polishgenius Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Very hyped for this. Man is a fantastic writer. However, I hope the hyping for this doesn't turn into a 'African fantasy has never been done before!' thing. I hope he doesn't fall into that trap and I hope his publishers don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 HA, well he did make a big deal about it being a fantasy in an interview. I bet it's still not shelved with the SFF though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Quote There's been others, not just Asian. Nnedi Okorafor perhaps most notably, also does African fantasy (that is utterly superb). NK Jemisin- Dreamblood is Egyptian-based, her other two series nowhere specific. Karen Lord - A Redemption in Indigo is based on African folk tales, while The Best of All Possible Worlds is an SF, but inspired by the Caribbean apparently. I'm sure there's more that others can recommend, but those are the ones that spring to mind for me. I like to recommend Garry Kilworth's Navigator Kings trilogy, which takes place in a fantasised version of Polynesia, and Ricardo Pinto's Stone Dance of the Chameleon trilogy, which is more derived from South America. Terry Pratchett, of course, did fantasised versions of Egypt in Pyramids, China in Interesting Times, Australia in The Last Continent and, er, New Orleans in Witches Abroad, all in the Discworld series. On 19/12/2015 at 10:50 AM, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said: Edit - Further investigation indicates that I'm being harsh on Atwood. Apparently she was under pressure from the publisher not mention the term Science fiction in relation to her work. They (and via the pressure imposed, her) feared being frozen out of mainstream recognition and literary acceptance. So she's tried to redefine herself out the genre. Yup. Atwood dropped the whole SF aversion thing later on, mostly after grooving with Ursula K. Le Guin, and is much happier to have her work called SF now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 33 minutes ago, Werthead said: I like to recommend Garry Kilworth's Navigator Kings trilogy, which takes place in a fantasised version of Polynesia, and Ricardo Pinto's Stone Dance of the Chameleon trilogy, which is more derived from South America. If Navigator Kings is the one I'm thinking of, I read it years and years back and recall enjoying it quite a lot up until the ending where they sailed up to where New Zealand should have been and it was, for some reason, Scotland instead. That pissed me off. Although the real reason that I never read more was the library didn't have more, and now that you've reminded me what it's called, I may well give it another shot. I have the first book in Pinto's series somewhere, also bought at least ten years ago I think. I recall being intrigued but not being able to get into the prose. I now want to try again, but my copy is somewhere in my dad's attic in England so I can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 Yup, they swapped out New Zealand for Britain, which was unexpected but then gave us a crazy Picts vs. Polynesians story which was totally insane but kind of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 I remain skeptical as I've been since I first listened to Marlon talk about this, some years back already, by now. The project comes across as hodge podging history, cultures and geography, which always feels, at best, disrespectful, since for the vast variety of people living in the vast variety of Africa, their history, religions and cultures are not museum works, but living practices and traditions. All right, I pull up my rain hood and leave this parade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 1 hour ago, Zorral said: I remain skeptical as I've been since I first listened to Marlon talk about this, some years back already, by now. The project comes across as hodge podging history, cultures and geography, which always feels, at best, disrespectful, since for the vast variety of people living in the vast variety of Africa, their history, religions and cultures are not museum works, but living practices and traditions. All right, I pull up my rain hood and leave this parade. Isn't this true of, basically, every fantasy ever? It's just that they're usually hodge podging European history and cultures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 3 hours ago, Zorral said: I remain skeptical as I've been since I first listened to Marlon talk about this, some years back already, by now. The project comes across as hodge podging history, cultures and geography, which always feels, at best, disrespectful, since for the vast variety of people living in the vast variety of Africa, their history, religions and cultures are not museum works, but living practices and traditions. All right, I pull up my rain hood and leave this parade. Ohhh you would just LOVE Jay Kristoff then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 45 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said: Ohhh you would just LOVE Jay Kristoff then. Never heard of this guy. Why would I LOVE him? I know Marlon personally, and I love him as a writer and a person. My reaction to what he thinks he's doing -- we've discussed it a whole lot from a whole lot of angles -- is based in what he doesn't know, and what he thinks he knows, but doesn't, yet believes he's gonna do right for the Very First Time. For starters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 3 hours ago, polishgenius said: Isn't this true of, basically, every fantasy ever? It's just that they're usually hodge podging European history and cultures. Which is why I left off this stuff a long time ago, because mostly it just doesn't work then, for all kinds of reasons, at least for anyone who knows and cares about history and etc. Ooop -- Imma sposed to be GONE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 22 hours ago, polishgenius said: I have the first book in Pinto's series somewhere, also bought at least ten years ago I think. I recall being intrigued but not being able to get into the prose. I now want to try again, but my copy is somewhere in my dad's attic in England so I can't. I read the first book over a decade ago. I thought Pinto had some very distinctive and detailed world-building, but I really didn't like the characterisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 39 minutes ago, Zorral said: Which is why I left off this stuff a long time ago, because mostly it just doesn't work then, for all kinds of reasons, at least for anyone who knows and cares about history and etc. Ooop -- Imma sposed to be GONE! But it's fantasy, not history, so I'm not sure why it should matter? If I wanted history/historical accuracy I would go for non-fiction or some historical fiction. Fantasy can draw inspiration from different societies and historical periods. I mean it seems a bit like reading space opera and then complaining it's not scietifically accurate/possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 4 hours ago, Zorral said: Never heard of this guy. Why would I LOVE him? I know Marlon personally, and I love him as a writer and a person. My reaction to what he thinks he's doing -- we've discussed it a whole lot from a whole lot of angles -- is based in what he doesn't know, and what he thinks he knows, but doesn't, yet believes he's gonna do right for the Very First Time. For starters. He uh takes cultural appropriation and turns it up to 11 Edit: As an added bonus, he's a total jackass about it in interviews, cause he watched an anime and read a wiki article so he knows SO MUCH about japan. (I shit you not, that was the extent of his research). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 3 hours ago, Zorral said: I know Marlon personally, and I love him as a writer and a person. [...] yet believes he's gonna do right for the Very First Time. For starters. Tell him polishgenius asked if he knows the work of Nnedi Okorafor and Karen Lord, and if not why not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AncalagonTheBlack Posted July 30, 2017 Author Share Posted July 30, 2017 Some interesting tidbits from an interview about influences and what he's reading while writing this series: Quote I love "Game of Thrones." There are things about "Game of Thrones" that I've always loved. In "Game of Thrones," all bets are off with the characters. It doesn't matter how wonderful you are, you could die on the next page. The "African 'Game of Thrones'" thing started almost a joke. Someone was asking me about the book years ago, and I answered them thinking that this is a pretty specific market this magazine reaches. Turns out, it seems everyone who reads it works in media. If anything, it's more like an African "Rashomon" than anything else. Quote What's on your reading list as you're researching and preparing to write the trilogy? Lots of ancient myths and sagas and epics from all cultures: African myths, African epics, a lot of the old European epics — "Kalevala" and "Beowulf" — and lots of narratives that were written in verse, like "The Iliad." But also tons of research. I could have written a historical novel with all the history I have researched. A lot of original source material — lots of really, really academic, thick books with dust on them. But also, I've been going back to a lot of the people, including writers in speculative fiction and so on, that I've also gone back to: the "Gormenghast" trilogy, or reading back on magical realism like Gabriel Garcia Marquez and Jose Donoso. It's been pretty, pretty wide. Lots of graphic novels. In fact, a huge influence on me is the comic version of "Thor." I'm always inspired by comics — they're never far away. Lots and lots of Urusula K. Leguin, Patrick Rothfuss. I'm swapping notes with Benjamin Percy, because I'm wading into his territory. Amitav Ghosh — a lot of people who actually don't deal with the fantastical, but also stuff like "Arabian Nights." oh shit,he's a Rothfuss fan? does that mean we will get his version of Felurian and pages of amazing tantric-like sex!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 Figured this should get its own thread since it was kinda taking over the Books Coming Out thread. I'll keep it spoiler-free/spoilers marked for now, if enough of a discussion gets going to warrant it I guess I'll make it a spoiler thread as people pitch in. Anyway, just started reading it, about 100 pages in- obviously, the African GOT label is utterly fatuous, it bears no resemblance to asoiaf in any way even accounting for the difference in setting and that. It isn't, so far as I've got, an epic clash of kingdoms, for starters- it might spread out later but so far it's confined to a narrow plot strand and setting. So far as it resembles anything, it'd be Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun- it's not similar in prose, style or plot, and New Sun is much denser and seems to hide more behind the words, but it has a similar fashion of an unreliable narrator telling a story in a very tumbledown, somewhat meandering way. Anyway, I am enjoying it rather a lot. James is a hell of a writer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarkBlack21 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Michael B. Jordan/Warner Bros just bought the FILM RIGHTS to the book to turn it into a franchise. https://deadline.com/2019/02/michael-b-jordan-picks-up-marlon-james-black-leopard-red-wolf-novel-outlier-society-warner-bros-1202551445/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Planning on this for after my current read. Looking forward to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AncalagonTheBlack Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 13 hours ago, polishgenius said: Figured this should get its own thread since it was kinda taking over the Books Coming Out thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 What sort of unreliable narrator is this? Would it perhaps compare more to Wolfe's Soldier in the Mist? If so, I'm more interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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