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Vaith

New Sigils

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So, @Paxter Redwyne pointed out to me that a lot of the houses on the wiki have new sigils: for example, Arryn, Martell, Mooton, Osgrey, Mallister, Ryswell, Umber, Mooton, Rowan, Peake, etc.

While he had some doubts about the quality of some of these sigils in comparison tot he old ones (Umber, for example), the main issue seems to be they do not look entirely consistent with other sigils, being a little too "3D" in comparison to some of the others.

Also, character pages have not been updated, so there is an inconsistency where Rowan characters have a different sigil than the one on the Rowan page.

They seem to be made by one user, @Abjiklam.

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I once raised this issue, as well. 

I think we need some consistent agenda the coat of arms on the wiki. There are a lot of cases where the weapons on the house page look different from the ones on character pages. I guess user @Abjiklam put a lot of work into the design of the svg weapons, but in my opinion he followed real life heraldry too much when he used depictions from actual weapons, although GRRM created his own rules. The Citadel presents a lot of weapons which are approved by GRRM, and I think we should follow those ones more accurately. So if these svg weapons have some advantage (I seem to remember something about the images being displayed in a better way), I think the weapons should be revised a bit to adjust them. 

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19 hours ago, Vaith said:

While he had some doubts about the quality of some of these sigils in comparison tot he old ones (Umber, for example), the main issue seems to be they do not look entirely consistent with other sigils, being a little too "3D" in comparison to some of the others.

House Umber is not one of mine. Those that I and @Lord Evermore have made are in svg format. I'm curious to know which of those sigils are judged to be of lower quality.

On the topic of consistency, the sigils on the wiki have never been consistent. They were made by various contributors who used different shapes of shields, some chose to include the words underneath the shield, while other omitted them. My goal is precisely to have high-quality, consistent designs for all sigils, but that takes time. For this reason the svg format is preferable, since they can easily be edited without losing quality, and they do not become pixelated at any size. You'll notice that the overwhelming majority of flags and coats of arms on wikipedia are in this format. Only a handful of sigil currently do not have an svg equivalent (see Talk:List of houses, House Umber is one of them).

19 hours ago, Vaith said:

Also, character pages have not been updated, so there is an inconsistency where Rowan characters have a different sigil than the one on the Rowan page.

I'm currently thinking of implementing a way for all sigils to be updated simultaneously by the use of templates and modules. This will also take time.

19 hours ago, The Wondering Wolf said:

in my opinion he followed real life heraldry too much when he used depictions from actual weapons

Could you tell me which ones?

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Posted (edited)

Roote, Ryswell, Osgrey, Lannister, Arryn, Bracken

I looked at your work and I'd say that you didn't really made much improvements to the old sigils. They don't really look like heraldic figures and more like some modern paintings.

Edited by Paxter Redwyne

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Have to say, I've no issue with any of the cited ones.

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Posted (edited)

It's just my opinion, but I also think that the design of some of the new sigils is less adequate than the previous ones.

As I see it, banners should be designed to be seen from afar (in the battlefield, or above some castle). Therefore, one should not include unnecessary details (such as the cloth patterns of the Tarly archer) or any kind of perspective (such as the new Peake castles).

And the Umber giant is really ugly.

 

Edited by The hairy bear

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