Who Hatched the Last Dragon?

[Morte]

Just now, Jova Snow said:

We're Baratheons themselves Valyrian? Is it possible Aerion used First Night to have a child with Papa Baratheons wife and Papa Baratheon was a mere Knight of Andal descent? Since Orys had black hair and black eyes I can't see anything Valyrian in him. 

The first Baratheon is the bastard brother of Aegon and his sisters (Orys), so yes: House Baratheon is Valyrian, but not "ancient" as the other.

[The Commentator]

45 minutes ago, Jova Snow said:

Were Baratheons Valyrians themselves? Is it possible Aerion used First Night to have a child with Papa Baratheons wife and Papa Baratheon was a mere Knight of Andal descent? Since Orys had black hair and black eyes I can't see anything Valyrian in him. 

There are different classes of Valyrians.  Think of it as a hierarchy.  At the very top of the social pyramid are the Dragonlords.  The Targaryens are members of the Dragonlord class.  There were only forty of these families.  They ruled Valyria and its territories.  Beneath them are other lesser nobles.  Vassal houses.  The Velaryons and the Celtigars are such.  The Baratheons are farther down in the social class.  They had no need to keep their blood pure because they were not dragon riders.  

[asongofheresy]

@Morte and @Widowmaker 811 do you guys think it was Orys who gave himself the Baratheon surname? F&B tells us dragonseeds were celebrated by Targaryen Lords so is it possible Baratheon "father" was a knight at service of Aerion and had a common wife? Surely they are at the bottom of the Valyrian pyramid because other than Orys they didn't had any Valyrian blood we know of. 

[Morte]

54 minutes ago, Jova Snow said:

@Morte and @Widowmaker 811 do you guys think it was Orys who gave himself the Baratheon surname? F&B tells us dragonseeds were celebrated by Targaryen Lords so is it possible Baratheon "father" was a knight at service of Aerion and had a common wife? Surely they are at the bottom of the Valyrian pyramid because other than Orys they didn't had any Valyrian blood we know of. 

Good question. For this we would need more informations about Valyria and Valyrian society. The -on in Baratheon points toward being an Valyrian name (although it is not needed, as we see with "Celtigar", but they may have lost the -on during thousands of years of acclimatization), but to answer your question we would not only need to know if Valyrian lower classes/commoners did have family names (for example: in Rome everybody had family names and could even have cognomina, while in many other cultures people would only wear the name of their father (and/or mother) as a surname, or not even that), but also more about Orys' presumed parents.

Unfortunatly, we don't have that information. Maybe one could make an educated guess if given the meaning of the names (if there is any). But we don't have that either.

If someone has such insights from GRRM's blog, questions during a CON or any other mean, please share!

[asongofheresy]

1 hour ago, Morte said:

Good question. For this we would need more informations about Valyria and Valyrian society. The -on in Baratheon points toward being an Valyrian name (although it is not needed, as we see with "Celtigar", but they may have lost the -on during thousands of years of acclimatization), but to answer your question we would not only need to know if Valyrian lower classes/commoners did have family names (for example: in Rome everybody had family names and could even have cognomina, while in many other cultures people would only wear the name of their father (and/or mother) as a surname, or not even that), but also more about Orys' presumed parents.

Unfortunatly, we don't have that information. Maybe one could make an educated guess if given the meaning of the names (if there is any). But we don't have that either.

Is it possible their name is supposed to be like Bar Emmon? Or maybe there is a V to B sound change like in Turkish and the original name was Varatheon? Theon itself is used by Starks and Greyjoys so maybe original papa Baratheon was a First Men? 

[Moiraine Sedai]

Orys was sired long after the Targaryens left the empire.  He could have been conceived anywhere.  His mother might have customs that are neither of Valyria nor of Westeros.  Mom could be from the free cities.  His father had flying transportation and had the means to travel. Baratheon might be the mom's name.  The place where the family originated. 

[Morte]

23 minutes ago, Jova Snow said:

Is it possible their name is supposed to be like Bar Emmon? Or maybe there is a V to B sound change like in Turkish and the original name was Varatheon? Theon itself is used by Starks and Greyjoys so maybe original papa Baratheon was a First Men? 

Don't read too much into it, I doubt that GRRM did consider the meaning of the names when he invented then.

But Orys mom (and, if existing, formal father) could have indeed been anyone, as Moiraine pointed out:

20 minutes ago, Moiraine Sedai said:

Orys was sired long after the Targaryens left the empire.  He could have been conceived anywhere.  His mother might have customs that are neither of Valyria nor of Westeros.  Mom could be from the free cities.  His father had flying transportation and had the means to travel. Baratheon might be the mom's name.  The place where the family originated. 

Or she might have been a serving maid on Dragonstone or a fisherman's daughter of Andal or First Men heritage, or ... or ...

From the Wiki (source F&B):

Quote

Aegon I's grandson Jaehaerys I Targaryen considered it an open secret that Orys was Aerion's bastard son, from the way his parents spoke of him (as Orys died when he was only three years old). Nonetheless, even Jaehaerys said he knew absolutely nothing about Orys's mother or the circumstances of his birth, not even rumors. As for whether Orys was conceived as a product of First Night or just a youthful dalliance by Aerion, Jaehaerys also said that he had no knowledge one way or the other

 

[asongofheresy]

1 hour ago, Morte said:

Don't read too much into it, I doubt that GRRM did consider the meaning of the names when he invented then.

But Orys mom (and, if existing, formal father) could have indeed been anyone, as Moiraine pointed out:

Or she might have been a serving maid on Dragonstone or a fisherman's daughter of Andal or First Men heritage, or ... or ...

From the Wiki (source F&B):

 

I love house Baratheon, wish we know more about them

[Seams]

On 1/3/2019 at 11:32 AM, Moiraine Sedai said:

The dragons of later years got progressively weaker.  Perhaps as a reflection of the family becoming weaker.  I.E., the blood becoming less pure.  Me, I think it's because of the unnatural conditions of the way they were kept.  Dragons are not horses that should be kept in stables.  A constant diet of beef lacked variety.  Beef, bfag, how downright boring.  Dragons ate krakens and god knows what other delicacies in the wild.  And volcanoes.  Maybe they grow hardier if they have access to volcanoes.

 

On 1/3/2019 at 1:47 PM, Jova Snow said:

Well Dragonstone surely plays a part and we know Drogo is the biggest because he is free unlike other dragons but I do not think Targaryen blood become weakrr until Daeron's marriage to Myriah because all other previous Targaryen marriages seems to be between Targaryens and other Valyrians with the exception of Maegor (not counting Rhaena) and Daella? 

This is a great thread. It may help us to figure out things about Daenerys and why she was able to hatch the three eggs when all others failed.

I agree with @Moiraine Sedai that the diminishing dragon population was a reflection of the weakening Targaryen dynasty. The dying-off of the dragons coincides with infighting among members of the family, as well as a loss of the kind of "noble" attitude about governing that we saw with Jaehaerys and Alysanne. I suspect the mixing of non-Valyrian bloodlines with the Targaryen family line was also a factor, although that is more complicated than the reader is able to pin down with certainty.

Aegon III had a dislike of dragons and also a despair about life. The things that caused him to dislike dragons were all associated with the disintegration of the Targaryen family and attacks by family members on each other. He probably didn't really care about being king and he may have felt his family no longer deserved to rule, given the horrors he observed.

From the minute I read the early versions of Targ history, I assumed the man who became Viserys II was an imposter. The real Viserys probably really did die in the ship from which Aegon escaped, or somewhere in Essos. The Rogare family saw an opportunity or the small council thought a "return" of Viserys might help to pull Aegon out of his funk and help him to be a better king and/or produce offspring who would stabilize the monarchy. (I haven't yet read F&B, so let me know if there is detail in there that supports or contradicts the legitimacy of Viserys II.)

If an imposter Viserys is GRRM's hint to us, then the "Targaryen" descendants of Viserys II and Larra Rogare are less legitimate than the Blackfyres, who are descended from Daena (legit) as well as Aegon IV (non-legit Targ), or the Plumm and Penrose and Waters/Longwaters descendants of Elaena (legit).

GRRM likes to show important things in groups of three or patterns of three, and the three sisters locked in the Maiden Vault seem like one of those important groups. The wiki reminds me that Daena and Elaena were very much alike, while their sister Rhaena was cut from a different cloth. Rhaena had the last healthy dragon, right? Named Morning? (A different Rhaena, from an earlier generation.) I like the OP theory that Daena may have been responsible for hatching the weakling "last" dragon that Ser Arlan of Pennytree saw on a visit to King's Landing. The history doesn't say that Elaena hatched her dragon egg, but it was her most cherished possession and it matched her hair.

Some people in the forum have kindly indulged my obsession with wordplay, and I think this is a case where the hair / heir pun is apparent (so to speak). Elaena is the matriarch of the last "legitimate" Targaryen heirs (if the Viserys II = imposter theory is true and if the Blackfyres truly died out with the death of Maelys the Monstrous). But she cuts off her hair and sends it to her pious brother/king, Baelor I. I think the hair cutting (similar to the hair cutting in The Sworn Sword) is a symbolic way of showing that the true heirs of the bloodline may be disconnected from the royal family just as Elaena's hair is no longer connected to her head. If we find that platinum white dragon egg with the gold embellishments, I think we will find some hidden Targ heirs from among the descendants of Princess Elaena.

The hatching of the so-called last dragon might be better understood by examining the details of the successful hatching achieved by Dany. What are some of the circumstances of that hatching?

1) It takes place in the sea - the Dothraki Sea. I think there may be a Waters / Velaryon connection here, which would be a fit for Elaena's first love. This also fits with the idea that dragons are more likely to hatch and thrive on the island known as Dragonstone.

2) Khal Drogo, Mirri Maz Duur, Dany's baby (Rhaego) and Dany's brother (Viserys) all die before or during the dragon hatching ceremony. Drogo, Rhaego and Viserys are all "reborn" as dragons. What is Mirri Maz Duur's role in the ritual? Recall that she is from a tribe known as the Lamb Men. Her death may be the equivalent of sacrificing a sheep. We do see dragons eating sheep in Essos and in the Nettles story.

3) Dany's hair burns off in the pyre, perhaps echoing Elaena cutting off her hair in the Maiden Vault.

4) Dany's eggs were thought to be petrified before she started to sense life within them and successfully hatch them. I think there is some wordplay around the name of Ossifer Plumm, who was thought to be dead but who (they say) miraculously fathered a child on Elaena before he expired. "Ossifer" sounds like "ossified," which means "turned to stone." The Plumm surname is similar to the plum fruit, which I associate with Targaryens and with pregnancy (in the linked post, scroll down to the paragraph beginning with, "Another random . . .  " in the Indigo Guard section, if you don't want to wade through the whole thing). So the implication might be that the embryo in the egg has been put on hold - turned to stone, in a sense - until someone comes along who can bring it back to life. Just as we see Dany's three eggs hatching, it would not surprise me at all if we see more action from Plumm, Penrose and Waters/Longwaters characters in the remaining books.

5) I have suspected that there is a pun on pyromancer and pyre + romance. Pyromancer is another name for an alchemist, the magical guys who know how to make wild fire, among other things. Dany orders the pyre built and lit, and then she climbs into it and has a kind of mystical experience of having sex with Khal Drogo one last time. In other words, she experiences a pyre romance, so to speak. I suspect this is the source of the magic that is one of the key missing ingredients in the many failed attempts to hatch dragon eggs: the hatching may require love; possibly even the good sexual chemistry between two people who truly love each other. (I realize that Targs expected dragon eggs to hatch in babies' cradles, but maybe the magic there is that the babies were born from the love between their parents; the arranged, loveless marriages in later generations took their toll on the dragon population as well as the Targ family interpersonal relationships.) Princess Elaena apparently has that kind of love with her first lover, Lord Alyn Velaryon.

This is getting too long, so I may try to dive into the discussion again later, if the thread has any life to it. I think we also need to examine:

• Names of the dragons and their symbolism (colors are important) for hints about the interrelationship between the Targaryen dynasty and the dragon population.
• Dragon seeds. For instance, in English, nettles are a plant that has jagged leaves and hairs (!?) that sort of sting if they come in contact with skin. The possibility is real that GRRM is alluding to thorns when he names a character Nettles. In ASOIAF, thorns are related to both roses and thrones. Does the love affair between Prince Daemon and Nettles symbolize that he was the last Targaryen to occupy the "throne"? Or does it tell us to keep an eye on House Tyrell, with its rose sigil, for hints about the return of the dragons? Or, again, Elaena's Penrose line of descent.
• Maesters and the tension between them and alchemists. In my slow re-read of the Dunk & Egg stories, it finally occurred to me that there is wordplay on "maester" and "stream." The idea of history (usually written by maesters) as a river or stream makes some sense, but some rivers have more than one fork; other rivers change course (e.g. at the inn at the crossroads); other rivers have oxbows that may rejoin a river when the flow is high. Sometimes people build bridges across streams, other times they wade in and ford the streams. Understanding the role that maesters play in killing off the dragon population may help to expose their larger role in the books, and vice versa.

[asongofheresy]

@Seams I do not think Targaryen line weakened until Daeron II

Aegon = Rhaenys (siblings)

Aenys = Alyssa (Targaryen-Velaryon)

Jaehaerys = Alysanne (siblings)

Baelon = Alyssa (siblings)

Viserys = Aemma Arryn (cousins)

Daemon = Rhaenyra (uncle - niece)

Aegon III = Daenaera (Targaryen-Velaryon)

Viserys II * = Larra Rogare (Lyseni if not Targaryen & Lyseni marriage)

Aegon IV = Naerys (siblings) 

Daeron II = Myriah (Targaryen - Dornish) 

Thank you for talking about Viserys' legitimacy btw although Aegon never seem to doubt his brother's identity, it is possible Viserys was a fake or if he was real Larra was already pregnant when she wed him since she was nineteen at the time, so there is a great chance Blackfyres were the legimate line and Daeron II's parentage had no affect if Daemon ended up discovering Viserys II and/or Aegon IV were fake. 

And we don't know Daemon's parentage - Daena never named a father and we don't know what was the reason for Aegon to claim Daemon after twelve years, he could do it only because he hated the Dornish and didn't want his half Dornish grandson, Baelor to have Blackfyre and since Baelor and Daemon were same age he could try to create a rivalry between the two. I love the tinfoil idea of Daemon being the son of Daena and Aemon based on Daemon's description 

[PrinceoftheTides]

1 hour ago, Seams said:

 

This is a great thread. It may help us to figure out things about Daenerys and why she was able to hatch the three eggs when all others failed.

I agree with @Moiraine Sedai that the diminishing dragon population was a reflection of the weakening Targaryen dynasty. The dying-off of the dragons coincides with infighting among members of the family, as well as a loss of the kind of "noble" attitude about governing that we saw with Jaehaerys and Alysanne. I suspect the mixing of non-Valyrian bloodlines with the Targaryen family line was also a factor, although that is more complicated than the reader is able to pin down with certainty.

Aegon III had a dislike of dragons and also a despair about life. The things that caused him to dislike dragons were all associated with the disintegration of the Targaryen family and attacks by family members on each other. He probably didn't really care about being king and he may have felt his family no longer deserved to rule, given the horrors he observed.

From the minute I read the early versions of Targ history, I assumed the man who became Viserys II was an imposter. The real Viserys probably really did die in the ship from which Aegon escaped, or somewhere in Essos. The Rogare family saw an opportunity or the small council thought a "return" of Viserys might help to pull Aegon out of his funk and help him to be a better king and/or produce offspring who would stabilize the monarchy. (I haven't yet read F&B, so let me know if there is detail in there that supports or contradicts the legitimacy of Viserys II.)

If an imposter Viserys is GRRM's hint to us, then the "Targaryen" descendants of Viserys II and Larra Rogare are less legitimate than the Blackfyres, who are descended from Daena (legit) as well as Aegon IV (non-legit Targ), or the Plumm and Penrose and Waters/Longwaters descendants of Elaena (legit).

Some people in the forum have kindly indulged my obsession with wordplay, and I think this is a case where the hair / heir pun is apparent (so to speak). Elaena is the matriarch of the last "legitimate" Targaryen heirs (if the Viserys II = imposter theory is true and if the Blackfyres truly died out with the death of Maelys the Monstrous). But she cuts off her hair and sends it to her pious brother/king, Baelor I. I think the hair cutting (similar to the hair cutting in The Sworn Sword) is a symbolic way of showing that the true heirs of the bloodline may be disconnected from the royal family just as Elaena's hair is no longer connected to her head. If we find that platinum white dragon egg with the gold embellishments, I think we will find some hidden Targ heirs from among the descendants of Princess Elaena.

 

I don't think Viserys was an impostor, King Aegon and the rest of the court recognized him at once (at least as far as it is written in F&B) when Alyn Velaryon brought him back. The book also provide a detailed history for his period in captivity, and all the passage of property he was subject to being a prisoner. That would be unlikely to be known in case of an impostor, since all the passages in property could easily backtracked imho.

Actually the habit of Targayen to use the same names create some confusion for the non-kings (since they do not have the number).

Morning was the dragon bonded with Rhaena, daughter of Daemon (brother of Viserys I, the one that rode Caraxes) and Laena Velaryon, twin sister to Baela (that rode Moondancer and later married Alyn Velaryon, ancestor to the current Velaryons, incuding Aurane Waters). She was actually the half-aunt of Rhaena, Elaena and Daena in the Maidenvalut ;-)

 

About point 5) I don't think there is any connection to pyromancy and dragon eggs hatching. To be honest the pyromancers are totally absent from F&B and does not seem to even exists at the time of the Dance of the Dragons, since, in case of its existence, it would be extremely strange that none of the factions made even a single thought about using wildfire in the civil war (not even as a defence or deterrent).

This last observation could lead to some interesting theory. If the pyromancers didn't exists prior to the dance but apperead afterwards (as it seems) could it be that their 'order' are related to the disapperance of the dragons and their inability to hatch new ones? Maybe they are born as some branch of maesters involved in the conspiracy. That point is however contradicted by what Hallyne said in Clash of Kings about the pyromancer's abilities being stronger when the dragons were alive, but again in all the books and stories we got so far before ASOIAF there is not a single reference to the pyromancer's guild existence.

This actually reminds me of the Dragonlance books, in which dragons eggs are used to create corrupted versions of dragons to be used as  soldiers

 

 

[Morte]

15 hours ago, PrinceoftheTides said:

About point 5) I don't think there is any connection to pyromancy and dragon eggs hatching. To be honest the pyromancers are totally absent from F&B and does not seem to even exists at the time of the Dance of the Dragons, since, in case of its existence, it would be extremely strange that none of the factions made even a single thought about using wildfire in the civil war (not even as a defence or deterrent).

This last observation could lead to some interesting theory. If the pyromancers didn't exists prior to the dance but apperead afterwards (as it seems) could it be that their 'order' are related to the disapperance of the dragons and their inability to hatch new ones? Maybe they are born as some branch of maesters involved in the conspiracy. That point is however contradicted by what Hallyne said in Clash of Kings about the pyromancer's abilities being stronger when the dragons were alive, but again in all the books and stories we got so far before ASOIAF there is not a single reference to the pyromancer's guild existence.

This actually reminds me of the Dragonlance books, in which dragons eggs are used to create corrupted versions of dragons to be used as  soldiers

Interesting thoughts, and a nice detail (no pyromancers in F&B1).

But I think it's the other way around, as we see pyromancers/alchimists in Essos, and it is stated that the guild is ancient and Hallyne's quote also points toward this direction (also it seems they have a branch in Quarth then Dany is there). But unfortunately we don't know if they had a branch in Westeros prior to Aegon IV.

Maybe the pyromancers were invited by the kings to come to King's Landing after the dragons died out? Before that Wildfire and other tricks wouldn't be needed in warfare, as the Targaryen had the "original", maybe one of the following kings thought that they could help bringing the dragons back? I do hope we get more informations about that in the second volume of F&B.

[Frey family reunion]

 

17 hours ago, PrinceoftheTides said:

About point 5) I don't think there is any connection to pyromancy and dragon eggs hatching. To be honest the pyromancers are totally absent from F&B and does not seem to even exists at the time of the Dance of the Dragons, since, in case of its existence, it would be extremely strange that none of the factions made even a single thought about using wildfire in the civil war (not even as a defence or deterrent).

This last observation could lead to some interesting theory. If the pyromancers didn't exists prior to the dance but apperead afterwards (as it seems) could it be that their 'order' are related to the disapperance of the dragons and their inability to hatch new ones? Maybe they are born as some branch of maesters involved in the conspiracy. That point is however contradicted by what Hallyne said in Clash of Kings about the pyromancer's abilities being stronger when the dragons were alive, but again in all the books and stories we got so far before ASOIAF there is not a single reference to the pyromancer's guild existence.

 

Maybe, maybe not.  There is a reference to pyromancy and the Guild of Alchemists when Aegon III turned 16:

Quote

A few matters were still under discussion when King Aegon's nameday dawned at last.  A great feast was to be held that night in the throne room, and the ancient Guild of Alchemists had promised displays of pyromancy such as the realm had never seen.

And it seems that pyromancy may simply be a sub specialty of the Guild of Alchemists:

Quote

Hallyne the Pyromancer of the Alchemists' Guild

So probably like the Maesters often specialize in certain forms of knowledge, certain alchemists may specialize in certain forms of alchemy.  So while all Pyromancers are alchemists, all alchemists may not be pyromancers, or at least not specialize in it.

And there is reference to alchemy dating back to King Aenys:

Quote

King Aenys loved his wife, his children, and his people, and wished only to be loved in turn.  Sword and lance had lost whatever they ever had for him.  Instead His Grace dabbled in alchemy, astronomy, and astrology...

Pyromancy should not have been increasing or spreading after the death of dragons, because as a whole, the Guild of Alchemists (of which pyromancy was a subspecialty) were on the decline because the Maesters of the Citadel seemed to be supplanting them:

Quote

Once theirs had been a powerful guild, but in recent centuries the maesters of the Citadel had supplanted the alchemists almost everywhere.

And indeed, in F&B we see an example of the citadel starting to replace the alchemists in the study of alchemy:

Quote

Moreover, King Jaehaerys still had one surviving son: Vaegon, an archmaester of the ring and rod and mask of yellow gold.  Known to history as Vaegon the dragonless, his very existence had been largely forgotten by most of the Seven Kingdoms.  Though only forty years of age, Vaegon was pale and frail, a bookish man devoted to alchemy, astronomy, mathematics, and other arcane arts.

So interestingly enough, when the Targaryens started turning to the use of wildfire for warfare, such as Aegon IV's wooden dragons:

Quote

This was far from the greatest folly of Aegon IV's stillborn invasion of Dorne, however, for his Grace had also turned to the dubious pyromancers of the ancient Guild of Alchemists, commanding them to "build me dragons."

And to dragon hatching 

Quote

... the blood of the dragon gathered in one... seven eggs, to honor the seven gods, though the king's own septon had warned ... pyromancers ... wildfire... flames grew out of control ... 

Instead of turning to the Citadel, which appeared to have largely started supplanting the Guild of Alchemists in matters of alchemy, they turned to the Guild of Alchemists instead.  Who appeared to have lost a good deal of their reputation.  

My thought is either the Targaryens didn't trust the Citadel to help them pursue their dreams of dragons, or the Citadel had no interest in helping the Targaryens pursue their dreams of dragons.  So instead the Targaryens turned to the Guild of Alchemy who had no such constraint.

So perhaps while the Guild of Alchemists as a whole were declining, those that remained increasingly turned to the study of pyromancy, because it was the one skill that the Citadel apparently would not supply to House Targaryen.

[Aline de Gavrillac]

Was it Marwyn who flippantly said the maesters were poisoning the dragons?  This is a story where words are misunderstood and their meaning is lost.  The maesters were poisoning the Targaryens is the real meaning.  Poisoning the humans who would later bond to the dragons weakened the hatchlings.  The maesters figured out which babies would have the best chances of bonding with dragons prior to birth.  I don't know, maybe they had access to historical family trees.  They saw a pattern from the family tree.  They were killing the babies shortly after birth or poisoning the mothers to ensure an unsuccessful birth.  

Poisoning a dragon would have been challenging.  The dragons were fed by handlers.  Food was crude.  Whole cows and pigs.  The dragons would cook the cow before dining.  Poisons of the time are organic.  Heat would render them ineffective.  Poisoning the human side of the equation is much easier.  

The maesters are not all Targaryen enemies.  They are not a heterogenous minded group.  The baby is safe if the attending maester is not a Targ hater.  Whoever delivered Dany on Dragonstone was a friendly maester.  Who may be none other than Marwyn.  

[asongofheresy]

1 hour ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

Was it Marwyn who flippantly said the maesters were poisoning the dragons?  This is a story where words are misunderstood and their meaning is lost.  The maesters were poisoning the Targaryens is the real meaning.  Poisoning the humans who would later bond to the dragons weakened the hatchlings.  The maesters figured out which babies would have the best chances of bonding with dragons prior to birth.  I don't know, maybe they had access to historical family trees.  They saw a pattern from the family tree.  They were killing the babies shortly after birth or poisoning the mothers to ensure an unsuccessful birth.  

Poisoning a dragon would have been challenging.  The dragons were fed by handlers.  Food was crude.  Whole cows and pigs.  The dragons would cook the cow before dining.  Poisons of the time are organic.  Heat would render them ineffective.  Poisoning the human side of the equation is much easier.  

The maesters are not all Targaryen enemies.  They are not a heterogenous minded group.  The baby is safe if the attending maester is not a Targ hater.  Whoever delivered Dany on Dragonstone was a friendly maester.  Who may be none other than Marwyn.  

I agree Maesters were poisoning the Targaryens, especially babies of Maegor, Aenys, Rhaegel? since he choked, Rhaella's babies.

[Aline de Gavrillac]

20 hours ago, Jova Snow said:

Is it possible their name is supposed to be like Bar Emmon? Or maybe there is a V to B sound change like in Turkish and the original name was Varatheon? Theon itself is used by Starks and Greyjoys so maybe original papa Baratheon was a First Men? 

Correct me if my recollection is wrong but F/B pretty much confirmed that Orys was a Targ bastard.  He was the half brother of the three Targaryens.  My question is, how come he doesn't have a generic bastard surname?  Orys Waters or something like that.  Orys Smoke if he was born on Dragonstone.   

[asongofheresy]

1 hour ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

Correct me if my recollection is wrong but F/B pretty much confirmed that Orys was a Targ bastard.  He was the half brother of the three Targaryens.  My question is, how come he doesn't have a generic bastard surname?  Orys Waters or something like that.  Orys Smoke if he was born on Dragonstone.   

That's why I think Orys' mother might be married to a knight of Aerion either when Aerion claimed the right of the first night or she was married of to unknown Baratheon after she gave birth to Orys. That could be the only reason for Orys to not have a bastard name, though it is possible Orys gave himself the Baratheon name like Daemon named himself Blackfyre. 

[Morte]

11 minutes ago, Jova Snow said:

That's why I think Orys' mother might be married to a knight of Aerion either when Aerion claimed the right of the first night or she was married of to unknown Baratheon after she gave birth to Orys. That could be the only reason for Orys to not have a bastard name, though it is possible Orys gave himself the Baratheon name like Daemon named himself Blackfyre. 

I agree 100% on this possibilities, just want to add another one: Baratheon being the mother's surname, as we know nothing about her (She could have been the head of an ex-Valyrian merchant-house, who had no reason to keep their bloodline Valyrian by incest, as they neither had dragons to begin with nor were "lesser nobles" like the Velaryons. We have an example of the child from a female merchant, who stayed with her father: Sarella/Alleras).

[Frey family reunion]

1 hour ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

Correct me if my recollection is wrong but F/B pretty much confirmed that Orys was a Targ bastard.  He was the half brother of the three Targaryens.  My question is, how come he doesn't have a generic bastard surname?  Orys Waters or something like that.  Orys Smoke if he was born on Dragonstone.   

It was "whispered" that Orys was Aerion's bastard son.  So it wasn't really "known" and it certainly wasn't acknowledged or confirmed.

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Orys Baratheon was a baseborn half-brother to Lord Aegon, it was whispered, and the Storm King would not dishonor his daughter by giving her hand to a bastard.

So as suggested above, Aerion probably engaged in the right of First Night with one of his bannerman's wives, or knights, probably either a Lord Baratheon or a Ser Baratheon.  So Orys, was born to a wedded couple, and officially was known as the son of Lord or Ser Baratheon, whether or not that was his biological father.

[James Fenimore Cooper XXII]

The "owner" of the egg did not hatch the egg.  The momma dragon did the job.  Dragons have their runts too.  Perhaps nature cull the runts and only the strong dragons survive.  Dog litters will have runts from time to time.  They can survive with help from the human and this is how the last dragon survived.  With human assistance.  She would have perished in nature.  

Daenerys was able to hatch her three petrified dragon eggs because she has the power of necromancy.  The mother figure is the giver of life.  Aegon V tried to do the same thing.  His fire was hotter because of the wildfire.  Many more people with supposedly magic blood died at Summerhall.  Yet none of his eggs hatched.  Egg doesn't have the power of necromancy.