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Iskaral Pust

Football: the winter break

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3 hours ago, Heartofice said:

An early goal for Burton in the second leg could really test City's mental strength, anything could happen at that point.

lol

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Someone at work just pointed out that palace lost 9-0 to liverpool in 89, and then knocked them out of the cup later on the same season. 

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13 hours ago, Heartofice said:

An early goal for Burton in the second leg could really test City's mental strength, anything could happen at that point.

A cold Tuesday at Burton in January, those millionaires won't fancy it. 

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Valencia's sporting director has confirmed that Batshuayi's loan has been terminated and he will be returning to Chelsea. Di Marzio reporting that AC Milan have no intention of allowing Higuain to leave due to the difficulty of finding a replacement.

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32 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

Valencia's sporting director has confirmed that Batshuayi's loan has been terminated and he will be returning to Chelsea. Di Marzio reporting that AC Milan have no intention of allowing Higuain to leave due to the difficulty of finding a replacement.

Just realised how poor his record has been there. I was under the impression he'd found his scoring boots at Dortmund and would do well. Clearly circumstances need to be right for him to perform.

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Bit harsh to taunt Burton. Yes, it's a ludircous scoreline, but then again, City is the 100 point from the last EPL and they have given stronger teams a beating. So to mock a third tier team (and not even a good one) over this really feels lame.

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Emery confirms Arsenal has no money to buy anyone and can only make loan deals. It's absolutely amazing how poorly the squad was managed the last 3-4 years and it's going to have massive implications on Emery's ability to build a team to fit what he wants to do. Really frustrating as an Arsenal fan.

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2 hours ago, Mexal said:

Emery confirms Arsenal has no money to buy anyone and can only make loan deals. It's absolutely amazing how poorly the squad was managed the last 3-4 years and it's going to have massive implications on Emery's ability to build a team to fit what he wants to do. Really frustrating as an Arsenal fan.

I am not so sure. WE don't know how cash strapped Wenger was during that period. Kroenke does not enjoy the reptation to be particularly open handed with regards to investing into his sports teams.

In other news: rumour de Jong to Barca and not PSG.

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11 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

I am not so sure. WE don't know how cash strapped Wenger was during that period. Kroenke does not enjoy the reptation to be particularly open handed with regards to investing into his sports teams.

In other news: rumour de Jong to Barca and not PSG.

No, we absolutely do know. The way they managed Sanchez, Ramsey, Ozil, Mhki, Perez, etc contracts and fees both buying/selling. I don't blame it all on Wenger. I think the ultimate blame goes to Gazidis who ran the fuck away. 

As for Kroenke, he's definitely part of the issue. He is pretty much the only owner in the PL that hasn't put money into the team. So yea, big issue but that doesn't change the way they managed contracts and players has been abysmal and is part of the reason the team is in the place it is in.

Edited by Mexal

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1 hour ago, Mexal said:

No, we absolutely do know. The way they managed Sanchez, Ramsey, Ozil, Mhki, Perez, etc contracts and fees both buying/selling. I don't blame it all on Wenger. I think the ultimate blame goes to Gazidis who ran the fuck away. 

As for Kroenke, he's definitely part of the issue. He is pretty much the only owner in the PL that hasn't put money into the team. So yea, big issue but that doesn't change the way they managed contracts and players has been abysmal and is part of the reason the team is in the place it is in.

Arsenal's board have also woefully underperformed on the commercial front bringing in around £91m in commercial revenue compared to £136m for Liverpool. Seeing as how Wenger had Arsenal qualifying for CL football in every season bar his last two as well as Arsenal being a whole lot more successful than Liverpool during his tenure, Arsenal really should be doing much better than Liverpool on the commercial front. The club is probably earning at least 50 million less than what they should be. 

Handling of player contracts aside, it's still really odd that Arsenal aren't able to sign anyone other than loan deals considering the club has the 2nd biggest cash reserves in world football, the 5th highest wage bill in the league and are in the top 5 in the world in terms of match day revenue. Maybe there is an issue with the EPL's short term cost controls but looking at the finances, Arsenal really should be able to offer Emery more than just loan deals. It seems more like Kroenke refusing to sanction spending. 

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7 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

Arsenal's board have also woefully underperformed on the commercial front bringing in around £91m in commercial revenue compared to £136m for Liverpool. Seeing as how Wenger had Arsenal qualifying for CL football in every season bar his last two as well as Arsenal being a whole lot more successful than Liverpool during his tenure, Arsenal really should be doing much better than Liverpool on the commercial front. The club is probably earning at least 50 million less than what they should be. 

Handling of player contracts aside, it's still really odd that Arsenal aren't able to sign anyone other than loan deals considering the club has the 2nd biggest cash reserves in world football, the 5th highest wage bill in the league and are in the top 5 in the world in terms of match day revenue. Maybe there is an issue with the EPL's short term cost controls but looking at the finances, Arsenal really should be able to offer Emery more than just loan deals. It seems more like Kroenke refusing to sanction spending. 

The bold is mostly true. The other issue is Kroenke not putting any of his own money into the team unlike every other owner in the league.

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44 minutes ago, Mexal said:

The bold is mostly true. The other issue is Kroenke not putting any of his own money into the team unlike every other owner in the league.

It's pretty reasonable for an investor with a profit motive to not offer capital injections for a transfer.  It's not like one more player will help them win the title or the CL this season.  CL qualification might be at stake but probably would not deliver enough additional profit for an investor to get excited about.

But the whole point is that the club does not need a sugar-daddy owner.  Only City, PSG and Chelsea have those, and Chelsea's is less generous lately.  All of the other clubs spend within their means.  Arsenal have pretty deep financial resources: in 2017 they had more revenue than Liverpool & Chelsea and well ahead of Spurs.  In 2018 they will probably still be close to Liverpool (despite a CL final), ahead of Chelsea and still well ahead of Spurs.  This is not an impoverished club.  They have the means to spend if they wish without special injections from owners.  If they want to do a gradual build under a new manager, then that's not unreasonable (that's what Liverpool did with Klopp).  If they're a little gun-shy because of how spending in recent years has turned out, then that's not unreasonable either.  They have actually spent a ton of money on Ozil, Sanchez, Welbeck, Cech, Lacazette, Auba, Xhaka, Mustafi, Torreira, Leno, Perez, Chambers, Paulista, Sokratis, etc, without getting much back.  Arsenal have a higher net spend than Liverpool over the last five years, even after Liverpool spent so much in 2018 and wasted the Suarez money in 2014.  And much higher than Spurs.

I got annoyed when Liverpool supporters used to complain that FSG weren't spending enough.  How many hundreds of millions do you expect someone else to pay just so you can have bragging rights on a Saturday afternoon?

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34 minutes ago, Iskaral Pust said:

They have actually spent a ton of money on Ozil, Sanchez, Welbeck, Cech, Lacazette, Auba, Xhaka, Mustafi, Torreira, Leno, Perez, Chambers, Paulista, Sokratis, etc, without getting much back

Depends.

Sanchez time at Arsenal probably gets overshadowed a bit by his last year there. But it's not like he has always played rubbish. Similar story with Özil, they wanted a #10 for the final pass, and he delivered on that more often than not (at least under Wenger), that he has deficits in other aspects of his game, that's not really his fault. He worked as advertised, if Arsenal wanted something else, they should ahve signed someone else. The contract extension esp. with the wages they are paying him now for not playing was of course ludicrous. Mustafi, well, you can check the older threads, I was sceptical of him, as in a good/solid defender but not really worldclass (so he also kinda performs as advertised). Chambers was a highly rated youngster, when he signed for Arsenal. But he fell short of his promise (a bit like Walcott if you will), so yeah, on this one they didn't get much back. I thought Leno has thus far played a rather convincing season, behind a not so super solid defense. This is also his first year in the EPL, taking all that into consideration I think Arsenal got their money's worth thus far from him. Cech was/is this aged goalkeeper past his prime, he as sort of a stop gap solution until they could bring in a proper goalkeeper for the next 8 years or so. They desperately needed an goalkeeper upgrade when they signed him. His decline was probably far more advanced than they had expected. Sokratis was not that expensive by EPL standards and he is also doing mostly as advertised, you can (rightly argue) they should have used the money they spent on both Sokratis and Mustafi to get one top class centreback instead of two centrebacks who are simply not in that elite bracket. With regards to Aubameyang, they needed/wanted a goalscorer, that'S what they got.

 

Edited by A Horse Named Stranger

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And don't forget about Torreira. He had a poor game against Liverpool but other than that he's made the €25m price tag look like a steal. 

While they did screw up contracts with certain players, Arsenal are still among the wealthiest clubs in the world and don't need Kroenke to inject his own money into the club. It's not like they have a crippling wage bill either - their wage/revenue ratio is around 50% which is considered good. Their net spend over the last three transfer windows is around £65m and the club has in excess of £200m in cash reserves which is the 2nd highest in the world behind United. That's why this whole "no money to spend" is total bullshit. The only reasonable conclusion is that Kroenke is simply refusing to sanction spending. 

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1 hour ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Depends.

 

37 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

And don't forget about Torreira. He had a poor game against Liverpool but other than that he's made the €25m price tag look like a steal. 

When I said "without getting much back" I meant that they did not receive a lot of transfer fees for the players who left.  Certainly nowhere similar to Liverpool and Spurs over the past five years.  Arsenal literally didn't get much back;  no reference to the figurative repayment in performances on the field.

Whether the fees spent got them the right talent/performances is a mixed bunch, just like any other club.  I don't think they've had any clangers like Andy Carroll, Charlie Adams, Stewart Downing, Christian Benteke, Mario Balotelli, Alberto Aquilani, etc, and they picked up some great (expensive) attacking talents here and there alongside a high quantity of mid-priced players.  They had the fourth highest net spend over the past five years and they sit fifth in the table -- they're basically living up to expectations.  United are vastly underperforming and Spurs are significantly outperforming.  Everyone else is reasonably in line.  Liverpool are temporarily outperforming but let's see if that actually lasts.

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And now they’re in a tough spot where they are outside the top 4, spend 350k a week on a player who can’t get in the side, have an aging team, losing some of their most valuable players for free and seem to have limited funds to spend. I hope their scouting is good as they’re going to need to find some gems like Guendozi could be. I love young talent but man it’s a long road.

Edited by Mexal

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8 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

When I said "without getting much back" I meant that they did not receive a lot of transfer fees for the players who left.  Certainly nowhere similar to Liverpool and Spurs over the past five years.  Arsenal literally didn't get much back;  no reference to the figurative repayment in performances on the field.

Ah, ok. It wasn't that obvious that you just viewed it from a mere transfer fee perspective. This feels like a very narrow perspective anyway. As it ignores prize money (if the transfer works out and makes the team better), increased marketing value and some other stuff a star player can bring to the table.

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10 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

When I said "without getting much back" I meant that they did not receive a lot of transfer fees for the players who left.  Certainly nowhere similar to Liverpool and Spurs over the past five years.  Arsenal literally didn't get much back;  no reference to the figurative repayment in performances on the field.

Fair enough. Although your post was very unclear because you included players like Auba, Xhaka, Lacazette and Torreira in the list. Xhaka is only 26 so Arsenal could still recoup a decent transfer fee for him if they wish to sell. Same goes for Lacazette. Torreira was a bargain at €25m. Even Auba could still command a big fee due to the shortage of top class CF's but his resale value is irrelevant because Arsenal will not want to sell as there is no player they could realistically sign who would be anywhere near his quality. Really the contract screw ups mostly applies to players like Sanchez, Ramsey, Gnabry, Perez and Özil (only because of his wages and him not being part of the starting XI anymore). 

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On 1/10/2019 at 8:38 PM, A Horse Named Stranger said:

In other news: rumour de Jong to Barca and not PSG.

It seems that the Spanish and French media are trying to outdo each other. Spanish outlets convinced it's a done deal for Barca while French media are saying it's a done deal for PSG. Dutch outlet (De Telegraaf) remains firm in their stance that PSG is de Jong's preferred destination and it seems that PSG are the only club prepared to meet Ajax's valuation as well as fees to various intermediaries. 

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