Aegon VII Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 3 hours ago, Moiraine Sedai said: Jon Rayder, son of Mance and Lyanna Aegon VII Targaryen, son of Mance(Rhaegar) and Lyanna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 10 minutes ago, Aegon VII said: Aegon VII Targaryen, son of Mance(Rhaegar) and Lyanna Mance is not Rhaegar. Mance is not Arthur Dayne. Mance is not Daario. Mance is not Old Nan. The truth, even if people wilfully disregard it, is that Mance is... Spoiler Mance Rayder ETA: and no, Mance is not Jon’s father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makk Posted June 6, 2019 Share Posted June 6, 2019 On 6/5/2019 at 4:53 AM, oggy1324 said: I think so too!! Just be aware that although I still agree with the first part of what I said, I actually changed my mind on the second part during this thread. I was basing it on a misremembered quote... Quote Every morning they had trained together, since they were big enough to walk; Snow and Stark, spinning and slashing about the wards of Winterfell, shouting and laughing, sometimes crying when there was no one else to see. They were not little boys when they fought, but knights and mighty heroes. "I'm Prince Aemon the Dragonknight," Jon would call out, and Robb would shout back, "Well, I'm Florian the Fool." Or Robb would say, "I'm the Young Dragon," and Jon would reply, "I'm Ser Ryam Redwyne." ...in which I thought Jon claimed he was the young dragon, when in fact that was Robb. I do think that quote has special meaning since there are such strong parallels between Robb and both the young dragon and Florian the fool. Which means there may well be between Jon and both Aemon the Dragonknight (there are some already in terms of his relationship to his cousin and his post of duty) and Ryawn Redwyne. So I don't think Rhaegar nor Lyana named him. They certainly didn't name him Aegon. But if they did I think Aemon is the best option symbolically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Man Posted June 6, 2019 Share Posted June 6, 2019 Jon Stark. The bastard issue of Brandon Stark with Lyanna Stark. I suppose he might be legitimate if the two said their vows in front of those weird trees in the north. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexis-something-Rose Posted June 6, 2019 Share Posted June 6, 2019 13 hours ago, kissdbyfire said: Mance is not Old Nan. Bummer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerg Sknab Posted June 9, 2019 Share Posted June 9, 2019 ToJ Jon Snow's true name is an mentioned before Aemon Targaryen his sisters true name is Visenya Targaryen rather than Meera Reed. The Jon Snow sired by Ned Stark on the fisherman's daughter while recooperating on Sisterton is Jon Snow or Jon Stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegon VII Posted June 9, 2019 Share Posted June 9, 2019 On 6/5/2019 at 4:09 PM, kissdbyfire said: Mance is not Rhaegar. Mance is not Arthur Dayne. Mance is not Daario. Mance is not Old Nan. The truth, even if people wilfully disregard it, is that Mance is... Reveal hidden contents Mance Rayder ETA: and no, Mance is not Jon’s father. When you phrase it as “even if people willfully disregard it”, it’s quite condescending. It’s possible to disagree with people without being rude. You may not believe mance is rhaegar, that doesn’t change the fact that there’s a lot of evidence that supports it and a number of people who consider it a valid theory. Maybe they know something you don’t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted June 9, 2019 Share Posted June 9, 2019 13 minutes ago, Aegon VII said: When you phrase it as “even if people willfully disregard it”, it’s quite condescending. It’s possible to disagree with people without being rude. You may not believe mance is rhaegar, that doesn’t change the fact that there’s a lot of evidence that supports it and a number of people who consider it a valid theory. Maybe they know something you don’t I didn’t mean to sound condescending, so if it came across that way I apologise. As to there being “a lot of evidence that supports it”, can you elaborate? Because what I have seen people claiming it’s evidence for Mance being Rhaegar over the years was anything but. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyOfCastamere Posted June 9, 2019 Share Posted June 9, 2019 On 6/6/2019 at 3:53 AM, Makk said: Just be aware that although I still agree with the first part of what I said, I actually changed my mind on the second part during this thread. I was basing it on a misremembered quote... ...in which I thought Jon claimed he was the young dragon, when in fact that was Robb. I do think that quote has special meaning since there are such strong parallels between Robb and both the young dragon and Florian the fool. Which means there may well be between Jon and both Aemon the Dragonknight (there are some already in terms of his relationship to his cousin and his post of duty) and Ryawn Redwyne. So I don't think Rhaegar nor Lyana named him. They certainly didn't name him Aegon. But if they did I think Aemon is the best option symbolically. I agree, plus we know Grrm likes to play with idea of history repeating itself, so I would not be surprised if Jon turns out to be another Aemon who refuses to become King in favor of his younger sibling. Though I would be very very happy if he simply stayed Jon since it fits his personality perfectly. All the Targ names strike me as somewhat shiny sparkly glorious and that is just not him. Jon, in his terms, is a simple man who doesn't seek glory and all that bullcrap but rather wants to do his duty and care for his family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 On 6/6/2019 at 1:09 AM, kissdbyfire said: Mance is not Rhaegar. Mance is not Arthur Dayne. Mance is not Daario. Mance is not Old Nan. The truth, even if people wilfully disregard it, is that Mance is... Hide contents Mance Rayder ETA: and no, Mance is not Jon’s father. You think it’s only a coincidence we see Mance only after Benjen, who is not daario, is lost? Do you? Aemon. Rhaegar liked maester Aemon, whose younger brother and Rhaegar’s ancestor, Aegon, got crowned only because he refused to sit on the throne. Aemon even went to the watch so he will not be used against his brother. So there could be some parallels here. With Jon, who is as reluctant to take power as his namesake, his greatish uncle we have another Aemon and Aegon pair, the others being Maester Aemon and Egg, Dragonknight and Unworthy, Jahaerys I’s Aegon who died as a babe and Aemon father of the dancers. One of Jon’s favorite (historical) Targaryens is also named Aemon and like Jon and maester Aemon, he is also sworn an oath for a duty that prevents marriage and land holding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingMudd Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 On 12/28/2018 at 4:24 AM, Dorian Martell's son said: He will accept that his mother and father are Lyanna and Rhaegar, But his dad has always been and always be Ned I could see Ned saying to Jon "He may have been your father, boy. But he wasn't your daddy." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 Either Aemon or Jaehaerys. Jon would claim Aemon the Dragonknight when playing with Robb as a boy. And there's a line where he thinks that he's no Aemon Targaryen. Plus Rhaegar and Uncle Aemon were penpals, at least about prophecy stuff. Jaehaerys just because it starts with a J and so does Jon. Jon Arryn as the inspiration makes a nice cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br16 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 On 12/28/2018 at 4:07 AM, EvanSol919 said: In conclusion, I believe that Jon Snow's real name is Aemon Targaryen. What if it was Gaemon Targaryen, after Aenar's son? It would rhyme with Aemon . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 On 6/9/2019 at 11:09 AM, Gerg Sknab said: ToJ Jon Snow's true name is an mentioned before Aemon Targaryen his sisters true name is Visenya Targaryen rather than Meera Reed. The Jon Snow sired by Ned Stark on the fisherman's daughter while recooperating on Sisterton is Jon Snow or Jon Stone. Meera Reed looks just like any girl from the crannogs would. She is the daughter of Howland Reed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerg Sknab Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 11 hours ago, Lady Blizzardborn said: Meera Reed looks just like any girl from the crannogs would. She is the daughter of Howland Reed. Huh? How is that? You know full well Reed heard Stark's call to Banners and answered the call. Just that fact makes all but impossible for Reed to be Meera's father as the rebellion lasted close to a year and Stark's tour to Storm's End, and the Tower of Joy would add another two months . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 On 6/27/2019 at 8:47 AM, Gerg Sknab said: Huh? How is that? You know full well Reed heard Stark's call to Banners and answered the call. Just that fact makes all but impossible for Reed to be Meera's father as the rebellion lasted close to a year and Stark's tour to Storm's End, and the Tower of Joy would add another two months . Meera is the same age as, or older than Robb and Jon. Since we know Robb was conceived near the start of the war that means Meera could have been conceived before the war even began. It doesn't take long for a conception to occur, and the actual egg fertilization can take place up to a couple of days after the couple had intercourse. Howland could have gotten the summons during the day, used the night to say goodbye to his wife, and Meera was the result of that goodbye. If you've read the books you know that Meera has the typical looks of the crannogs: brown hair, green eyes, short and slim. One of her parents at least is of the crannogs, so unless you think Rhaegar had a fling with some short girl from the Neck, Meera is Howland Reed's daughter. There's also absolutely nothing in the text for clues to her having any kind of Targaryen heritage. Zero Targ symbolism around that girl. If Jon has a twin, it's either Aegon (slim chance) or Dany (even slimmer chance). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Aegon The Compromiser Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 Either Stark or Dayne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aemon Darkbrother Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 Personally, I think Jon is of the line of Queen Rhaella and Bonifer the good. Danaerys is the daughter Aerys Targaryan and Ashara Dayne. The PTWP could be a daughter of Jon (Aegon) and Danny. Thus the PTWP would indeed be of the line of Aerys and Rhaella albeit not in the way we expected. Mance could very well be Rhaegar in glamor. The gift of prophecy might explain Mances driving motive for uniting the wildings beyond the wall. I think that if we end up seeing Jon kill Mance, it'd only strengthen the theory as it would parallel the story of Bael the Bard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Aemon Darkbrother said: Mance could very well be Rhaegar in glamor. The gift of prophecy might explain Mances driving motive for uniting the wildings beyond the wall. I think that if we end up seeing Jon kill Mance, it'd only strengthen the theory as it would parallel the story of Bael the Bard. So, when Mel uses a glamor to make Mance look like Rattleshirt he is twice-glamored? One glamor on top of another? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aemon Darkbrother Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 44 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: So, when Mel uses a glamor to make Mance look like Rattleshirt he is twice-glamored? One glamor on top of another? Very well could be, imo. It's not so hard for me to wrap my brain around considering all the crazy concepts in george's story. Rhagear must have had some experience with this sort of thing. All this talk of Rhaegars rubies really make me suspect that the man was much more knowledgeable than we give him credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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