or fulfill a prophecy or something.

As you note, the vows before the heart tree would be a legitimate marriage in the North, so this may be one of those GRRM-created situations where in-world people as well as readers could debate the legitimacy of a child (if there is one), just to make the "heir to the throne" debate more rich and complicated or to preserve a bloodline in an unexpected place. The report of dragon eggs left behind by Vermax may be a hint about the latter - a secret stash of Targaryen DNA stashed away for later potential use.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Wolfkin said:

Uhm, didn't he just wed Sara? A wedding before a heart tree is a 'legal' wedding in the North.  So he can't marry another!

My guess is that a wedding, like many other important wovs, must be done in sight of gods and men. And as no men were present to witness it, it's... questionable?

And the pact does Starks more good than declaring Jacaerys and Sara husband and wife. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The clutch of eggs left behind might not have been literal eggs, but figurative eggs; Targaryens (and Blackfyres) are repeatedly referred to figuratively as dragons in prophecy and dreams. For example, the Ghost of High Heart wasn't completely wrong when she said that a dragon would be born at Summerhall.

An (unhatched) egg can be interpreted as an unborn child, which means that if Jacaerys ans Sara did have sex with each other which resulted in a pregnancy, it absolutely fits the figurative meaning of a dragon egg being left behind.

Now onto another question; Vermax was said to leave a clutch of eggs at Winterfell. Did Sara give birth to twins? ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While I genuinely believe a lot of what Mushroom says, the problem is that he wasn't in Winterfell when the supposed marriage and supposed dragon eggs occurred. Sure maybe Jacaerys told people when he returned to Dragonstone but both stories seem unlikely to me. First Jacaerys was betrothed to Baela and marrying a bastard would have insulted her, Rhaenyra, Corlys and all the other blacks. Second, if Vermax did lay eggs, why wouldn't Jacaerys take them with him? Why would he leave five potential dragons in the North?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, wia said:

My guess is that a wedding, like many other important wovs, must be done in sight of gods and men. And as no men were present to witness it, it's... questionable?

Dragon eggs, plus offspring who can potentially ride a dragon means the story may have significance, even if the "secret marriage" is "questionable".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

Dragon eggs, plus offspring who can potentially ride a dragon means the story may have significance, even if the "secret marriage" is "questionable".

I was saying that the marriage of a prince and a bastard with no witnesses would seem questionable to the rulers of Westeros. Thus the parties involved decided to benefit from this union in other ways.

I was not saying that the story doesn't have significance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×