Small Questions v. 10106

[The_Watcher_On_The_Walls]

How come no one has built anything in forever? Everything is really old.

Also, if songs are so important how has no one has written a hit since The Rains Of Castamere?

[Alexis-something-Rose]

58 minutes ago, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

How come no one has built anything in forever? Everything is really old.

Because building means a lord has to borrow money from the the bank or from some other lord or levy more taxes from their smallfolk. And it takes years to build something. 

1 hour ago, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

Also, if songs are so important how has no one has written a hit since The Rains Of Castamere?

We don't know that. The Rains of Castamere was pulled out of the repertoire for the Red Wedding and was played about a 100 times at Joffrey's wedding because Tywin was there. I wouldn't call it a hit as much as a threat disguised as a song.

The Bear and the Maiden Fair seems to be a big hit. Jenny's Song seems to be a hit seeing as Catelyn stuck flowers in her hair and pretended to be Jenny and Robb knew the song.

It may not be a top 50 on Westeros's Billboard, but Lord Renly's Ride is a very recent song.

[The_Watcher_On_The_Walls]

6 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

Because building means a lord has to borrow money from the the bank or from some other lord or levy more taxes from their smallfolk. And it takes years to build something. 

Do you think that’s all it is? No one has had the funds or motivation to build anything in hundreds of years?
 

IMO it’s something that needs an explanation. Look at a place like Dragonstone; that place is an architectural marvel and it was built before the doom, we’re talking over 400 years ago.
 

Think about all the other amazing structures, basically every major castle is incredible, the Titan of Bravos, the wall, the effing Eyrie. None of it inspired anyone to build anything except Sansa who built a snow castle once. 

[Hugorfonics]

8 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

The Bear and the Maiden Fair seems to be a big hit. Jenny's Song seems to be a hit seeing as Catelyn stuck flowers in her hair and pretended to be Jenny and Robb knew the song.

I think most songs are hits

Quote

The singer looked at yellow cloak. "Lem, let him go."

"Go bugger yourself," the big outlaw replied brusquely.

The singer gave Merrett a helpless shrug and began to play, "The Day They Hanged Black Robin."

Merrett doesnt seem like the most culturally gifted to me, but he recognizes The Day They Hanged Black Robin after a few notes.

 

1 hour ago, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

Do you think that’s all it is? No one has had the funds or motivation to build anything in hundreds of years?
 

IMO it’s something that needs an explanation. Look at a place like Dragonstone; that place is an architectural marvel and it was built before the doom, we’re talking over 400 years ago.
 

Think about all the other amazing structures, basically every major castle is incredible, the Titan of Bravos, the wall, the effing Eyrie. None of it inspired anyone to build anything except Sansa who built a snow castle once. 

Red Keep and Summerhall are recent constructions, obviously KL cam afford whatever.

I also think Lord Arryn and warden of the East wouldn't let any of his lords undertake a construction like the Eyrie, because if not then maybe one day thered be a new warden of the east

[The_Watcher_On_The_Walls]

3 hours ago, Hugorfonics said:

I think most songs are hits

Merrett doesnt seem like the most culturally gifted to me, but he recognizes The Day They Hanged Black Robin after a few notes.

 

Red Keep and Summerhall are recent constructions, obviously KL cam afford whatever.

I also think Lord Arryn and warden of the East wouldn't let any of his lords undertake a construction like the Eyrie, because if not then maybe one day thered be a new warden of the east

A general paranoia is something I can get behind. It’s not perfect, I mean there really should be a lot more but lords not allowing construction for that reason is better than no explanation. 
 

You guys don’t think there’s a magical element at play here? I’m thinking about the black stone of ‘unknown origin’ that was used in the construction of the Hightower at old town, the five forts and other well known structures. 

[Hugorfonics]

14 hours ago, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

A general paranoia is something I can get behind. It’s not perfect, I mean there really should be a lot more but lords not allowing construction for that reason is better than no explanation. 
 

You guys don’t think there’s a magical element at play here? I’m thinking about the black stone of ‘unknown origin’ that was used in the construction of the Hightower at old town, the five forts and other well known structures. 

Word.

Yea, maybe. I was toying around with the idea of magic castles in this thread

 

[frenin]

On 5/6/2020 at 4:35 PM, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

How come no one has built anything in forever? Everything is really old.

Also, if songs are so important how has no one has written a hit since The Rains Of Castamere?

Not really, there is little reason to do it, but we do know of recent construcciones anyway, both Coldmoat and Whitewalls are a rather recent.

 

Rich lords can def afford it but the question is why would they?? Their castles are mighty enough, they don't need more, especially those who aren't just rich but also from ancient Houses. 

Edited May 7, 2020 by frenin

[Loose Bolt]

Ironborn seems to have fleet of hundreds of ships. From where and how they get all necessary timber for building and maintaining those ships?

[rikibobi]

How come Roose Bolton didn't recognize Gendry as Robert's bastard while they were in Harrenhal? He would have known it just by having one look at Gendry, like Ned or Brienne, but it had never been mentioned in the books. Was it simply that they have never met in person or he just thought it wasn't important enough to bother with it?

[Alexis-something-Rose]

He didn't recognize Arya (or that she had the look of a Stark) and she was his cupbearer, so I doubt he was paying any sort of attention to the smith.

[The_Watcher_On_The_Walls]

On 5/8/2020 at 6:42 AM, frenin said:

Not really, there is little reason to do it, but we do know of recent construcciones anyway, both Coldmoat and Whitewalls are a rather recent.

 

Rich lords can def afford it but the question is why would they?? Their castles are mighty enough, they don't need more, especially those who aren't just rich but also from ancient Houses. 

Both of those places are over 100 years old aren’t they? 

Either way I just realised that almost all of the castles have had major extensions over the years, which more or less explains it if you think of castles as though they were cities. 
 

 

[The_Watcher_On_The_Walls]

If there’s a repeat of the last hero legend, is it safe to assume Lady Stoneheart is one of the dozen companions?

[frenin]

12 minutes ago, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

Both of those places are over 100 years old aren’t they? 

Indeed. 

[Loose Bolt]

Could a greense'er either control existing germs or create new germs? After all diseases had killed more people than weapons. Besides how good immune system Others have?

[kleevedge]

Why was the kingsguard at the Tower of Joy? I see most people write it off to Rhaegar sent them there to protect Lyanna, but why would Rhaegar have control of the kingsguard? At this point Aerys already doesn't trust Rhaegar, so to give him full control of the KG seems a bit odd, I mean this is the Lord Commander and Arthur Dayne, Aerys must know what they're doing.

[corbon]

30 minutes ago, kleevedge said:

Why was the kingsguard at the Tower of Joy? I see most people write it off to Rhaegar sent them there to protect Lyanna, but why would Rhaegar have control of the kingsguard? At this point Aerys already doesn't trust Rhaegar, so to give him full control of the KG seems a bit odd, I mean this is the Lord Commander and Arthur Dayne, Aerys must know what they're doing.

The truth is, Rhaegar did have full command when he returned. He was the one giving dispositions to the KG and leading the army, he was the one whom Jaime turned to swap with Darry and it was Rhaegar who indicated that he 'dared not' relieve Aerys of that 'crutch' (keeping Tywin's son in hand) - which, in that manner and context, to me says he had the power to but didn't feel that was a wise or safe use of his power. I think he could assign the KG how he chose, but one of the factors influencing his choices was the King's mental health, and having Jaime nearby was a crutch the King, and therefore the realm, needed - at least as Rhaegar saw it.

I think the problem here is that you (and many others who probably lead you in that direction) have formed a wrong impression about the relationship between Aerys and Rhaegar. Yes, Aerys and Rhaegar were often at odds, made worse before the rebellion by factionalism within the court. And yes, there were times when Aerys didn't trust Rhaegar fully. But ultimately, they are on the same side and can absolutely trust that they are both working for the continuation of the Targaryen dynasty. When other options failed, Aerys did return to Rhaegar as the one person who was absolutely as invested as he was in the continuation of Targaryen power and the one person capable of pulling the royalists together.
The evidence says Rhaegar was in charge, even of the Kingsguard.
Thus it is not necessary that Aerys 'know where they are' or approve of what they are doing. Rhaegar was the boss. Aerys still had KG protection. There is no issue here except those made up by people who favour their own conclusions over the evidence.

Heck, look at Harrenhal, where supposedly Aerys got wind of Rhaegar making a political move against him and came out of his fearful self-imprisonment to bust that up.
Yet when Aerys is scared/wroth with the KotLT, who did he get to investigate? Rhaegar.

The two fight, metaphorically speaking, because Aerys is a paranoid nutter and Rhaegar is able and popular. But when shit gets real, Aerys leans on Rhaegar because he's the one person he knows he can trust the family business too.

 

[Idunnohowtochangenames]

On 5/12/2020 at 7:34 AM, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

Both of those places are over 100 years old aren’t they? 

Either way I just realised that almost all of the castles have had major extensions over the years, which more or less explains it if you think of castles as though they were cities. 
 

 

I assume you mean to exclude smaller projects, like repairing Saltpans's fences or whatever else we see. I'm also sure small town Septs are built/rebuilt regularly.

For bigger projects, I think you have to consider the factors that govern them. For new Castles, there must be non-linear inheritance, else offspring will just inherit their parent's castles.  That is new Lords need to pop up where there were no old lords. This process alters the landscape via construction to highlight new dominance over the land (instead of integration within existing culture). Aegon's conquest brought an entirely new city in Kings Landing just to remind Westeros who was in charge now. Harren's conquest of the Riverlands led to Harrenhall. 

Have there been any major changes to the power structure in the last 100 years? Almost. There were the Blackfyre Rebellions, but they lost. The lands and castles of the losers went to the winners, who were often far less powerful at the start. This process is akin to snails upgrading one shell to another shell. We also see this with Littlefinger's reward of the empty Harrenhall. This does not require a new shell be built and there might be other near empty castles going to waste. Had the Blackfyre's won, perhaps we would have seen new construction projects reflecting the new power dynamics.

Another reason for new construction projects is megalomania. I think we can point to Baelor I's construction of the Sept as the only architectural marvel of the last 100 years of so. Maegor built the Redkeep, but it's not described as marvelous. Even then, it's just King's building towards a function. Robert might have built a new beer garden or brothel. He wasn't interested in anything else. Aerys wasn't a builder, either.

One "hinted at" developmental region is the Gift. Ned's plan to get it back from the Night's Watch and build on it would create new lords, who would need new castles, new roads, new Septs, etc. Perhaps a Dream of Spring will see such things take place.

 

 

Edited May 19, 2020 by Idunnohowtochangenames

[Alexis-something-Rose]

On 5/6/2020 at 6:36 PM, The_Watcher_On_The_Walls said:

Do you think that’s all it is? No one has had the funds or motivation to build anything in hundreds of years?

I was thinking about your question, and I remembered a House that was founded in 209 AC, and that's House Fossoway of New Barrel. 

So their seat would have been built within the last 90 years. They could be one of the most recent construction. 

[Nittanian]

Quote

Ten Towers had always felt like home to Asha, more so than Pyke. Not one castle, ten castles squashed together, she had thought, the first time she had seen it. She remembered breathless races up and down the steps and along wallwalks and covered bridges, fishing off the Long Stone Quay, days and nights lost amongst her uncle's wealth of books. His grandfather's grandfather had raised the castle, the newest on the isles. Lord Theomore Harlaw had lost three sons in the cradle and laid the blame upon the flooded cellars, damp stones, and festering nitre of ancient Harlaw Hall. Ten Towers was airier, more comfortable, better sited . . . but Lord Theomore was a changeable man, as any of his wives might have testified. He'd had six of those, as dissimilar as his ten towers. (AFFC The Kraken's Daughter)

 

[JeffJeremy]

Did the Clegane brothers still have brothers or sisters?