Small Questions v. 10106

[Ser Leftwich]

6 hours ago, TheLastWolf said:

A series of Small Qs...

snip

@TheLastWolf We don't know. (That is the answer to all three of your questions.) 'What ifs' are mostly pointless, because they are unanswerable, so "maybe, but the text does not go that way."

[TheLastWolf]

15 hours ago, Ser Leftwich said:

@TheLastWolf We don't know. (That is the answer to all three of your questions.) 'What ifs' are mostly pointless, because they are unanswerable, so "maybe, but the text does not go that way."

1.       I too avoid ‘what-if’ questions/topics as much as possible and only make exceptions when they’re ultra-interesting. But ‘all three’ of my Qs aren’t whatif. In fact, none of them are. I didn’t ask”‘What if Oberyn was Arianne’s daddy?”. I asked whether it could be a possibility, with textual excerpt. Sure, girls and boys have uncle’s characteristics. But in GRRM’s world, everything and anything can happen. Especially ugly, gross intra family (not just incest) screwing around, and extra especially since it is wanton, promiscuous Dornish like Oberyn etc. Speculating. Tom’O’sevens  being the wandering singer getting Pod’s mom pregnant isn’t whatif. Very likely given Tom’s record (not a saint). Lewyn’s paramour is alive. Text says so. Who? Not a whatif again. Just want to know if there were any issue from Tom and Lewyn of any consequence.

[TheLastWolf]

1.       Please don’t take this as pretentious or something, but we really need a new Small Qs thread. Said so 5/6 pages ago. Please @Rhaenys_Targaryen. Getting really difficult to keep track and locate older questions. So it would be really great if some mod locks, unpins and/or archives this thread, pins the new one by Lady Rhaenys (presumably) and we all post away!

[TheLastWolf]

1.       One last small q. So pls bear with me. How many of you still have all the GRRM Planetos books with you now? Can include AKOT7K, F&B, World book ... or not, ur choice. Just want to know how many apart from me are spending COVID lockdown with their fav ASOIAF characters.

Like if you have the ASOIAF books. Laugh if all  (incl AKOT7K, F&B, world book etc). Or just reply if you like

[Alexis-something-Rose]

I was wondering if anyone can explain the difference between these two. I am looking at the spelling difference.

"A dead man in the prow of a ship, a blue rose, a banquet of blood . . . what does any of it mean, Khaleesi? A mummer's dragon, you said. What is a mummer's dragon, pray?" (Daenerys V, ACoK 63)

Mummer's dragon is always spelled with a small m and a small d. But then we have this about Pyp.

"They will call you men of the Night's Watch now, but you are bigger fools than the Mummer's Monkey here if you believe that."

In this one case, it's mummer's monkey, capital M and capital M. The two other instances that a mummer's monkey is mentioned in relation to Pyp and Lancel, we are looking at a small m.

The difference between the two is lost on me. So I was wondering if someone knows if there is an actual difference. 

 

[corbon]

3 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

I was wondering if anyone can explain the difference between these two. I am looking at the spelling difference.

"A dead man in the prow of a ship, a blue rose, a banquet of blood . . . what does any of it mean, Khaleesi? A mummer's dragon, you said. What is a mummer's dragon, pray?" (Daenerys V, ACoK 63)

Mummer's dragon is always spelled with a small m and a small d. But then we have this about Pyp.

"They will call you men of the Night's Watch now, but you are bigger fools than the Mummer's Monkey here if you believe that."

In this one case, it's mummer's monkey, capital M and capital M. The two other instances that a mummer's monkey is mentioned in relation to Pyp and Lancel, we are looking at a small m.

The difference between the two is lost on me. So I was wondering if someone knows if there is an actual difference. 

 

If its not a mistake, its because when Ser Allister used it he used it as a (mocking) formal title.
Pyp used it for himself shortly after, echoing Ser Allister, and it was back to lower case, even with 'the' in front. I'd guess Pyp wasn't using it as a 'title' for himself, even mockingly, but mocking Ser Alister's use of it in effect. Hence the lower case.

Lancel was 'a', not 'the', so always lower case. 

Formal (even mocking) titles get upper case, descriptions and less 'formal' uses of titles get lower case.

[Alexis-something-Rose]

54 minutes ago, corbon said:

If its not a mistake, its because when Ser Allister used it he used it as a (mocking) formal title.
Pyp used it for himself shortly after, echoing Ser Allister, and it was back to lower case, even with 'the' in front. I'd guess Pyp wasn't using it as a 'title' for himself, even mockingly, but mocking Ser Alister's use of it in effect. Hence the lower case.

Lancel was 'a', not 'the', so always lower case. 

Formal (even mocking) titles get upper case, descriptions and less 'formal' uses of titles get lower case.

Excellent point. Now that I've paid a little more attention, I see that all the nicknames that Ser Alliser gave the recruits are all capitalized. Lover, Stone Head, Lady Piggy, Aurochs . . .

[Alyn Oakenfist]

So I think it's pretty obvious SweetRobin is not Jon's, with his brown hair and short stature, and given Littlefinger's relation to Lysa and the things Lysa says. So with all that in mind, does Littlefinger know? I don't think he'd care if he did, because you know, he's a psychopath, but it would add a whole nother layer of fucked up if Littlefinger was slowly killing his own son to advance his plans.

[Castellan]

I think the author has left it up in the air, put in some hints that way that could also be explained by Jon Arryn's poor reproductive record (crummy sperm?) and Lysa's poisoned womb and terrible job raising him.

Anyway, wouldn't Lysa have delighted in telling Petyr?

I also don't think Petyr would care. I think he is quite unfeeling and wholly focused on power. He would despise SweetRobin whether or not he was his child.

[TheLastWolf]

LF being Sweetrobin's papa is subject to argument. Not certain, like say, Lannister Twincest. No one can argue that it's all in Jaime or Cersei's head (like American Psycho Bale). 

There was already a thread whether LF was the dad or not. Lot of circumstantial evidence suggests so, but I'm convinced otherwise due to several rational reasonings. Put forth a few points myself 

[The hairy bear]

If (and that's a big if) Littlefinger had been Robert's father, I have no doubt that Lysa would have told him. It's not something that she could keep to herself, specially once Jon was dead and she had married Petyr.

 

[TheLastWolf]

On 11/5/2020 at 12:04 PM, TheLastWolf said:

1.       Please don’t take this as pretentious or something, but we really need a new Small Qs thread. Said so 5/6 pages ago. Please @Rhaenys_Targaryen. Getting really difficult to keep track and locate older questions. So it would be really great if some mod locks, unpins and/or archives this thread, pins the new one by Lady Rhaenys (presumably) and we all post away!

It's official. Snubbed. Not the first time. But yeah, senior members know better and they may have more than a valid reason to continue this small q thread

On 11/5/2020 at 12:06 PM, TheLastWolf said:

1.       One last small q. So pls bear with me. How many of you still have all the GRRM Planetos books with you now? Can include AKOT7K, F&B, World book ... or not, ur choice. Just want to know how many apart from me are spending COVID lockdown with their fav ASOIAF characters.

Like if you have the ASOIAF books. Laugh if all  (incl AKOT7K, F&B, world book etc). Or just reply if you like

Meh question. I know. Sry. 

But I still wanna know who's Lewyn's paramour. Arianne being Oberyn's kid is crazy. Just wanted to know if anyone has any ideas. 

Tom o sevens and Pod's mom. Now that's interesting. Still no reply sadly. Any issue from that pregnancy? Dunno. Any female character whose identity is suspicious may be a candidate for Pod's mom. 

[CamiloRP]

46 minutes ago, The hairy bear said:

If (and that's a big if) Littlefinger had been Robert's father, I have no doubt that Lysa would have told him. It's not something that she could keep to herself, specially once Jon was dead and she had married Petyr.

 

Yeah, and she would have told Sansa in that rant.

I'm not saying SR isn't LF's, there's not way Lysa could be certain (unless she didn't fuck LF around that time), but if Lysa doesn't think LF is the father, then he shouldn't either.

[Ser Leftwich]

1 hour ago, TheLastWolf said:

1) But I still wanna know who's Lewyn's paramour. Arianne being Oberyn's kid is crazy. Just wanted to know if anyone has any ideas. 

2) Tom o sevens and Pod's mom. Now that's interesting. Still no reply sadly. Any issue from that pregnancy? Dunno. Any female character whose identity is suspicious may be a candidate for Pod's mom. 

1) There is so little to go on: alive, female, has to be old enough. It is not worth the effort since it cannot be figured out.

2) This is a non-starter, since there is nothing in the books that would lead us to this idea. So little to go on, it is just making sh*t up. There is no reason to believe this premise in the first place, so why bother? (How do we know Pod isn't one of Robert's Bastards? He must be because: reasons.)

[TheLastWolf]

6 minutes ago, Ser Leftwich said:

1) There is so little to go on: alive, female, has to be old enough. It is not worth the effort since it cannot be figured out.

2) This is a non-starter, since there is nothing in the books that would lead us to this idea. So little to go on, it is just making sh*t up. There is no reason to believe this premise in the first place, so why bother? (How do we know Pod isn't one of Robert's Bastards? He must be because: reasons.)

Thanks for your opinions

1) fair enough. 

2) The only only philandering wandering singer we know of is Tom. Sure, it could be anyone else. But Tom's age matches up. As to Robert being Pod's dad, I had a lot of crackpot about Pod's parentage, but this is new. Add it to

 

[corbon]

17 hours ago, TheLastWolf said:

2) The only only philandering wandering singer we know of is ...

Umm, do you know of any singers who are not wandering philanderers?

I mean, I know there are some, but thats the generic stereotype, frankly, and while stereotypes shouldn't be applied to any individual without specific evidence, they are formed for a reason... 

Its also not true.
Dareon and Bael spring to mind immediately. Not as Pod's father obviously, but as wandering philandering singers, supporting the generic stereotype.

[TheLastWolf]

2 hours ago, corbon said:

Umm, do you know of any singers who are not wandering philanderers?

I mean, I know there are some, but thats the generic stereotype, frankly, and while stereotypes shouldn't be applied to any individual without specific evidence, they are formed for a reason... 

Its also not true.
Dareon and Bael spring to mind immediately. Not as Pod's father obviously, but as wandering philandering singers, supporting the generic stereotype.

It's a stereotype, I accept. That's why I said it could be anyone else immediately after. I don't imply you took it out of context, tis too minor. Anyway, GRRM doesn't believe in leaving any loose ends. Chekov's gun is surely needed in such a large epic. Every minor detail connects to something else somewhere. Like Quhoro Mo's ship. Brings Dany news of Robert's death. Brings Sam and Co. to Oldtown from Braavos. GRRM tied a seemingly unnecessary new character to a more important role later on in the series. Hopefully he'll do the same with Tom, Pod, the latter's mom and probable half sibling with some character with unknown fate, say Tyrek.

 

And both Pod and Tom have the BwB in common now. Too much coincidences. It's just a hunch, intuition or gut feeling or whatever anyway. Tom being the wandering singer I mean

 

Fair enough about Dareon and Baek the Bard. Maybe even Mance and Rhaegar. 

Edited November 11, 2020 by TheLastWolf
Gut feeling

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

On 11/5/2020 at 7:34 AM, TheLastWolf said:

1.       Please don’t take this as pretentious or something, but we really need a new Small Qs thread. Said so 5/6 pages ago. Please @Rhaenys_Targaryen. Getting really difficult to keep track and locate older questions. So it would be really great if some mod locks, unpins and/or archives this thread, pins the new one by Lady Rhaenys (presumably) and we all post away!

 

On 11/10/2020 at 2:59 PM, TheLastWolf said:

It's official. Snubbed. Not the first time. But yeah, senior members know better and they may have more than a valid reason to continue this small q thread

It's official. Impatient and insulting people without reason.

I don't visit the forum as frequently as I once used to. So don't take not receiving a response for some days as an insult. There is no reason for it, after all

Usually, threads are closed after about 20 pages for length, but there are some exceptions. Those exceptions are made by the moderators. So should a moderator decide that a new version of this thread should be started, we will likely see a message here, or the thread will simply be closed.

Either way, it is not my decision to make.

(Nor does a threads length impact the search function of the forum, by the way ) 

[Ser Leftwich]

8 hours ago, TheLastWolf said:

 Anyway, GRRM doesn't believe in leaving any loose ends. Chekov's gun is surely needed in such a large epic. Every minor detail connects to something else somewhere.

GRRM does leave loose ends all the time. The nature of the POV style of the books means there are loose ends everywhere.

Chekov's gun is thrown around here too liberally. Chekov mostly wrote plays and short stories (and only one novel), when economy of words and details is absolutely necessary. GRRM tells us more about the foods at a feast than he does about some characters. It is not reasonable to apply Chekov's Gun to every single item and character that appears on the page.  Almost the complete opposite would happen in a large epic with limited POVs, because different people inevitably notice different things. If/when it comes up with lots of people, maybe. Once, off-hand, meh. As soon as Tom mentions he had a bastard or two in the Westerlands from 12-14 years ago, we have something.

Not every minor detail connects to something. It can't.

Other wise the books would be finished....

[TheLastWolf]

10 hours ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

 

It's official. Impatient and insulting people without reason.

I don't visit the forum as frequently as I once used to. So don't take not receiving a response for some days as an insult. There is no reason for it, after all

Usually, threads are closed after about 20 pages for length, but there are some exceptions. Those exceptions are made by the moderators. So should a moderator decide that a new version of this thread should be started, we will likely see a message here, or the thread will simply be closed.

Either way, it is not my decision to make.

(Nor does a threads length impact the search function of the forum, by the way ) 

Apologies. I saw that you were online after I had posted the former of those two posts. That's why. And it has happened to me a few times before due to reasons I'd rather not discuss here openly. Just that my non English speaking status and age is enough for now. Sorry if I offended you or anyone. You made me understand clearly. 

10 hours ago, Ser Leftwich said:

Not every minor detail connects to something. It can't.

Other wise the books would be finished....

Maybe the books aren't finished because GRRM is busy revisiting older books to tie up all loose ends?