Shade of the evening.

[Impbread]

Do the tress that make shade of the evening receive sacrifices like the weirwood trees of westeros? What does everyone think? Honestly i have no idea but i would guess so. How else could you see the future without some sort of sacrifice.

[jthurman14]

I do not recall any direct mention of sacrifice to the trees. My impression was that it made slaves of those who use it in exchange for magical abilities. An addiction metaphor of sorts.  However in the house of the undying they were obviously trying to steal Danys life force, one could infer it was being given to the trees as a sacrifice.

[Euron III Greyjoy]

Its definitely possible. Pretty much most magic in ASOIAF requires some kind of sacrifice. 

[Mat92]

On 2/2/2019 at 2:00 AM, Euron III Greyjoy said:

Its definitely possible. Pretty much most magic in ASOIAF requires some kind of sacrifice. 

Agree. The way I look at magic in ASOIAF is like energy in real life. It can't really be created or destroyed, it just changes form. Therefore for magic to occur, there needs to be some catalyst or cost for making it happen (such as sacrifice) to balance it out. 

[Ibbison from Ibben]

Those trees that Shade of the Evening is made from are one of the most underestimated mysteries of the series, IMO. (They need a name. I have suggested "Shadewoods" on several occasions, but it has never caught on.) Black trunks and blue leaves - complimentary and opposite to the red and white weirwoods.

And who are those little mini-dwarf servitors at the HotU? Are they supposed to be complimentary and opposite to the CotF? Were the Undying themselves complimentary and opposite to the Green Men of the Isle of Faces? Many people think Bloodraven contacted Euron Greyjoy when he was a boy via dream. What if was someone from the other side - the shadewood side?

[Seams]

3 hours ago, Ibbison from Ibben said:

Those trees that Shade of the Evening is made from are one of the most underestimated mysteries of the series, IMO. (They need a name. I have suggested "Shadewoods" on several occasions, but it has never caught on.) Black trunks and blue leaves - complimentary and opposite to the red and white weirwoods.

This suggests some new connections in my mind.

I have seen "ebony" hints in the books that I thought probably allude to Bloodraven as a member of the Blackwood family. But the black trees that make Shade of the Evening might be even more and better direct references to the Blackwoods. What would a Blackwood symbol be doing in Dany's arc? I wonder whether the ironwood trees and House Yronwood are part of the same group of symbols?

In my attempts to analyze colors using the rainbow motif in the books, the color indigo was a bit of a mystery. It was missing from Renly's Rainbow Guard scheme, for one thing. It hadn't crossed my mind until now, but indigo is kind of the "shade" of the evening. Dany does see a couple people with indigo eyes in her visions in the HotU, and the air/lighting in some rooms is described as being an "indigo murk." Solving the Shade of the Evening questions might help to pinpoint the indigo answers that have eluded me.

I wonder whether Renly's death might be another clue: he is mysteriously killed by a shadow. Perhaps, ironically, this "shade" is the indigo killer that had been missing from his guard group. Aerys was killed by one of his own King's Guard; maybe Renly was slain by a similar traitor to the rainbow.

[White Ravens]

3 hours ago, Ibbison from Ibben said:

Those trees that Shade of the Evening is made from are one of the most underestimated mysteries of the series, IMO. (They need a name. I have suggested "Shadewoods" on several occasions, but it has never caught on.) Black trunks and blue leaves - complimentary and opposite to the red and white weirwoods.

And who are those little mini-dwarf servitors at the HotU? Are they supposed to be complimentary and opposite to the CotF? Were the Undying themselves complimentary and opposite to the Green Men of the Isle of Faces? Many people think Bloodraven contacted Euron Greyjoy when he was a boy via dream. What if was someone from the other side - the shadewood side?

Interesting.  Euron appears to have started drinking Shade of the Evening after he captured and tortured four warlocks on a galleas out of Qarth (including Pyat Pree), along with their cask of Shade of the Evening.  It would appear that he is torturing them to gain knowledge of dark magic. 

[Sigella]

47 minutes ago, Seams said:

This suggests some new connections in my mind.

I have seen "ebony" hints in the books that I thought probably allude to Bloodraven as a member of the Blackwood family. But the black trees that make Shade of the Evening might be even more and better direct references to the Blackwoods. What would a Blackwood symbol be doing in Dany's arc? I wonder whether the ironwood trees and House Yronwood are part of the same group of symbols?

In my attempts to analyze colors using the rainbow motif in the books, the color indigo was a bit of a mystery. It was missing from Renly's Rainbow Guard scheme, for one thing. It hadn't crossed my mind until now, but indigo is kind of the "shade" of the evening. Dany does see a couple people with indigo eyes in her visions in the HotU, and the air/lighting in some rooms is described as being an "indigo murk." Solving the Shade of the Evening questions might help to pinpoint the indigo answers that have eluded me.

I wonder whether Renly's death might be another clue: he is mysteriously killed by a shadow. Perhaps, ironically, this "shade" is the indigo killer that had been missing from his guard group. Aerys was killed by one of his own King's Guard; maybe Renly was slain by a similar traitor to the rainbow.

A spin in this theme might be people who drink shade of the evening gets blue lips, whereas people using sourleaf gets a blood-red mouth.

Sourleafers are plentiful; Masha Heddle, Yoren, Chett, ser Eammon Frey, Marwyn, Snatch and Bennis.

Shaders are fewer; warlocks of Qarth, (Daenerys, Aeron) and Euron

Only pattern I can see is a socio-economic one with lowborn favouring red (colour of socialism, only exception is Eammon who comes from a minor and ill viewed house) and highborns more likely shaders (blue is the colour for conservatism and aristocracy, exception would be for warlocks that could come from anywhere, but I have a hunch that they aren't riffraff)

[White Ravens]

24 minutes ago, Sigella said:

A spin in this theme might be people who drink shade of the evening gets blue lips, whereas people using sourleaf gets a blood-red mouth.

Sourleafers are plentiful; Masha Heddle, Yoren, Chett, ser Eammon Frey, Marwyn, Snatch and Bennis.

Shaders are fewer; warlocks of Qarth, (Daenerys, Aeron) and Euron

Only pattern I can see is a socio-economic one with lowborn favouring red (colour of socialism, only exception is Eammon who comes from a minor and ill viewed house) and highborns more likely shaders (blue is the colour for conservatism and aristocracy, exception would be for warlocks that could come from anywhere, but I have a hunch that they aren't riffraff)

You are right in that sourleaf stains the mouth red, but there is no indication that it has anything to do with weirwoods or the inky blue leafed trees used to make Shade of the Evening.  It is more like chewing tobacco.

Shade of the evening is only consumed by the warlocks of Qarth except for one instance when Pyat Pree encouraged Daenerys to drink a flute of the stuff.  Other than that we have Euron seizing a cask when he captured four warlocks from Qarth.  He appears to have developed a taste for it and there are a couple of instances of him offering it or forcing it onto his brothers.  I would say that its consumption is more exclusive than elitist. 

[Clegane'sPup]

On 2/1/2019 at 12:13 PM, Impbread said:

Do the tress that make shade of the evening receive sacrifices like the weirwood trees of westeros?

I'm not sure I read about weirwoods requiring sacrifices. Chalk it up to faulty memory.

On 2/1/2019 at 12:13 PM, Impbread said:

How else could you see the future without some sort of sacrifice. 

Eat the weirwood paste & sap or drink the purple juice made from fermented leaves and have a hallucinogenic experience.

 

 

[Dorian Martell's son]

On 2/1/2019 at 9:13 AM, Impbread said:

Do the tress that make shade of the evening receive sacrifices like the weirwood trees of westeros? What does everyone think? Honestly i have no idea but i would guess so. How else could you see the future without some sort of sacrifice.

Nope. nothing in the books about it. If the shade trees required a sacrifice, it would have been mentioned. 
The blue wine made from the bark is magical. that is it 

[Clegane'sPup]

 

14 minutes ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

The blue wine made from the bark is magical.

did the bark have fungus on it

or was it succulent like cacti

wonder if an old hippie has knowledge about LSD or peyote

all in good cheer

I would like for someone to rattle my grey cells about the weirwood requiring sacrifice

 

 

[Back door hodor]

I think the price one pays for shade of the evening is that they want/crave it(or the power it gives them), seems like an addiction metaphor to me, and I would not associate them as closely with wiedwoods as others seem too, other than being another type of magic tree

[Sigella]

2 hours ago, White Ravens said:

You are right in that sourleaf stains the mouth red, but there is no indication that it has anything to do with weirwoods or the inky blue leafed trees used to make Shade of the Evening.  It is more like chewing tobacco.

Shade of the evening is only consumed by the warlocks of Qarth except for one instance when Pyat Pree encouraged Daenerys to drink a flute of the stuff.  Other than that we have Euron seizing a cask when he captured four warlocks from Qarth.  He appears to have developed a taste for it and there are a couple of instances of him offering it or forcing it onto his brothers.  I would say that its consumption is more exclusive than elitist. 

If we have two different things that people use that stains their mouths they are worth taking a look at together.

That said I dont think GRRM is mirroring real life ideologies through mouth colours either but it was the only pattern I found.

[Dorian Martell's son]

2 hours ago, Clegane'sPup said:

did the bark have fungus on it

or was it succulent like cacti

wonder if an old hippie has knowledge about LSD or peyote

all in good cheer

It's dark blue so I would go with fungus. 

2 hours ago, Clegane'sPup said:

I would like for someone to rattle my grey cells about the weirwood requiring sacrifice

There are numerous references in the books to weirwood sacrifices. We see one in Bran's vision and we are told that once the northerners drove the pirates and slavers from the wolf's den they covered the heart tree with the entrails of the tormentors 

[BRANDON GREYSTARK]

It smells like rotting meat . Warlock blood .

[White Ravens]

4 hours ago, Clegane'sPup said:

 

did the bark have fungus on it

or was it succulent like cacti

wonder if an old hippie has knowledge about LSD or peyote

all in good cheer

 

1 hour ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

It's dark blue so I would go with fungus.

I agree.  Psilocybin is the ingredient in some mushrooms that makes them "magic".  When present it makes mushrooms bruise blue.  Of course on Planetos any hallucinogenic substance is gonna provide effects that would put actual magic into magic mushrooms and preparations like weirwood paste and shade of the evening.  One could expect that real visions and prophecies could be found when consuming them but there is always the caveat that prophecies will ultimately kick you in the head or bite off your prick. 

[White Ravens]

3 hours ago, Sigella said:

If we have two different things that people use that stains their mouths they are worth taking a look at together.

I agree.

[Quoth the raven,]

On 2/1/2019 at 12:13 PM, Impbread said:

Do the tress that make shade of the evening receive sacrifices like the weirwood trees of westeros? What does everyone think? Honestly i have no idea but i would guess so. How else could you see the future without some sort of sacrifice.

We are not told what fed the trees.  The Undying, otoh, are kept alive by the beating heart.  It's obvious to me that somebody donated that heart.  Voluntary or not, it's still a sacrifice.  The weirwood trees feed on human blood.  Can we infer from this info that the dark trees also require human blood?  

Daenerys Targaryen and Bran Stark are the two parallel characters in these novels.  Daenerys has the power to resist heat, hatch dragons, prophetic dreams, and George knows what else.  Bran can skinchange the lower animals, see backwards and forwards through the ribbon of time, and feed off the weir roots.  The Shade of the Evening opened her eyes and we can assume the Jojen soup did the same for him.  Both mixtures come from unusual trees.  Both heroes encounter small, humanoids who take care of the immobile magic people.  Why they would do this is still unanswered.  

Bran saw the history of the Starks.  The birth of the Winterfell weirwood tree and the human sacrifice given.  The time trip covered the thousands of years since the founding of the castle.  Dany's trip was not so far back in time but much more was given in the way of details.  Her trip went back 15 years and forward to the tableau of the naked woman and the dwarfs.   

 

[White Ravens]

2 hours ago, Quoth the raven, said:

We are not told what fed the trees.  The Undying, otoh, are kept alive by the beating heart.  It's obvious to me that somebody donated that heart.  Voluntary or not, it's still a sacrifice.  The weirwood trees feed on human blood.  Can we infer from this info that the dark trees also require human blood?  

Daenerys Targaryen and Bran Stark are the two parallel characters in these novels.  Daenerys has the power to resist heat, hatch dragons, prophetic dreams, and George knows what else.  Bran can skinchange the lower animals, see backwards and forwards through the ribbon of time, and feed off the weir roots.  The Shade of the Evening opened her eyes and we can assume the Jojen soup did the same for him.  Both mixtures come from unusual trees.  Both heroes encounter small, humanoids who take care of the immobile magic people.  Why they would do this is still unanswered.  

Bran saw the history of the Starks.  The birth of the Winterfell weirwood tree and the human sacrifice given.  The time trip covered the thousands of years since the founding of the castle.  Dany's trip was not so far back in time but much more was given in the way of details.  Her trip went back 15 years and forward to the tableau of the naked woman and the dwarfs.   

 

We can assume that weirwood paste helped open Bran's eyes.  Jojen soup is an unproven theory at this point.