Poll: Is Daario actually Euron?

[Leo of House Cartel]

19 hours ago, Platypus Rex said:

Would it give you any pause, or any tingle, to consider that Bloodbeard, the sellsword captain who is supposedly holding Daario hostage, bears a suspicious resemblance to the Red Oarsman, who is one of Euron's captains?  Both have fiery red hair, in braids.

Yeah, that's an interesting catch, but it looks more like a subtle parallel between Euron and Daario to me, as opposed to thinking that the Red Oarsman and Bloodbeard (two illustrious characters, to be sure) are also one and the same. I take this more as George sneakily placing similarities/connections between the characters, subliminal hints which might make the reader draw comparisons between Greyjoy and Naharis - perhaps with the aim of getting us to question both men's motives. 

If you put the bit about the Oarsman together with Dany's dream about her blue lipped lover, I can see comparisons being drawn between the Iron King and the Sellsword Captain, but in my eyes this still doesn't seem like enough evidence for the E=D theory. 

If I could be so bold as to ask; what is it that drives you towards the Euron + Daario idea?

[Platypus Rex]

22 minutes ago, Leo of House Cartel said:

Yeah, that's an interesting catch, but it looks more like a subtle parallel between Euron and Daario to me, as opposed to thinking that the Red Oarsman and Bloodbeard (two illustrious characters, to be sure) are also one and the same. I take this more as George sneakily placing similarities/connections between the characters, subliminal hints which might make the reader draw comparisons between Greyjoy and Naharis - perhaps with the aim of getting us to question both men's motives. 

If you put the bit about the Oarsman together with Dany's dream about her blue lipped lover, I can see comparisons being drawn between the Iron King and the Sellsword Captain, but in my eyes this still doesn't seem like enough evidence for the E=D theory. 

If I could be so bold as to ask; what is it that drives you towards the Euron + Daario idea?

The same thing that drives me toward the Sandor/Gravedigger idea, specifically, the various clues and evidences.

None of these clues or evidences are airtight.  Hence, they all can be explained away by someone who (for whatever reason) does not particularly want to believe the theory.  I have no particular argument against the objections you are raising above; none other than that they are no different from the sort of objections one could raise to Sandor/Gravedigger.

But here's the thing:  People WANT to believe that Sandor is the Gravedigger.  No-one wants to believe he is actually dead.

People do NOT WANT to believe that Daario = Euron.  And of course, no subtle clue can force them.

The other difference is the time/distance objection.  Sandor/Gravedigger are easy to coordinate in time and place.  Euron/Daario whether workable or not, is, at the very least, a timeline headache.

[Platypus Rex]

2 hours ago, Ser Hedge said:

"He could just betray her and have some kind of backstory, neither of which would be too complicated or obscure."

Sure.  Once GRRM reveals all his secrets, they will no longer be obscure.  I just assumed you were referring to the present.

One of my habits, when looking at theories, is to look for converging plot threads.  Thus, if I can find a single solution for two mysteries, I feel I am doing better than when I come up with two entirely separate solutions for those two mysteries.  Think of it as a variant of Occham's Razor.

I don't know if this is good practice or not in GRRM's case.  Maybe he's so caught up in his worldbuilding that he just keeps splintering out in all directions, and the series will never be finished.  But it does not seem such a terrible idea to assume that plot threads are going to start converging at some point.

"But to have him be Euron in disguise starting from Dany's siege of Yunkai (and to be one of the storm crow captains at that time, he needed to have started even earlier) through her reign of Mereen, while leaving the Silence with its weird collection of inmates with an understudy, but not claiming a dragon when he could have done so easily and then to send his daft brother all the way back to do the same - all this is obscure and complicated."

You are basically saying that Mad Euron's behavior is obscure and complicated, and insinuate that these problems go away if he is NOT Daario.  But they don't.  They just don't.

Euron was obviously in the South Coast of Essos at the same time as Dany.  We may infer this, because (among other reasons) Euron has Pyat Pree on board his ship, when he arrives at the Iron Islands.  So obviously, Euron captured Pree after Dany left Qarth for Slaver's Bay.  The warlocks were still free, 2 weeks after Dany left Qarth, when they set out after her on a Galleas.  Euron captured them some time after that.  Hence, Dany was probably in Slaver's Bay by then.  And then Euron, after capturing the warlocks, sailed to the Iron Islands.  So, why did he sail all the way to the Iron Islands, and then to the Shields, just to give the horn to Victarion?  Why not go straight to Dany with the Horn, and use it himself.  I don't know.  Neither do you.  He's got something up his sleeve that we don't understand … something complicated … something obscure … even if he is NOT Daario.  

---------------x

Also, Euron can start creating the Daario persona as early as he likes.   He is an infamous pirate, and obviously needs an alias when he goes ashore.  Evidently, his associate, the Red Oarsman, has long had a similar shore alias as Bloodbeard, the leader of the Company of the Cat.  There is nothing whatsoever surprising about infamous criminals having an alias.  It is not as though they acquire these alternate identities, on the spur of the moment, only for Dany's sake.

[Leo of House Cartel]

7 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

The same thing that drives me toward the Sandor/Gravedigger idea, specifically, the various clues and evidences.

None of these clues or evidences are airtight.  Hence, they all can be explained away by someone who (for whatever reason) does not particularly want to believe the theory.  I have no particular argument against the objections you are raising above; none other than that they are no different from the sort of objections one could raise to Sandor/Gravedigger.

But here's the thing:  People WANT to believe that Sandor is the Gravedigger.  No-one wants to believe he is actually dead.

People do NOT WANT to believe that Daario = Euron.  And of course, no subtle clue can force them.

The other difference is the time/distance objection.  Sandor/Gravedigger are easy to coordinate in time and place.  Euron/Daario whether workable or not, is, at the very least, a timeline headache.

Fair enough man, I respect your opinion - I remain on the nay list, for now, but it's always interesting to read opinions which differ from my own, variety being the spice of life and all.

In any case, I'm in no position to hate on anyone for a Euron Greyjoy based theory, as my ideas regarding the man usually descend into a spaghetti bowl's worth of skinchanged squids, tall tales, taller towers and disappointed tree men, with the odd spooky dark lord thrown in for good measure 

That's an interesting point you raise about people believing what they want - reminds me of a glamour using the power of an individual's own expectations-and-perceptions. 

[Lost Melnibonean]

On 2/8/2019 at 6:09 PM, Platypus Rex said:

Thank you for the suggestions for my next "unpopular theory" poll.

But I'm not sure if "Lemore = Ashara" is unpopular enough.  I might have to go with a specific variant of it. 

Personally, I'm a believer in "Lemore = Mellario"

"Quaithe=Sierra" is maybe a little too obscure, even if correct.  Does anything turn on whether Quaithe is Sierra Seastar, as opposed to being any other ancient random ancient sorcerer?

The legacy of the Great Bastards lives on. Bloodraven is Bran's three-eyed crow, and I think Shiera Seastar is Quaithe. Daemon and Bittersteel proved to be more mortal, but Aegon appears likely to be the descendant of Daemon, and the Golden Company, wittingly or not, appears to be fulfilling the dream of Bittersteel. 

[The Mother of The Others]

Euron has given Vic a trap to spring.  By doing the obvious revenge play (claiming Dany and dragons for himself), Vic will spring the trap and deliver everything Euron wants.  The question becomes, where will Euron want to collect his winnings?   I assumed he'd be fine waiting for Vic to come all the way back to Westeros before revealing there were no bullets in vic's gun.  This way Euron could accomplish max coolness on his own till then with ships.   But, if the plan requires Euron to pick up his dragon Immediately after Vic steps in the trap...... it occurs to me that Dany would turn to Daario if some brute tried to manhandle her and she lost a dragon and was disconsolate even after incinerating Victarion.  She'd not only turn to Daario but would be movable by him as perhaps never before.  She might say Screw Arranged Marriages!  Let's make our thing official so I never have to go through a farce like Meereen Guy and Vic Guy again! 

The point of Euron being Daario could be that only after she's in emotional turmoil from the Vic encounter can Euron/Daario then hold her and convince her uncalmed mind to step into the 2nd stage of the trap Euron has set specifically for her.  So he'd need to be on site for that, to take advantage of her in a ruffled state while she's still suggestible?   

[BalerionTheCat]

10 hours ago, Platypus Rex said:

Let me suggest an obvious starting point.  She may be YG's mother, whoever else she may be.  In any event, if your theory does not account for her at all, you may be missing something.

The Aegon Blackfyre theory is not mine. I've no doubt about it. I'm just speculating a bit about the depth of Varys' involvement. Introducing Lemore as YG mother complicates everything. A good theory is a simple and obvious one. Which most are still in pain to see or accept. Lemore is better as an exile with an interest against the Targaryens (there are plenty). If not, just a nobody. Maybe a septa, disgraced and sent to slavery. And later bought by Illrio.

13 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

We're not popular?   Actually that explains a lot.   This is one of the few "theories" i'm really expecting to bear fruit though.  It feels all kinds of right.   And that's how you nab George-

I agree totally. But A+J=T is so popular you feel flooded when you mention C+J. One with no more support than: 1) the other 2 main characters with dead a mother are Targaryens, 2) wishful thinking of Tyrion riding a dragon.
And yeah, I have a fruit in mind. Balerion, Rhaenys's cat is that fruit.

[Ser Hedge]

8 hours ago, Platypus Rex said:

Sure.  Once GRRM reveals all his secrets, they will no longer be obscure.  I just assumed you were referring to the present.

One of my habits, when looking at theories, is to look for converging plot threads.  Thus, if I can find a single solution for two mysteries, I feel I am doing better than when I come up with two entirely separate solutions for those two mysteries.  Think of it as a variant of Occham's Razor.

I don't know if this is good practice or not in GRRM's case.  Maybe he's so caught up in his worldbuilding that he just keeps splintering out in all directions, and the series will never be finished.  But it does not seem such a terrible idea to assume that plot threads are going to start converging at some point.

"But to have him be Euron in disguise starting from Dany's siege of Yunkai (and to be one of the storm crow captains at that time, he needed to have started even earlier) through her reign of Mereen, while leaving the Silence with its weird collection of inmates with an understudy, but not claiming a dragon when he could have done so easily and then to send his daft brother all the way back to do the same - all this is obscure and complicated."

You are basically saying that Mad Euron's behavior is obscure and complicated, and insinuate that these problems go away if he is NOT Daario.  But they don't.  They just don't.

Euron was obviously in the South Coast of Essos at the same time as Dany.  We may infer this, because (among other reasons) Euron has Pyat Pree on board his ship, when he arrives at the Iron Islands.  So obviously, Euron captured Pree after Dany left Qarth for Slaver's Bay.  The warlocks were still free, 2 weeks after Dany left Qarth, when they set out after her on a Galleas.  Euron captured them some time after that.  Hence, Dany was probably in Slaver's Bay by then.  And then Euron, after capturing the warlocks, sailed to the Iron Islands.  So, why did he sail all the way to the Iron Islands, and then to the Shields, just to give the horn to Victarion?  Why not go straight to Dany with the Horn, and use it himself.  I don't know.  Neither do you.  He's got something up his sleeve that we don't understand … something complicated … something obscure … even if he is NOT Daario.  

---------------x

Also, Euron can start creating the Daario persona as early as he likes.   He is an infamous pirate, and obviously needs an alias when he goes ashore.  Evidently, his associate, the Red Oarsman, has long had a similar shore alias as Bloodbeard, the leader of the Company of the Cat.  There is nothing whatsoever surprising about infamous criminals having an alias.  It is not as though they acquire these alternate identities, on the spur of the moment, only for Dany's sake.

Ok, fair they didn't acquire the identities on the spur of the moment, but being a sellsword captain is not like putting your glasses on and becoming Clark Kent whenever you're done with your other identity. I think your authority over your sellswords is severely undermined if you keep taking off every now and then.

[Platypus Rex]

7 hours ago, Ser Hedge said:

Ok, fair they didn't acquire the identities on the spur of the moment, but being a sellsword captain is not like putting your glasses on and becoming Clark Kent whenever you're done with your other identity. I think your authority over your sellswords is severely undermined if you keep taking off every now and then.

Hmm, yes, but recall that there were THREE captains of the Stormcrows.  And the other two seemed to assume that Daario was a junior member, and that they were (now) in charge.  Perhaps, they thought, his authority had been undermined by his absences.  Not that we need assume there were too many prior absences, since his whereabouts are entirely unknown during this period.

And as for his absences since he has left Dany (on 3 long occasions), we have no basis for assuming that his authority has NOT been undermined.

Nor do you avoid this problem by assuming that Daario and Euron are different people. 

On at least one of the occasions when Daario leaves Dany, he also leaves the Stormcrows.  Allegedly he meekly does this to be a hostage of Bloodbeard, who is allegedly NOT actually his good buddy the Red Oarsman.   When he leaves the Stormcrows, he leaves the Stormcrows in charge of an axe-man named the Widower (an obvious alias), who is allegedly NOT yet another of his Ironborn buddies (Ironborn favor axes).

Nor do you avoid this problem with Euron.  After seizing the throne on the Iron Islands, does he remain behind to make sure his position is secure?  No.  He puts Erik Ironmaker on the throne, and heads out into the blue.  When he conquers the Shields, does he remain behind to make sure his position is sure?  No.  He hand authority of the Shields over to idiots (knowing that he will get the credit for conquering them, and they will get the blame for losing them), and heads out into the blue yet again.

[Ser Hedge]

14 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

Hmm, yes, but recall that there were THREE captains of the Stormcrows.  And the other two seemed to assume that Daario was a junior member, and that they were (now) in charge.  Perhaps, they thought, his authority had been undermined by his absences.  Not that we need assume there were too many prior absences, since his whereabouts are entirely unknown during this period.

And as for his absences since he has left Dany (on 3 long occasions), we have no basis for assuming that his authority has NOT been undermined.

Nor do you avoid this problem by assuming that Daario and Euron are different people. 

On at least one of the occasions when Daario leaves Dany, he also leaves the Stormcrows.  Allegedly he meekly does this to be a hostage of Bloodbeard, who is allegedly NOT actually his good buddy the Red Oarsman.   When he leaves the Stormcrows, he leaves the Stormcrows in charge of an axe-man named the Widower (an obvious alias), who is allegedly NOT yet another of his Ironborn buddies (Ironborn favor axes).

Nor do you avoid this problem with Euron.  After seizing the throne on the Iron Islands, does he remain behind to make sure his position is secure?  No.  He puts Erik Ironmaker on the throne, and heads out into the blue.  When he conquers the Shields, does he remain behind to make sure his position is sure?  No.  He hand authority of the Shields over to idiots (knowing that he will get the credit for conquering them, and they will get the blame for losing them), and heads out into the blue yet again.

I meant before Dany comes to Yunkai, how did Daario/Euron keep slipping in and out of his Clark Kent identity as the third (junior) captain? And how does his wingman step back into the Bloodbeard role wherever he likes without the company having mutineed on him in his absence?

Daario's actual absences in the story are because he's on a mission from the ruler who pays the company's wages, not random, mysterious disappearances, so not the same thing. Can this absence also cause him to lose control of his company? Maybe, but that's off topic really.

[Platypus Rex]

48 minutes ago, Ser Hedge said:

I meant before Dany comes to Yunkai, how did Daario/Euron keep slipping in and out of his Clark Kent identity as the third (junior) captain? And how does his wingman step back into the Bloodbeard role wherever he likes without the company having mutineed on him in his absence?

Daario's actual absences in the story are because he's on a mission from the ruler who pays the company's wages, not random, mysterious disappearances, so not the same thing. Can this absence also cause him to lose control of his company? Maybe, but that's off topic really.

I've already answered your question, to the extent that it was reasonable or possible to do so.  And even that contained rank speculation.  Bottom line is, I cannot answer your question, because I was not there, and I don't know how it went down.  I'm not going to write a complete work of fan fiction for you to critique.

How did Euron just sail back to the Iron Islands, after being absent for years, get himself made King within the space of a month or less, and then leave again immediately without losing all the power he just seized?  Well, I guess you had to be there.

So how do you want me to answer the questions you are now asking?  I don't know.  I wasn't there.  But, aside from Euron's rumored magical powers, he seems to be very good at manipulating vicious greedy people.  And sellswords are vicious greedy people.  And those he cannot manipulate, he seems to be very good at murdering.

As for Bloodbeard / The Red Oarsman, we know even less about him/them than we do about Daario / Euron.  And in the former case, it is obvious, and not even a secret, that both names are aliases.  It might even be common knowledge, among those familiar with him, that Bloodbeard and the Red Oarsman are one and the same.  It may be a secret only from the reader, who knows next-to-nothing about him.

[Clegane'sPup]

18 hours ago, Platypus Rex said:

Euron was obviously in the South Coast of Essos at the same time as Dany.  We may infer this, because (among other reasons) Euron has Pyat Pree on board his ship, when he arrives at the Iron Islands.  So obviously, Euron captured Pree after Dany left Qarth for Slaver's Bay. 

Yes, according to an unpublished  WoW chapter Euron has Pyat Pree in the bowels of his ship. But if a person wants to argue/disagree/conjecture the warlock Euron has is not Pree but a warlock who is a member of Pree's flock.  Pree, Pree, Pree.

I guess the question is when did Dany leave Quarth?

In DwD there is a discussion that Pyat left a fortnight after Dany and was headed to Pentos to seek her out.

A Dance with Dragons - Daenerys III    "Not all your enemies are in the Yellow City. Beware men with cold hearts and blue lips. You had not been gone from Qarth a fortnight when Pyat Pree set out with three of his fellow warlocks, to seek for you in Pentos."    Dany was more amused than afraid. "It is good I turned aside, then. Pentos is half a world from Meereen."/

Appears that back in SoS Dany's and her troupe left Quarth intending to go to Pentos and ended up at Slaver's Bay.  Sumthin changed.

[book three] A Storm of Swords - Daenerys I    On the day the three ships had lifted anchor at Quarth, you would have thought they were sailing to hell instead of Pentos.

Let's find out what is going on with Euron.

[book two] A Clash of Kings - Theon II        Theon shifted his seat. "My uncle Euron has not been seen in the islands for close on two years. He may be dead." If so, it might be for the best.

[book three] A Storm of Swords - Catelyn V     "Euron. Crow's Eye, they call him, as black a pirate as ever raised a sail. He's been gone for years, but Lord Balon was no sooner cold than there he was, sailing into Lordsport in his Silence. Black sails and a red hull, and crewed by mutes. He'd been to Asshai and back, I heard./

In book three ^ Euron is home to the Iron Isles.

Let's look at Dany's first encounter with Daario in book three.

A Storm of Swords - Daenerys IV      and Daario Naharis was flamboyant even for a Tyroshi. His beard was cut into three prongs and dyed blue, the same color as his eyes and the curly hair that fell to his collar. His pointed mustachios were painted gold. His clothes were all shades of yellow; a foam of Myrish lace the color of butter spilled from his collar and cuffs, his doublet was sewn with brass medallions in the shape of dandelions, and ornamental goldwork crawled up his high leather boots to his thighs. Gloves of soft yellow suede were tucked into a belt of gilded rings, and his fingernails were enameled blue./

Yes, martin writes his chapters out of sequence.

A reach and a stretch--- Euron's magics make him able to skin change across the sea, No, Daario is not Euron. Nor is Euron Daario. Euron is flying high on that blue lip juice.

 

 

 

[Platypus Rex]

16 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Yes, martin writes his chapters out of sequence.

A reach and a stretch--- Euron's magics makes him able to skin change, No, Daario is not Euron. Nor is Euron Daario. Euron is flying high on that blue lip juice.

Thank you for your vote.  And thank you for all the interesting quotes.  

[Platypus Rex]

55 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Yes, according to an unpublished  WoW chapter Euron has Pyat Pree in the bowels of his ship. But if a person wants to argue/disagree/conjecture the warlock Euron has is not Pree but a warlock who is a member of Pree's flock.  Pree, Pree, Pree.

I guess the question is when did Dany leave Quarth?

In DwD there is a discussion that Pyat left a fortnight after Dany and was headed to Pentos to seek her out.

A Dance with Dragons - Daenerys III    "Not all your enemies are in the Yellow City. Beware men with cold hearts and blue lips. You had not been gone from Qarth a fortnight when Pyat Pree set out with three of his fellow warlocks, to seek for you in Pentos."    Dany was more amused than afraid. "It is good I turned aside, then. Pentos is half a world from Meereen."/

Appears that back in SoS Dany's and her troupe left Quarth intending to go to Pentos and ended up at Slaver's Bay.  Sumthin changed.

Yes, she changed her mind after leaving Qarth.

Here's another quote, from "The Reaver" in AFFC; Euron tells Victarion: "Shade-of-the-evening […].  I came upon a cask of it when I captured a certain galleas out of Qarth along with […] four warlocks who told a curious tale."  He kills one of the warlocks and fees him to the other three.

I find it hard to avoid the conclusion that these are the same 4 warlocks Xaro tells Dany about.

[Clegane'sPup]

36 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

Yes, she changed her mind after leaving Qarth.

Here's another quote, from "The Reaver" in AFFC; Euron tells Victarion: "Shade-of-the-evening […].  I came upon a cask of it when I captured a certain galleas out of Qarth along with […] four warlocks who told a curious tale."  He kills one of the warlocks and fees him to the other three.

I find it hard to avoid the conclusion that these are the same 4 warlocks Xaro tells Dany about.

While interesting how does this make Euron Daario or Daario Euron? 

Euron was floating round in the sea. Over took a ship. Does not change that Euron is at the Iron Isles when Dany first meets Daario.

[Platypus Rex]

14 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

"While interesting how does this make Euron Daario or Daario Euron?"

I never said it established anything.

"Euron was floating round in the sea. Over took a ship. Does not change that Euron is at the Iron Isles when Dany first meets Daario."

You have not established that Euron is in the Iron Islands at the same time that Dany meets Daario.  The information we are discussing suggests that Euron was somewhere between Qarth and Pentos at a time not too far removed from the time that Dany first meets Daario.

Chapters are not necessarily in chronological sequence.  Saying that something happened "during book 3" is meaningless.  We know some events in book 4, occurred before certain events described in book 3.  Specifically, the kingsmoot, that does not occur until many chapters into book 4, is referred to in the past tense, a thousand or more miles away, in book 3.

[Ser Hedge]

2 hours ago, Platypus Rex said:

I've already answered your question, to the extent that it was reasonable or possible to do so.  And even that contained rank speculation.  Bottom line is, I cannot answer your question, because I was not there, and I don't know how it went down.  I'm not going to write a complete work of fan fiction for you to critique.

How did Euron just sail back to the Iron Islands, after being absent for years, get himself made King within the space of a month or less, and then leave again immediately without losing all the power he just seized?  Well, I guess you had to be there.

So how do you want me to answer the questions you are now asking?  I don't know.  I wasn't there.  But, aside from Euron's rumored magical powers, he seems to be very good at manipulating vicious greedy people.  And sellswords are vicious greedy people.  And those he cannot manipulate, he seems to be very good at murdering.

As for Bloodbeard / The Red Oarsman, we know even less about him/them than we do about Daario / Euron.  And in the former case, it is obvious, and not even a secret, that both names are aliases.  It might even be common knowledge, among those familiar with him, that Bloodbeard and the Red Oarsman are one and the same.  It may be a secret only from the reader, who knows next-to-nothing about him.

Ok, I only want to clarify my earlier point - rebellions and mutinies can obviously happen at any level. However, institutions like Monarchies and Lordships see much less of it most of the time as the forces of status quo will usually band together against the rebel to uphold generally agreed laws or conventions of succession, mainly because the rest of the nobility does not want a free-for-all. Euron convinced the Kingsmoot he was going to make them rich by returning to their ancient reaving ways with mainland Westeros experiencing a power vacuum with Tywin dead and the Lannister and Tyrell Queens fighting for control with each other and the Faith. There is not much incentive for Ironborn in significant enough numbers to rebel against Euron while the reaving is going well and everybody's getting rich. Euron also buys off Victarion's key captains. So, George put in some work to show how Euron is systematically consolidating power. He did come back from exile, yes, but he is not a new face, most of the captains know him from before the Greyjoy rebellion. Finally, he hasn't disappeared from sight either, he's taken a part of the fleet to a different theatre of operations.

Running a sellsword company is something completely different, it doesn't lend itself to, "uh, I'm going to do a solo album where I get on a ship to get a dragonhorn, some warlocks and a dusky woman, but be back for the band's next live tour of Yunkai! See ya fellas!" - not unless you were maybe bankrolling the entire operation like an Illyrio, but then he wouldn't have to kill the other two captains to switch sides, right? Given how George has spent some time world building sellsword companies - through the eyes of Connington, Quentyn and Tyrion, he would be undermining it by having people walk on and off, in my opinion.

Of course, you are free to disagree and no, I don't expect you to write a complete piece of fan-fic (but fan-fic is what it would have to be, as it's not really holding up as a theory, is it?) and I even less expect you to have been there :-)

 

[Clegane'sPup]

2 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

I never said it established anything.

LOL, no, you did not.

 

3 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

"Euron was floating round in the sea. Over took a ship. Does not change that Euron is at the Iron Isles when Dany first meets Daario."

You have not established that "fact".  The information we are discussing suggests that Euron was somewhere between Qarth and Pentos at a time not too far removed from the time that Dany meets Daario.

Again, correct, I have established no fact.

Does not change that Euron was at the Iron Isles doing his blustering when Dany first met Daario. [book three]

6 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

Chapters are not necessarily in chronological sequence.  Saying that something happened "during book 3" is meaningless. 

FFS, I try to have an intelligent conversation with you and you revert to childish yammering. Get your David Mitchell on.

9 minutes ago, Platypus Rex said:

We know some events in book 4, occurred before certain events described in book 3.  Specifically, the kingsmoot, that does not occur until many chapters into book 4, is referred to in the past tense, a thousand or more miles away, in book 3.

Wanna know what I used to say to me children when they used the word "we"?  I'd ask if they had a mouse in their pocket.

[Platypus Rex]

8 minutes ago, Ser Hedge said:

(but fan-fic is what it would have to be, as it's not really holding up as a theory, is it?) 

Well, no, it's not winning the hearts and minds of the vast majority of fan's on this forum … if that's what you mean by "not holding up as a theory."  But that's not really the test, is it?  Whether it is right or wrong ultimately depends upon what GRRM writes in future volumes.

[Platypus Rex]

4 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Does not change that Euron was at the Iron Isles doing his blustering when Dany first met Daario. [book three]

In my opinion, Dany's last chapter in book 3, which ends with Daario still in Meereen (but about to leave as we later learn), probably takes place before the Kingsmoot chapters in book 4.  In turn, the Kingsmoot chapters in Book 4 certainly take place before the Catelyn chapter, in the middle of book 3, where Catelyn learns that Euron has already become king.

If you have evidence to the contrary, produce it.