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Ser Scot A Ellison

The Orville Season 2

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11 minutes ago, Bronn Stone said:
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Placing a machine on board the Orville known to be remote-controllable by an enemy is an astoundingly bad idea that would lead to certain disaster were it not for plot armor.

It is as if Pablo Escobar bought a bunch of Amazon Echos and installed them in his headquarters, trusting that the DEA wasn't reprogramming them to record everything he says and does.

 

 

Spoiler

True. But just how much are they actually able to remote control him anyway? We have only seen the Kaylon deactivating Isaac on a whim and the Orville isn't an important ship anyway. I guess it also raises the question of whether Isaac is able to modify himself to make himself less vulnerable to them.

It's also a bit strange how fast and loose they are with how the Kaylon are constructed. That's something I already mentioned last episode. Last season Isaac was portrayed as ridiculously durable and he didn't seem to have any internal weapons. Or at least he bothered to use a Union issue blaster instead of going into Skynet mode. Maybe because he was built as an ambassador and not a warrior and they have upgraded him now? But then again, why were the Kaylon so fragile all of a sudden? I had imagined them to be as impervious as the Borg or the Daleks, but instead they went down like Stormtroopers in every engagement. Despite their ships being noticeably more durable than anything the Union and the Krill can throw at them. It seems a little inconsistent there.

And heh. I just noticed that I'm already applying as much critical thinking as I do to any other Star Trek show. That's makes me smile, despite the nitpicking. XD

 

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I'm more than happy to have them explore Isaacs motives in the future - they had a lot to fit in these episodes as it is. I kept wondering if Isaac knew what Kaylon Prime's ultimate goal was or if he was just told to gather info. If it was addressed, I missed it.

TBH, I zoned out during the space battle. It's not my thing. I can see only having one base type ship for each fleet if only because it cuts down on the budget. I can't imagine they have much to burn.

For sure the most interesting thing to come out of this is the beginning of an understanding with the Krill. The Isaac twist was fun and we get a new enemy out of it all, but ultimately it was a little predictable and boring (the lead up was great!, conclusion not so much) I'm glad they tied it into reaching out to the Krill because that's what saved the episode for me.

 

 

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It was about time they did something with Isaac.... He and LaMarr have been the most under-utilized characters, and until the past couple of episodes, he'd been relegated to Claire's talking vibrator...  

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This was a very good double episode, albeit slightly predictable. However the predictability is part of the whole "Star Trek homage" thing.

Of course, there were the usual plot holes to be expected. What bugged me was that the Kaylons were silly enouh to back the Orville crew into a corner by telling them of their plans to wipe out biological lifeforms altogether. This meant that humans had nothing to lose, and were unlikely to cooperate. An obvious mistake for a species so advanced... And surprising given the knowledge they'd gathered through Isaac.


For that reason I was a bit disappointed that the Kaylons did not acknowledge their mistakes - simply fled. Of course, the main antagonists (primary and secondary) were deactivated, so there was a lack of "enemy" characters to focus on once the battle started, but still...

In the same vein, some small explanation about why the Kaylons made so many mistakes would have been nice. It was implied they had trouble distinguishing fiction from non-fiction, but Roots may not have been the best choice to show this, since it is still largely based on reality.
They ended up being portrayed as paranoid and vengeful rather than the calculating AIs that they are supposed to be... Oddly emotional in short.

Also disappointing was just how naive Mercer & co were in part 1. As soon as the graveyard was found they should have realized just how much of a threat the Kaylons were. It was already stretching the suspension of disbelief that they didn't consider such a possibility *before* but *someone* from the Orville should have realized that they needed to warn the Union as soon as they found the graveyard. That Ed & co made one last attempt at diplomacy would have been far more believable *if* they'd at least tried to send a warning/report first. As it is, it just seemed naive and foolish, because *obviously* the Kaylons had to have been created, and it was also obvious that they'd very probably massacred their makers at that point.

Also, Ed' should have found a kind of "personal" code when he exchanged with the captain of the Roosevelt since it was reasonable to assume all Union codes were known to the Kaylons at this point.

Finally, not enough time was given to explain why the Krill were suddenly so cooperative. Having a common enemy isn't enough to suddenly become allies in battle. An extra something (a sign of sorts) could have helped. Or perhaps this could have been anticipated in a previous episode, by throwing in that the Krills despise species that cannot be religious by nature even more than non-believing species... I dunno.

Of course, I assume all these plot holes are meant to give an "oldie" vibe to the show, because that's how things were written in the 80s/90s but still, even for a ST:TNG episode this would have still been a lot of plot holes...

It's still interesting though, and of course we can expect Isaac to play a significant role in future Kaylon evolutions. I was wondering if he'd become the new "primary" in this episode or whether they'd keep that for later. It seems they'll do that in another episode now. Maybe they'll also address some of the plot holes of these two episodes retroactively. After all, there's still a lot to be learned from both Kaylons and Krill.

I personally loved the episodes, having recently stumbled upon "Roko's basilisk" so I fully anticipated advanced AIs to seek to destroy the Union. Too bad they didn't include a deeper aspect to it though, by saying that biological lifeforms are uncapable of mastering their own destinies anyway, or something along those lines to make us reflect on the inherent dangers of AI.

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... aaand the last one was pretty decent as well, though in my opinion nowhere near as brave enough as it could be. I really liked the initial premise of Mercer being in the moral dilemma to extradite a Union officer to appease a hostile opponent. Too bad that it was resolved TOS style with a fist fight instead of TNG style with the captain taking a stand for the moral choice. I mean... it's really too easy a solution to have the Krill have the total right in this whole situation and that the guy was gracious enough to off himself in the end. Just... too easy. But the episode overall was pretty fun.

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Prefacing this by saying I'm loving this show...the question is: Is anyone else playing the "identify the TNG episode that's being referenced with this week's Orville" each week?  I mean, the most recent episode was a total riff on the TNG episode,  "The Wounded"...

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11 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

Prefacing this by saying I'm loving this show...the question is: Is anyone else playing the "identify the TNG episode that's being referenced with this week's Orville" each week?  I mean, the most recent episode was a total riff on the TNG episode,  "The Wounded"...

I'm doing this since the beginning, yes. XD

An yes, it was similar to "The Wounded", but only in that you have a shell-shocked veteran who is friend of a cast member that refuses to believe that the war is over. The situation however is different enough that it doesn't really matter (unlike previous episodes where even the situation is awfully similar more often than not). The Cardassians never asked for Captain Maxwell's extradition, the events didn't happen during the peace talks but years after it, and we were seeing Maxwell doing his rampage and not just have to take the Cardassians' word for it.

Though I should say, the original TNG episode was freaking master piece. The introduction of one of my favorite ships with the Nebula class (and damn, did it obliterate the Cardassians there), essentially the introduction of Gul Dukat (despite the later renaming due to not wanting to give money to the writer for every single DS9 episode) and of course that ending:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WHAUzBNoKw

 

At least The Orville steals from the best. XD

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Don't get me wrong, I don't think they're seeking to do episodes cut from whole cloth...just that they use some templates from them...Orville episodes have a vibe...

Edited by Jaxom 1974

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I'm completely blown away by the latest episode "Lasting Impressions". This is gold right there! Absolutely the best written episode of the entire season. Perfectly balanced the emotional punches of Malloy's story (and I think surpassing the obvious reference point of Geordie's holodeck girlfriend) with the humor of the Moclan's nicotine addiction, which actually made me laugh for a change.

Awesome! More of this quality! I loved absolutely everything from beginning to end. I looked up that it's written by MacFarlane himself, as usual, but had Kelly Cronin as a director. Give her more episodes!

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Meester!     It was difficult to watch Gossip Girl for more than short bursts of thirty seconds, but then she was in the best movie ever, the Adam Sandler vehicle "That's My Boy."  And now this.   Why is Jude Law in every movie but not Meester?   They should trade places.

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I'm not a huge Seth Macfarlane fan and to be honest I sort of hate his dirty humor for most of his shows/films.............American Dad being the only exception. I am a huge Star Trek fan however and love just about every series aside from Discovery.

Do you think I'll like this show?

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21 minutes ago, sifth said:

I am a huge Star Trek fan however and love just about every series aside from Discovery.

Do you think I'll like this show? 

Look at this scene and tell me it's not Star Trek: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZDWPCTOg2E

The humor of most episodes is often hit or miss (even though I really loved the nicotine addiction sub-plot of the latest episode), but the show very early abandoned all attempts to be a parody. It wants to be a homage to classic TNG and oozes that out of every pore.

Though even then, when the humor succeeds, it is funny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01HMXioj_ZU

 

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2 hours ago, Toth said:

Look at this scene and tell me it's not Star Trek: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZDWPCTOg2E

The humor of most episodes is often hit or miss (even though I really loved the nicotine addiction sub-plot of the latest episode), but the show very early abandoned all attempts to be a parody. It wants to be a homage to classic TNG and oozes that out of every pore.

Though even then, when the humor succeeds, it is funny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01HMXioj_ZU

 

How can a Seth McFarlane show have such amazing and wonderful music?

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Just caught up.  This last episode was actually one of the best. A classic Trek bottle show with A and B plots that actually reflected each other.  An obvious jumping point from a TNG episode, but at the same time taking it up another notch.

Plus, another Trek alum passes through...the question is, will MacFarlane, with his American Dad relationship with him, get Patrick Stewart to grace the show...

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On 3/25/2019 at 2:40 PM, sifth said:

I'm not a huge Seth Macfarlane fan and to be honest I sort of hate his dirty humor for most of his shows/films.............American Dad being the only exception. I am a huge Star Trek fan however and love just about every series aside from Discovery.

Do you think I'll like this show?

A little late on the reply, but I am not a huge fan of McFarlane either, or his sense of humor. I do like Orville though. There are times when a joke is forced or falls flat with me, but for the vast majority, I just really enjoy it.

I almost gave up after the first episode - just rolled my eyes hard at the Gordon character, but things smoothed out pretty quickly.

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I must say, I really like it when a show is to a certain degree predictable. Makes you feel clever when things you expect to happen actually happen. Many people here and on other boards had mentioned how the Moclans became more and more trouble throughout this season and that they might go head to head with the Union as a whole, given how at odds they are with their moral code. Well... yeah.

Can I also just mention just how gorgeous the CGI in yesterday's episode was? The Orville maneuvering through that purple nebula looked terrific. I also liked how the show appears to have come to notice how much its humor sucks. When the ambassador was setting up quoting the cheesy song heard in the shuttle and Mercer cringed expecting a really embarrassing scene and she ended up working it into her speech rather naturally, it was really a relief.

Anyway. Decent episode.

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The fact that this show continues to srengthen as it goes forward is great.  That they've created this, apparently, rich and deep universe and we haven't even really delved into the Union, Moklas, or some of the other areas that have been hinted at...

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On 4/13/2019 at 4:25 PM, Jaxom 1974 said:

The fact that this show continues to srengthen as it goes forward is great.  That they've created this, apparently, rich and deep universe and we haven't even really delved into the Union, Moklas, or some of the other areas that have been hinted at...

It's more of a "make stuff up as you go along" type of thing, but TOS started the same way. It is nice to see it evolve into a setting of its own.

Then again, the latest episode wasn't really up to speed again. The Thomas Riker stuff was cheesy enough for them to copy it to the  letter, but Ed/Kelly will they/won't they is certainly the weakest and most annoying part of the show. Please stop doing episodes like this, they are boring beyond belief and utterly undermined the first return of the Kaylon after a while, here becoming nothing but a background obstacle (that is at least not given the Voyager-Borg shafting at least).

At least the effects were nice.

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Still trying to find a way of watching this show in the UK. So to recap, Now TV has the last episode aired a week after the US transmission, but only that episode; when the next episode airs, Now TV deletes the last one.

There is apparently a special Fox UK subscription you can get which you can use to watch the show, but that's extra expense on top of Sky, so no.

Even more helpful, they've released Season 1 on DVD alone. No Blu-Ray release, which for a show this visually impressive is a big no-no.

Given Fox's purchase by Disney it seems unlikely the show will end up on Netflix or Amazon either. It won't go on Disney+ but we don't have Hulu in the UK; Hulu shows end up going all over the place.

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