The Fattest Leech Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 4 hours ago, Morte said: I think he is referring to the fact that the helmet is now in Lem's possession. During the raid on the Saltpans it was most likely Rorge who wore the helmet, as he is wearing it during the encounter with Brienne. It's just after he is killed by her, then Lem takes the Hound's helmet. But of course this is no secret identity. Exactly. But for a second I wasn't sure what that poster was trying to get at because there is just so much book canon .vs. head canon going on that I wasn't quite sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Suburbs Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 16 hours ago, The Fresh PtwP said: Hey all, so glad to be back, don't want to delve to much into personal stuff but things to a rocky turn, these books helped me a ton so i'm happy to be back in the fandom! I also love how things haven't seemed to change much around here...kinda like coming home and everything is pretty much right where you left it. Back on topic, @John Suburbs are you referring to Jon's last ADwD chapter here? The one with the strange pacing and unusual internal thoughts before he was stabbed? As for wacky theories I don't have too much input just a couple points: A.) The Daynes- should be House Red Herring, They are like a really tough pinata we've been whacking for some time, there is definitely going to be a payout at the end but how much and to what extent I have no idea, so I pretty much give a blanket pass for ALL crazy Dayne theories because something is going down with them. (Applies to a much lesser extent to the Hightowers) B.) Secret Identities/Parentage's - I like these, to me they are some of the most fun in ASoIaF. I think people somewhat misunderstand the point of most of these though. I'm not going to find the quote but I think Brown Ben Plumm points out that everyone after Aegon IV could conceivably have a drop of dragons-blood. Nobody is going to claim the throne off of that, but I think it adds cool element of world crafting, that Mance might be so badass because he's potentially Bloodraven's son. Or (inserting personal crackpot) Dareon and Marillion could be Tom O' Sevens sons. No, I'm talking about Jon's true identity. His he a Targaryen, a Stark, a Dayne, someone else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Suburbs Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Platypus Rex said: Rosamund impersonating Myrcella not theory. Specifically, Rosamund has already impersonated Myrcella, in the context of the Queenmaker plot. Arys Oakheart said that, in the dim light of her supposed sickroom, the disguise could almost have fooled even him. And, more generally, Rosamund is a decoy. Impersonating Myrcella is her job description. This was never a secret from the reader. But that was never a criterion of the list. Yes, but the only reason this is not a secret to the reader is because we have the POVs to tell us the truth. In the absence of that, we would have no clue that Myrcella was really Rosamund and vice-versa. In that vein, all of these other potential secret identities are only secret to the reader because we have not had a POV to confirm it or deny it. We won't know if Septa Lemore is really Ashara Dayne until we get her POV or someone else's who knows the truth. Same for Jaquen as Syrio, Rhaegar as Mance, Shiera as Mel . . . Consider them all to be Schroedinger's Identities. What we shouldn't do, however, is simply say that Martin would never put all of these secret identities in the story, when in fact he's already created dozens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LyrnaSnowBunnyAvenger Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 In furtherance of these secret identities, the theory that since Cersei and Jaime were identical twins any of their offspring would also have an identical twin (all identical twins have twins when they give birth). Therefore, Joff had an identical twin. Cersei knew ahead of time at the purple wedding that a murder attempt would be made on him, so switched the real Joff with his younger hidden twin brother. The younger brother is who really died and Joff is off page somewhere and will come back to claim the IT. The science was strong in that one. No mention was made of Myrcella's or Tomman's identical twins. Or if said twins were also secret Targs since apparently there is one of those hidden behind every tree and bush in Westeros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M_Tootles Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 On 3/6/2019 at 4:26 PM, Clegane'sPup said: Look long and hard enough somebody might think the young curly haired corpse Arya, the blind girl found at the HoBaW might be the missing 13 year old Tyrek. Lots of people do. I don't. I wrote about why not. https://asongoficeandtootles.wordpress.com/2017/03/28/littlefingers-third-knight-part-one-aryas-dead-pool-dude/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three-Fingered Pete Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 31 minutes ago, LyrnaSnowBunnyAvenger said: ...the theory that since Cersei and Jaime were identical twins any of their offspring would also have an identical twin (all identical twins have twins when they give birth). ... The science was strong in that one. The science was completely bogus in that one. Cersei and Jamie are not identical twins, they are fraternal twins. You cannot have identical twins of different sexes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mother of The Others Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 2 hours ago, LyrnaSnowBunnyAvenger said: No mention was made of Myrcella's or Tomman's identical twins. Kept like spare light bulbs in some cushy brothel basement pantry, these royal replacement twins stand ready to take an assassination for the team. Remember, too, when mom would purchase two of a glass ornament, because the uppety cat was bound to break one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LyrnaSnowBunnyAvenger Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 2 hours ago, Three-Fingered Pete said: The science was completely bogus in that one. Cersei and Jamie are not identical twins, they are fraternal twins. You cannot have identical twins of different sexes. I was being sarcastic. Of course they are not identical twins. The entire theory made no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three-Fingered Pete Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 40 minutes ago, LyrnaSnowBunnyAvenger said: I was being sarcastic. Of course they are not identical twins. The entire theory made no sense. Ruh roh Raggy! It looks like my snark-o-meter is out of whack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mother of The Others Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 6. Patchface is Azor Ahai. He was standing near Stannis every time Mel checked to confirm Stan was Azor Ahai- - - she was repeatedly fooled by the Azor energy wafting off of Patch! This is why the Others are making their move now: they sense this latest Azor in a long line of Azors is daft, an imbecile, doink the doofus. This inbred waterlogged Azor scion will be unable to stand against Them, surely. His supposed fire has been preemptively put out, real hard. The ocean bottom where Patch was raised by the drowned god used to be a starry wisdom temple before the CotF caused a cataclysm that sank the temple under the waves to be buried forever beyond mortal reach....or so they hoped. For it was here along the midpoint of the continental divide that the original Azor forged his Lightbringer blade, at the last place where submerged Black and White Weir Roots yet intertwined in doomed communion, sundered that day by the Hammer of the Deep so that no more Heroes could be empowered and no more diplomacy betwixt the trees. Despite sinking centuries ago, the Waters of Forging that once chilled the molten Lightbringer never dispersed but remained a cohesive cloud of denser-than-ocean-water magicked liquid. These are the same waters to which the merfolk carried Patchface's drowned corpse and rolled him in and compressed his chest cavity while perving on him in other ways he halfway remembers, so that these selfsame Waters of Forging found their way into Patch's lungs to breathe nissa's soul back into him to reawaken the clown, and they are the watery source of his prophetic brain seeing all things, albeit in a muddled way, arming Patch with the tools needed to at last bring this saga full circle as the next Ahai. No one is looking for a Wet Azor who has switched from fire to a new primal element. No one will see it coming. Like Water for Chocolate, or Water for Elephants, these Waters of Forging will ultimately spawn a spinoff novel hugely popular with women. Everyone knows women love novels with Water in the title. Its inclusion is code for "Buy this book on sight you decumbent urinators!" But for the nonce, we have our champion against the dryness. Patchface will melt the Wall with dragonflame so that it floods the Gift and the merfolk can enter the fight momentarily against the Others, but one battle is all it will take because there's only like 27 Others total. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platypus Rex Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 11 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said: This is my last post on this because I find it extremely odd that in a poll thread (opinion) you like to resort to arguments with the voters. I'm a bit confused. This is not one of my poll threads. But even if it were, your votes and opinions and your arguments (that are actually on topic), would be welcome there as always. I'm sorry that the feeling is not mutual. Quote You seem to be conflating fan theories and in-universe set ups and reveals. Not at all. My list, and (as I understood it) John Suburbs' list, was neither about "fan theories" nor was it about "set ups and reveals". It was about identity-confusion and identity-impersonation scenarios that are known, with reasonable certainty to have actually occurred in ASOIAF, regardless of whether the reader was among those fooled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platypus Rex Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 10 hours ago, John Suburbs said: Yes, but the only reason this is not a secret to the reader is because we have the POVs to tell us the truth. In the absence of that, we would have no clue that Myrcella was really Rosamund and vice-versa. In that vein, all of these other potential secret identities are only secret to the reader because we have not had a POV to confirm it or deny it. We won't know if Septa Lemore is really Ashara Dayne until we get her POV or someone else's who knows the truth. Same for Jaquen as Syrio, Rhaegar as Mance, Shiera as Mel . . . Consider them all to be Schroedinger's Identities. What we shouldn't do, however, is simply say that Martin would never put all of these secret identities in the story, when in fact he's already created dozens. Right. GRRM is preoccupied with identity switches, as your list shows. To acknowledge this, but at the same time argue that GRRM would only fool the characters, but would not also try to fool the reader, is bizarre. Of course he is going to play games with the reader's perceptions and expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Alhazred Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 1.Symbology theories 2.So and so is a secret Blackfyre,Targ,Prince that was promised. 3.The numerous astro symbology theories I see on Youtube. (Y'all would never believe it.) 4. GRRM is holding back Winds on purpose. 5.Tyrion is the prince that was promised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 1 hour ago, M.Alhazred said: 1.Symbology theories 2.So and so is a secret Blackfyre,Targ,Prince that was promised. 3.The numerous astro symbology theories I see on Youtube. (Y'all would never believe it.) 4. GRRM is holding back Winds on purpose. 5.Tyrion is the prince that was promised. Just wanna say that your screen name is pretty nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Potsk Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 Shae is a eunuch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Alhazred Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 3 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said: Just wanna say that your screen name is pretty nice! Thanx. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Suburbs Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 19 hours ago, Platypus Rex said: Right. GRRM is preoccupied with identity switches, as your list shows. To acknowledge this, but at the same time argue that GRRM would only fool the characters, but would not also try to fool the reader, is bizarre. Of course he is going to play games with the reader's perceptions and expectations. Well, yeah, that was my whole point in response to people who argue that so-and-so can't be a secret identity because there can't be this many secret identities in the story. At the same time, though, believing that everybody is a secret ID is just as foolish as believing that no one is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khal Rhaego Targaryen Posted March 16, 2019 Share Posted March 16, 2019 R+L=J is the biggest Crackpot ever created. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Potsk Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Ned and Cat are faceless men Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
three-eyed monkey Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Robert Strong is Gregor's shadow. Some time back a crackpot posted this It might be time for a reboot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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