Lord Varys Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 5 hours ago, Jaak said: Aenys was surprised by IIRC just 2 Poor Fellows infiltrating the under construction Red Keep, and saved by Kingsguard. Faith Militant did not storm Red Keep then. After the insecurity of Red Keep was revealed and Aenys decided to evacuate with Visenya to Dragonstone, they did have time to pack up their supporters - and Dreamfyre. King Aenys and his family didn't reside in the half-finished Red Keep (which likely lacked any proper royal residence at the time) but in a royal manse atop Visenya's Hill - that was the place the Poor Fellows infiltrated. The royal dragons would have been kept somewhere in the vicinity - either on the grounds of the royal manse or at some other place in the area. It makes no sense to keep them close to construction site where you do not actually live. And we do know that that Faith Militant took control of the entire city after Aenys fled, the Red Keep is specifically mentioned (Maegor and Visenya later land on Visenya's Hill, not Aegon's High Hill, when they return). But as I thought I made clear above - it is not clear how Quicksilver got back from Dragonstone to KL where she was claimed by Aegon. If that's unclear it would be even more confusing that Dreamfyre and Quicksilver were moved from Dragonstone to KL by Maegor/Visenya for some weird reason. If any dragons had remained chained in KL we would expect the Faith Militant to slay them. Anything else makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rose of Red Lake Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 On 10/17/2019 at 4:26 PM, Anthony Appleyard said: Or wild animals, Dragons may well have evolved before Man arose. A previous message said that dragons are "unnatural constructs". They would indeed be that, if someone misdirected evolution to make a reptile to develop the form of a dragon, unable here on Earth with no magic around to bypass the laws of physics that stop it from flying. But on Planetos, there is magic, which (like the Force in the Star Wars scenario) would have to be factored into any scientific treatment of natural forces I believe in the unnatural theory for the Valyrian dragons, Barth over Vanyon: Quote In Septon Barth’s Dragons, Wyrms, and Wyverns, he speculated that the bloodmages of Valyria used wyvern stock to create dragons. Though the bloodmages were alleged to have experimented mightily with their unnatural arts, this claim is considered far-fetched by most maesters, among them Maester Vanyon’s Against the Unnatural contains certain proofs of dragons having existed in Westeros even in the earliest of days, before Valyria rose to be a power. (TWoIaF, Beyond the Free Cities: Sothoryos) I think they bred wyverns with firewyrms to make fire dragons for war. Since it appears that Sam has a copy of Barth's Unnatural History and is reading it to Aemon, we may find out more information. Key word is unnatural, and if the Others are also an unnatural creation, then one likely won't be able to defeat the other and both are examples of tinkering with nature, with disastrous results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Appleyard Posted January 22, 2020 Author Share Posted January 22, 2020 Game of Thrones dragons are drawn or CGI'ed as impressively spiky, but would that spikyness be an advantage? Spikes may snag on things. A rough skin would cause much aerodynamic drag in flying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Appleyard Posted February 4, 2020 Author Share Posted February 4, 2020 The dragon name Balerion may (in the real world) have been inspired by Belerion, which is a Greek name used by Diodorus Siculus for Cornwall (in England), or for its western end (Penwith). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornwall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narsil4 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 On 1/22/2020 at 5:32 AM, Anthony Appleyard said: would that spikyness be an advantage? I imagine that some shapes might help with maneuverability in the air. Acting a bit like fixed rudders/fins. 13 hours ago, Anthony Appleyard said: Belerion, which is a Greek name used by Diodorus Siculus for Cornwall (in England) Interesting. https://landsend-landmark.co.uk/nature/lands-end-history/ Quote The many names for Land’s End are centuries old. The earliest name for the site seems to ‘Penwith Steort’ recorded in 997. Penwith is Cornish for ‘extreme end’ and Steort is Old English for ‘tail’ or ‘end.’ One might consider that a tenuous connection to the Dragon's Tail. And perhaps also the Wall? Quote You could see it from miles off, a pale blue line across the northern horizon, stretching away to the east and west and vanishing in the far distance, immense and unbroken. This is the end of the world, it seemed to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 I always wondered if Balerion was some GRRMified rework of Belial/Berial/etc? Lovecraft used this idea/name as well, and Dany's dragons comes from Asshai/Stygai, also derived from Lovecraft, I assumed GRRM was rounding out his dragon mythos with these details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Appleyard Posted March 5, 2020 Author Share Posted March 5, 2020 I have read what information can be had from Fire and Blood about events between the Targaryens fleeing from Valyria to Dragostone with 5 dragons (the youngest / smallest was Balerion), and having to start the Conquest with 3 dragons (Balerion (biggest), Meraxes, Vhagar.) That Aegon I rode Balerion, shows that Aegon's father likely did not ride Balerion, unless Aegon did not claim a dragon until his father died. Likely Targaryen dragon numbers in that time were restricted by Dragonstone's limited resources to feed them. Still, it is tempting to think (although not following canon) of Daenys Targaryen having her prophetic dream while sleeping in an armchair with a small black dragon hatchling sleeping on her shoulder. Many big or enormous things started small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The hairy bear Posted March 5, 2020 Share Posted March 5, 2020 4 hours ago, Anthony Appleyard said: Likely Targaryen dragon numbers in that time were restricted by Dragonstone's limited resources to feed them. I'm not sure. Before the Dance of Dragons, there were about a dozen dragons living in the Dragonstone area and it doesn't seem as if they collect a heavy toll on the island. And at least three of them (Cannibal, Sheepstealer and Grey Ghost) seem to be able to procure their own food without much trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Appleyard Posted March 8, 2020 Author Share Posted March 8, 2020 I found this clip from Game of Thrones on Youtube:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbjMAsl38rM 4 mins 3 secs in The North, of Dany on Drogon teaching Jon Snow to ride Rhaegal. (I got some side-interest from the Dutch subtitles, as I had 2 holidays motorcycling round Holland, and I was (one of the very few among) the visitors to Holland who had taken the trouble to learn Dutch first.) One of them remarked that the dragons did not like the North, but not whether that was due to the cold and snow or to being too near the hostile magical goings-on north of the Wall. (in Fire and Blood, King Jaehaerys I's wife Queen Alysanne's dragon Silverwing refused absolutely to go north of the Wall.) Afterwards, Jan said "That's completely ruined horses for me" (Dutch: "Nu wil ik nooit meer paardrijden."). Does anyone know where that scene was filmed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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