Jump to content
Black Crow

Heresy 218 a brief walk on the dark side

Recommended Posts

11 hours ago, JNR said:

As I've suggested before, the point you raise above (would sickly-and-very-pregnant Elia have been there?) is very good reason to suspect the World book is simply not accurate on this point.  That is, Yandel deliberately pushed Aegon's birth months backwards in time. 

He rearranged events so that Rhaegar would not seem to have been attending his wife Elia at Dragonstone at a time when -- in Robert's profound belief -- Rhaegar was supposed to be busy kidnapping and raping Lyanna.  Giving Rhaegar an alibi would really not work for Yandel, obviously.

Yandel did this even though it meant Rhaegar went on his long road trip in the middle of the worst winter of his life... a concept which (like a heavily pregnant Elia attending Harrenhal) simply makes no sense.

Since GRRM has also told us outright in an interview that the World book contains some rearranged information because Yandel was trying to please Robert or his successors, this doesn't come as much surprise to me.

As much as it might benefit Yandal and Robert down the road to make Rhaegar look bad, they are only 15 years removed from these events when the book is published and gifted to Tommen. People should still remember the truth, so fudging the details very much for this book, would not really fool anyone. We are in the dark only because GRRM wants us to be. Of course, this book might only be for Tommen, and so the details in it and how false they might be, would never be told to the rest of Westeros. 

Personally, I doubt Rhaegar was a very good guy, so there might not be a reason to lie. But my mind might be clouded by my reread of Feast and the idea that story presents about singers who play the harp and are handsome, such as Dareon. I think he is Prince Silverstring's parallels in our story. Sansa also learns that singers are not what she imagined, considering her situation with Marillion. Stark maids don't have much luck with handsome singers, but they don't seem fooled by them, either. Especially Arya!

 

5 hours ago, Brad Stark said:

Rhaegar probably didn't want her there regardless.  If Elia knew about Lyanna, if she approved, she would want to avoid being there.  If she did not approve she might want to avoid the situation or might want to attend anyway . 

So most likely Elia didn't want to be there, but we know she was.  So either she was jealous of Lyanna and wanted to be there, or was there at the insistence of someone else, such as Aerys.  In either of those situations, I could see her making the trip even if she was heavily pregnant. 

So you think that Rhaegar and Lyanna knew each other before Harrenhal and it was prearranged for Rhaegar to stake a claim? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Elia would have to be at the tourney in order for Rhaegar to ride past her to give the laurel to Lyanna. It would be even more shocking if Elia were 5-7 months pregnant.

I just don't see how a later birth month for Aegon would even work. Lyanna goes missing in January 282, Brandon hears about her abduction and rides to Kings Landing, but Rhaegar is already gone. When did he impregnate his wife? Before or after the tourney? How did Elia get to Dragonstone? When and how did she get back to Kings Landing? Rhaegar attended Aegon's birth, so if his birth month is later in the year there would be presumably no excuse to kidnap Lyanna. He could not have the foresight to know that his wife would nearly die in childbirth and grab Lyanna early in January prior to Aegon's birth. 

Clearly I don't believe Rhaegar abducted Lyanna, but I do believe the timeline was set up to make it appear as if he could have.

Edited by Feather Crystal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I actually think GRRM does have a tight timeline figured out, but he doesn't want us to scrutinize it, because he wants the readers to believe Rhaegar abducted Lyanna. If you pay too much attention to Aegon's birth you might think this idea is less likely, because Rhaegar was probably on Dragonstone when Lyanna was abducted.

If the events and when they happened are important, GRRM certainly has tight timelines.  But if not, they could change like Rob's wife's hips and Brian's horse's gender.  And unlike them, this sort of mistake is far less likely to be caught since we have so much uncertainty. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/25/2019 at 1:53 PM, JNR said:

Hmm, I have no idea who (if anyone) will die in the TWOW prologue (if there is one).

However, I'd be surprised if Sam ever dies in the series, and I think the dream above is a pretty standard wish fulfillment sort of thing. 

The last thought he has before he falls asleep is that his father wouldn't even credit him with killing a  Popsicle, if he were told so.  This is probably true, and the fatherless dream seems a reaction to Sam's annoyance at that situation. 

Basically: "Dad's a total asswipe, so I'm going to dream of being Lord of Horn Hill instead of him.  In this dream, I have totally taken Dad's place, I control everything, and he is completely gone.  So I get to do whatever I want, like hold a feast for all the people I like best."

The people in it, dressed in bright colors, are quite happy, Sam owns and uses Heartsbane instead of his father, there's excellent food (Sam's oldest joy), and he sleeps in his favorite bedroom again... but with Gilly now instead of his sisters.  

GRRM's own relationship  with his father seems not to have been a completely happy one.  I suspect that if he'd told his father all the success he was going  to have, his father would never have believed that, either.

Also, the reason Sam wakes up in dread isn't the dream.  It's that a wight (Small Paul) has just turned up and he's aware of that on an unconscious level.

I think Varamyr is the prologue character who changed the trend & did not really die...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Brad Stark said:

If the events and when they happened are important, GRRM certainly has tight timelines.  But if not, they could change like Rob's wife's hips and Brian's horse's gender.  And unlike them, this sort of mistake is far less likely to be caught since we have so much uncertainty.

I agree it would be more difficult to catch any mistakes. And most of those could be blamed on the dreaded "unreliable narrator", which is what GRRM used to explain that odd business with Barristan's remembrances of the Tourney at Storm's End involving Simon Toyne. If those things can't be trusted, did Ashara really have dark hair? That is how untrustworthy it all makes me feel on any detail in the story! Even if it exists in the text, but it turns out to be a mistake, "poof" and "unreliable narrator" and it's like it never happened.

I think any timeline discrepancies could be "poof"ed away just as easily, which would make all of the work people have done trying to piece it together amount to nothing.  I really hope that will not turn out to be the case, however!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, St Daga said:

As much as it might benefit Yandal and Robert down the road to make Rhaegar look bad, they are only 15 years removed from these events when the book is published and gifted to Tommen. People should still remember the truth, so fudging the details very much for this book, would not really fool anyone. We are in the dark only because GRRM wants us to be. Of course, this book might only be for Tommen, and so the details in it and how false they might be, would never be told to the rest of Westeros. 

 

Tommen was the eventual recipient, but the book was originally written for Robert  - who probably only ever looked at the dirty pictures and ignored the text on the grounds that reading is for cissies

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Feather Crystal said:

Pushing Aegon's birth later into 282 makes no sense, because Rhaegar was already gone at the beginning of the year when Aerys was lighting fires to warm the castle.

You seem to believe Yandel's account, basically that Rhaegar looked out his window and, beholding the freezing temps, ice, and snow he said to himself: Now would be the ideal time to hop on a horse and take a long road trip.  And then he did it.

Well, I have serious doubts. And Yandel's attempt to suggest such a thing really seems quite clumsy to me.

10 hours ago, Feather Crystal said:

Pushing Aegon's birth later into 282 also ignores the phrasing that Elia took six months to recover.

Not really. Recovering from the physical struggle of baby one doesn't mean she then immediately conceived baby two.  It just literally means she recovered physically.

8 hours ago, St Daga said:

People should still remember the truth, so fudging the details very much for this book, would not really fool anyone.

I'm just going to say again that GRRM explicitly told us, in an interview, that Yandel did do exactly that.  He rearranged events and he did it to please Robert.

Frankly, I knew before the World book came out that Aegon's birth was a serious problem for RLJ. 

I knew it  because GRRM's remark meant Aegon was born about the time the war began, and Dany's HOTU vision showed Rhaegar attending Elia  and "newborn" Aegon and discussing his name.

Put those two together and you have a very hard time explaining how Rhaegar was, at the same time, kidnapping and raping Lyanna, or anywhere near the TOJ (about a thousand miles south).

5 hours ago, Black Crow said:

the book was originally written for Robert  - who probably only ever looked at the dirty pictures and ignored the text on the grounds that reading is for cissies

And even if he'd read it, I'm deeply skeptical that he would have deduced anything or had any kind of issue with the contents, which blatantly favor him and his perspective, over and over in many passages.

Robert, I fear, was not much of a detective, and would surely have missed things like "Rhaegar would not likely go on a long road trip during a de facto blizzard" or "I don't remember Elia being obviously pregnant at Harrenhal."

We're talking about the guy whose wife bore him three utterly Lannister-looking kids, while he had numerous bastards who looked remarkably like himself... and despite all that info, he never suspected Cersei at all.

Edited by JNR

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

We have no indication it was a blizzard at King's Landing during the tournament.  It was winter, but it rarely snows that far South.  And it was the year of the False Spring, which likely happened later but the worst of Winter likely past. 

We also don't know the cultural reaction to cold.  It could be like Florida, where a single snowflake induces panic.  Or Ohio where I regularly see people in shorts in 20F.

Westerous certainly is less comfortable overall, with fire for heat but no thermostat holding every part of every room at 72F.  So I'd guess they are more cold tolerant than Florida. 

I might consider weather swaying Elia into staying home in some situations, but Rhaegar, the Crown Prince, skipping risking his life in a violent competition, just because it's cold outside, I find implausible. 

Edited by Brad Stark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, JNR said:

You seem to believe Yandel's account, basically that Rhaegar looked out his window and, beholding the freezing temps, ice, and snow he said to himself: Now would be the ideal time to hop on a horse and take a long road trip.  And then he did it.

 Well, I have serious doubts. And Yandel's attempt to suggest such a thing really seems quite clumsy to me.

No. I believe Rhaegar and Elia left shortly after the tourney while the weather was still spring-like. He was already on Dragonstone by the time winter returned.

Yandel recorded what most had accepted - that Rhaegar’s long absence coincidied with Lyanna’s abduction therefore he must have done it.

Edited by Feather Crystal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Feather Crystal said:

No. I believe Rhaegar and Elia left shortly after the tourney while the weather was still spring-like. He was already on Dragonstone by the time winter returned.

Yandel recorded what most had accepted - that Rhaegar’s long absence coincidied with Lyanna’s abduction therefore he must have done it.

Rhaegar disappearing at the same time hardly proves he kidnapped Lyanna.  But I am curious why you believe he went to Dragonstone.  I'd expect him in King's Landing if he wasn't running off with Lyanna or another woman.  Do you believe he was in Dorne at all? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Brad Stark said:

Rhaegar disappearing at the same time hardly proves he kidnapped Lyanna.  But I am curious why you believe he went to Dragonstone.  I'd expect him in King's Landing if he wasn't running off with Lyanna or another woman.  Do you believe he was in Dorne at all? 

They went to Dragonstone in preparation for Aegon’s birth, which I believe occurred about two months after the tourney.

After Elia was well enough they sailed to Dorne, and returned to Kings Landing via the kingsroad through the Kingswood.

Edited by Feather Crystal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, Feather Crystal said:

I believe Rhaegar and Elia left shortly after the tourney while the weather was still spring-like. He was already on Dragonstone by the time winter returned.

I believe that too, but it has nothing to do with what we're discussing, which is when Aegon was born.

Yandel says Aegon was born shortly after Harrenhal, meaning Elia was clearly pregnant at Harrenhal and yet somehow, no one ever noticed it or remembers it in canon. 

Yandel also says that Rhaegar went on a long road trip just as "winter returned with a vengeance" -- so fierce a vengeance, the Blackwater soon froze solid.

GRRM says quite different things -- that Aegon was about a year old at the Sack, and therefore he was born about when the war began.

Now, we know, factually, that quite a long time separated Harrenhal and the war.

How do we know?  Because the canon tells us Jaime was 15 at Harrenhal and 17 in the Sack.  Because it also says Ned was 18 at Harrenhal and 20 at war's end.  Canonically, there were many months between Harrenhal and the war, perhaps as much time as a year.

So  these are our choices. We can believe Yandel, whose story makes no sense, or we can believe GRRM, who in addition to contradicting Yandel, also dismissed Yandel as an authority and told us this outright):

Quote

The book is written from the viewpoint of a maester at the Citadel, one who hopes to pass its knowledge on to someone sitting on the Iron Throne. As such, the author may have … rearranged events to suit the interests of a particular royal family. “So who knows if it’s really true or not!” Martin chuckled.

"The author," of course, means Yandel, whose primary goal was to suck up  to Robert and his heirs, not report a truth that would surely enrage Robert.

Edited by JNR

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, Feather Crystal said:

Clearly I don't believe Rhaegar abducted Lyanna, but I do believe the timeline was set up to make it appear as if he could have.

Correct, even if Rhaegar didn't abduct Lyanna, circumstances in-world are such that the idea that he could have been involved in her disappearance is widely seen as a credible premise, even to his own allies. He is not, conversely, remembered by Barristan or Jaime as having an airtight alibi, nor is he remembered as being a man who was loudly and frequently protesting his innocence during the war.

Regardless of the truth, the timing at least had to line up enough that the accusation was believable, and Rhaegar himself might have actually viewed the accusation as serendipitous--for example, if he was involved in an attempt at dragon hatching, or the supposed Aegon VI swap, then it would be safer to have people believe he's a philanderer than to have the realm (including Aerys) digging into his absence.

Finally, it's worth revisiting GRRM's comment on Aegon's age:
https://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/Kings_Landing_10_Questions

Quote

At the time of the Sack, Aegon Targaryen was, "Still a babe at the breast. A year old, give or take a turn or two."

"Give or take a turn or two;" in short, Aegon was roughly somewhere between ten and fourteen months old--GRRM's giving himself a fairly generous window to work in.

Something that I am, in turn, inclined to view in relation to the sentiment in this SSM:
https://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/Chronology_and_Distances

Quote

The reason I am never specific about dates and distances is precisely so that people won't sit down and do this sort of thing.

My suggestion would be to put away the ruler and the stopwatch, and just enjoy the story.


 

Edited by Matthew.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, JNR said:

I believe that too, but it has nothing to do with what we're discussing, which is when Aegon was born.

Yandel says Aegon was born shortly after Harrenhal, meaning Elia was clearly pregnant at Harrenhal and yet somehow, no one ever noticed it or remembers it in canon. 

Yandel also says that Rhaegar went on a long road trip just as "winter returned with a vengeance" -- so fierce a vengeance, the Blackwater soon froze solid.

GRRM says quite different things -- that Aegon was about a year old at the Sack, and therefore he was born about when the war began.

Now, we know, factually, that quite a long time separated Harrenhal and the war.

How do we know?  Because the canon tells us Jaime was 15 at Harrenhal and 17 in the Sack.  Because it also says Ned was 18 at Harrenhal and 20 at war's end.  Canonically, there were many months between Harrenhal and the war, perhaps as much time as a year.

So  these are our choices. We can believe Yandel, whose story makes no sense, or we can believe GRRM, who in addition to contradicting Yandel, also dismissed Yandel as an authority and told us this outright):

"The author," of course, means Yandel, whose primary goal was to suck up  to Robert and his heirs, not report a truth that would surely enrage Robert.

If Jaime's and Ned's birthdays occurred after the tourney, but before the end of the year - problem solved. For example:

Jaime was knighted on the field at the age of 15 about two months prior to the Harrenhal tourney in Nov 281. Jaime could then turn 16 in Dec 281, and then 17 in Dec 282, making him 17 at the time of the. Sack in 283.

Ned too could be 18 in Nov 281 at the tourney, turn 19 in Dec 281, and then 20 on Dec 282, allowing for him to be 20 during the Sack in 283.

I have a December birthday myself and people always mistake my age if they know what year I was born. For the sake of argument I will tell you what it is: 1962. The current year, of course is 2019. If you simply subtract 1962 from 2019 you'd mistakenly say that I'm 57 years old, but I won't be 57 until my birthday in December. :D

Here are a few other comments by various characters:

Davos III in Clash (year 299) notes that it has been 16 years since the Assault on Dragonstone. The wiki lists the assault as occurring in 284, but I'm convinced it's 283.

In Storm of Swords (late 299, but before Dec) Tyrion recalls Jaime was knighted 18 years ago, which is correct. 299 - 18 = 281 the year of the False Spring.

In A Dance with Dragons (year 300) Jon Connington thinks back on the Battle of the Bells (in 282) as occurring 17 years ago. He too is correct, because the 18th anniversary of the battle doesn't occur until late 300. The events in Dance and Feast occur simultaneously, so JonCon is thinking this around the same time as Joffrey's marriage to Margaery at the beginning of year 300 as mentioned in Feast.

 

Edited by Feather Crystal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Adding to some of the timeline events above, I believe Joffrey's name day was in November of 285. I believe it's around the third week of the month, because I think it coincides with the anniversary of the Harrenhal tourney. His birthday is frequently celebrated with a name day tourney. And since I believe in the wheel of time repeating - his name day tourney occurs around the anniversary of the Harrenhal tourney.

Two weeks after his 12th name day tourney in 297 and heading into early December, Jon Arryn dies. The following January 298 is when the main events in A Game of Thrones begins.

Robb turns 15 a few months into the story, and Jon believes he also turns 15 around the same time, but since I believe Ashara is his mother, I think Ned lied about when Jon's birthday was in order to help soothe Catelyn's fears about Robb not being the eldest. I think Jon actually turned 16 in 298, and is about 7 months older than Robb. 

When Catelyn first arrived to Winterfell and saw Jon with his wet-nurse, she saw a baby old enough to have been conceived during the Harrenhal tourney. She must have known about Ned's feelings for Ashara, and then when she heard the servants gossiping she came right out and asked Ned. Ned got angry, because Ashara was supposed to have died at the end of the war and he was hiding the fact that she went into exile under an assumed identity in order to conceal her dishonor.

Once the rebel forces needed the Tully's to help get Robert out of Stoney Sept, Ned was forced to marry Catelyn. So by the time Jon was born, Ned wasn't free to marry Ashara, so rather than be an unmarried mother with low prospects for marriage, they came up with the suicide story. She truly did grieve for her child, because she had to leave Jon behind - that much was true - but Ned added to the story. By the time the war was over, he had killed Arthur Dayne, and that extra detail only helped add credence to Ashara's suicide story. Maybe Ned didn't even kill Arthur. What if Howland did, but gave Ned the credit in order to help support the story about Ashara?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe very important events happened from the tournament until the sack.  If there was extra time, something else happened that was important. If Rhaegar didn't ride off with Lyanna right after the tournament, what did he do?  I don't believe the tournament was originally intended as a Great Council but then he and everyone else just went home and sat around for 6 months.

We shouldn't take GRRM's comments about master Yandle to mean everything written by Yandle is wrong. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't believe the Starks or Tullys were aware of any conspiracy. The Tullys didn't even join the rebel forces until Ned and Jon married Catelyn and Lysa. I do believe Tywin Lannister conspired with Jon Arryn though, and they led Rhaegar to believe that they were gathering support for him to force his father to step down - all the while undermining support by sending Gregor Clegane and his men out to raid dressed in armor that looked like Rhaegar's and carrying his flags. This is how people came to believe Rhaegar kidnapped Lyanna. It was actually Gregor dressed to look like Rhaegar. He injured Howland and captured Lyanna, but Benjen got away and was able to find Brandon and Ned. This is how Brandon heard about Lyanna. 

It was foolish for Rhaegar to give Lyanna the laurel, but while we cannot know for sure what he was thinking, I doubt very much that he was attracted to her or had any romantic feelings. I also doubt that he was interested in her for prophetic reasons. Either he suspected she was involved with the Knight of the Laughing Tree mystery or he was instructed by either Tywin or Jon Arryn to make the gesture as a signal. But wait, you might say, how did Rhaegar know he would win? Recall when Robert wanted to enter the Hand's tourney, but couldn't fit into his armor? Ned told him that no one would dare harm him and that any victories would not be true if people let him win. The same was true for Rhaegar. Who would dare defeat the prince?

Rhaegar and Elia left for Dragonstone after the tourney in preparation for Aegon's birth. The tradition is to go to Dragonstone to be born amid the salt and smoke and to bond with a dragon egg. After a period of recovery they travelled to Dorne to visit Elia's family. While there they collected the 10,000 Dornishmen to protect Elia should the coup go awry. That is what was meant by "in defense of Elia", because Elia wasn't taken as a hostage until after Rhaegar left for the Trident. She couldn't have, because she was still with Rhaegar until he returned from the south.

Armies march slower than people can ride either on horseback or drawn carriages, so Rhaegar and his family returned ahead of the 10,000 Dornishmen that were marching behind. Rhaegar learned of the army camped at the Trident upon his arrival to Kings Landing. Initially he may have thought they were assembled there for him and any conflicts were misunderstandings. He convinces his father to send Tywin a raven - which was actually a signal that he had returned and it was time for the coup. He told Jaime that things would be better upon his return from the Trident. He planned to call the great council to enact changes and force his father from the throne. If Rhaegar truly feared the rebel army at the Trident, why didn't he wait for his 10,000 Dornishmen? He died with Lyanna's name on his lips, because he was confused. It wasn't so much as a love declaration as it was a question. "Lyanna?"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, JNR said:

The book is written from the viewpoint of a maester at the Citadel, one who hopes to pass its knowledge on to someone sitting on the Iron Throne. As such, the author may have … rearranged events to suit the interests of a particular royal family. “So who knows if it’s really true or not!” Martin chuckled.

It may of course be stating the blindingly obvious, but the particular royal family in question was of course the Baratheons and specifically if events were re-arranged to suit their interests they were re-arranged to suit Trouserless Bob. As there's not a lot of point in re-arranging say the events surrounding the conquest, its reasonable to suppose that the events concerned were those attending the Baratheon seizure of the throne.

A useful and conscious parallel to this is Bill Shakespeare's hatchet job on Richard III and the events surrounding Bosworth Field to exalt the rise of the Tudor family. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There was no need for Maester Yandel to rearrange events. There's nothing wrong with the timeline nor the references to the weather. The only lie is that Rhaegar did the kidnapping, but maybe Yandel didn't know it was a lie? Maybe he believed like everyone else did - that he did it.

GRRM likes to reveal some of his mysteries in waves of three. The first is a hint, the second has a little more detail, and the third spells it out. He has revealed how and why people believed Rhaegar did it with these three examples:

1) The Hint: When Ned was Hand there were reports of raiding by unknown men. Nobody knew who they were, because they weren't carrying any banners. Some thought it might be Gregor Clegane, because of his large size. Ned enlists Beric Dondarrion to bring him to justice. This is why Beric later names his men the Brotherhood Without Banners.

2) The Little Bit More: Garlan Tyrell wore Renly's armor during the Battle of the Blackwater so people would be confused or think it was Renly's ghost coming for vengeance against Stannis's kinslaying.

3) Spelling it Out: Arys Oakheart had one of his men wear his armor and stand guard over Myrcella's handmaiden, Rosamund, to make everyone believe they were still in the castle so that they could leave undetected.

Just to prove GRRM uses waves of three to reveal some mysteries, I'll provide another subject. He explains how people are resurrected by providing three examples:

1) The Hint: Coldhands - he died "long ago".

2) The Little Bit More: Beric Dondarrion - reports of being killed several times.

3) Spells it out: Catelyn into Lady Stoneheart - Thoros explains how he gave Beric the kiss of fire as part of Beric's first funeral, and then how Beric passed it on to Catelyn.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Feather Crystal said:

If Jaime's and Ned's birthdays occurred after the tourney, but before the end of the year - problem solved.

Well, before I respond to that, when do you think Jon was born? 

Just curious where you stand on that these days; it turns out to involve just what we're discussing.

4 hours ago, Black Crow said:

if events were re-arranged to suit their interests they were re-arranged to suit Trouserless Bob

I'll say.

"The family" wasn't any more likely to read and analyze the content than Robert -- Cersei and her children demonstrating no more fondness for books than Robert, and in fact Joffrey hacked the hell out of a book using Widow's Wail on one memorable occasion.

It's also just plain reading the text what a blatant pro-Robert, anti-Rhaegar slant it's been given by the good Yandel.  This would make much better sense for Robert than any other Baratheon.  Example passages:

Quote

Rhaegar Targaryen had begun the dance that would rip the Seven Kingdoms apart, bring about his own death and thousands more, and put a welcome new king upon the Iron Throne.

Quote

In such fashion did the future king win the fierce devotion of his friends and allies—for few men were ever so open-handed and merciful as Robert Baratheon.

I really have to laugh at this sort of shameless ass-kissing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×