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Eddard Waters

Who's the worst human being, Tywin Lannister or Roose Bolton

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So we have Tywin Lannister, a sadistic and power-hungry egomaniac who is probably the biggest mass murderer in recent Westerosi history, or Roose Bolton, a psychopathic torturer, serial rapist and Kingslayer.

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6 hours ago, Eddard Waters said:

Tywin Lannister, a sadistic and power-hungry egomaniac who is probably the biggest mass murderer in recent Westerosi history

I wouldn't call Tywin sadistic. This is the definition from merriam-webbster:

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Definition of sadism

 

1: the derivation of sexual gratification from the infliction of physical pain or humiliation on another person— compare MASOCHISM, SADOMASOCHISM
2a: delight in cruelty
b: excessive cruelty

I never heard anybody saying he's getting a boner from humilating his fathers mistress or that the destruction of Castamere was one of his happiest days. Sadistic are for example Aerys, Joffrey and Ramsay.

Yes of course he did these terrible things knowing how much pain he brings but he knew that this was the price for more respect, wealth and influence for house Lannister. 

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1 minute ago, Karneol said:

I wouldn't call Tywin sadistic. This is the definition from merriam-webbster:

I never heard anybody saying he's getting a boner from humilating his fathers mistress or that the destruction of Castamere was one of his happiest days. Sadistic are for example Aerys, Joffrey and Ramsay.

Yes of course he did these terrible things knowing how much pain he brings but he knew that this was the price for more respect, wealth and influence for house Lannister. 

He was definitely getting off on sleeping with Shae, the prostitue Tyrion had been sleeping with. That’s him also getting off on humiliating Tyrion, so it’s a double whammy. 

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I mean I don't think either of them are the worst. But I'd say Tywin is worse than Roose (sorry to be nitpicky over grammar)

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3 hours ago, Karneol said:

I wouldn't call Tywin sadistic. This is the definition from merriam-webbster:

I never heard anybody saying he's getting a boner from humilating his fathers mistress or that the destruction of Castamere was one of his happiest days. Sadistic are for example Aerys, Joffrey and Ramsay.

Yes of course he did these terrible things knowing how much pain he brings but he knew that this was the price for more respect, wealth and influence for house Lannister. 

Tysha would like to have a word with you. 

Like seriously there are a million ways he could have handled that without doing what he did.

That was pure puppy kicking evil and only done to reinforce the idea that no one could love Tyrion.

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Every time I lean one way or another I remember something the other has done, however, Tywins mass attocities probably outweigh Roose’s, but I don’t doubt, for a single second, that Roose would happily do anything Tywin has done and more if put in the same situations, he is also a confirmed rapist, torturer and murderer on a personal level, but generally is a dirt level version of Tywin, and certainly more traditionally evil. Tywin eats him for breakfast though

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If you're going to use an absolute superlative adjective such as 'worst', then you're forgetting two who are clearly more degenerate: Joffrey and Ramsay Snow. In that case, I'd vote for Ramsay, because he's smart, which makes him far more dangerous than the relatively stupid Joffrey. Roose and Tywin wouldn't even make it into the top ten in my opinion. Gregor Clegane, Amory Lorch, Meryn Trant, Littlefinger, Maegor the Cruel, Euron Greyjoy, and a good chunk of the population of Slaver's Bay would top them.

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Tywin is genuinely sadistic, vindictive and motivated by pride. 

Roose is seemingly just completely amoral and emotionless. Not getting a kick out of neither rape, murder or torture. A peaceful land, a quiet people. 

Not saying this makes Roose any more sympathetic, but Tywin is far worse in at least three respects

1. Making himself out to be honorable and noble, and his actions seemingly defensible. Hypocrite extraordinaire. 

2. Sheer numbers. 

3. Sadism against his own family. 

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5 hours ago, Plain, Simple Tailor said:

He was definitely getting off on sleeping with Shae, the prostitue Tyrion had been sleeping with. That’s him also getting off on humiliating Tyrion, so it’s a double whammy

2 hours ago, Eddard Waters said:

Tysha would like to have a word with you. 

Like seriously there are a million ways he could have handled that without doing what he did.

That was pure puppy kicking evil and only done to reinforce the idea that no one could love Tyrion

He does this not because they could really loved Tyrion the shame of House Lannister, he does this because they loved a Lannister. 

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"For your gold, Father said. She was lowborn, you were a Lannister of Casterly Rock. All she wanted was the gold, which made her no different from a whore, so . . . so it would not be a lie, not truly, and . . . he said that you required a sharp lesson. That you would learn from it, and thank me later . . ."

Tywin himself very bad experiences with mistresses and want to prevent Tyrion from getting used by one

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2 hours ago, Karneol said:

He does this not because they could really loved Tyrion the shame of House Lannister, he does this because they loved a Lannister. 

Tywin himself very bad experiences with mistresses and want to prevent Tyrion from getting used by one

NO. 

No, no, no, no, no. 

Tywin doesn’t truly care about the “reputation” of House Lannister. I’m sorry if I’m a little bit angry, but I just cannot stand the argument that he’s doing it “for Tyrion’s own good”. Tywin is a hypocritical, sadistic, monstrous person who did nothing for any motive beyond for himself or humiliating his family members that he didn’t like. 

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Roose was far worse than Tywin. 

Roose likes to hurt people for the sake of hurting people, and he does nothing to control Ramsey.  Furthermore, Roose was undermining and betraying Robb way before the Red Wedding.

Tywin rationalizes everything he does by doing it in the course of war.  He may employ sadists, but he does not enjoy doing the deeds himself.

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18 hours ago, Eddard Waters said:

So we have Tywin Lannister, a sadistic and power-hungry egomaniac who is probably the biggest mass murderer in recent Westerosi history, or Roose Bolton, a psychopathic torturer, serial rapist and Kingslayer.

Both have awful offsprings.  These boys have a lot in common. 

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49 minutes ago, Moiraine Sedai said:

Both have awful offsprings.  These boys have a lot in common. 

Jamie, Cersei, and Tyrion are horrible, but they are not even close to Ramsay in terms of sheer horribleness.

Domeric from what we've heard of him seemed like a good kid, though we know next to nothing about him so.... 

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8 hours ago, SiSt said:

Tywin is genuinely sadistic, vindictive and motivated by pride. 

Roose is seemingly just completely amoral and emotionless. Not getting a kick out of neither rape, murder or torture. A peaceful land, a quiet people. 

Not saying this makes Roose any more sympathetic, but Tywin is far worse in at least three respects

1. Making himself out to be honorable and noble, and his actions seemingly defensible. Hypocrite extraordinaire. 

2. Sheer numbers. 

3. Sadism against his own family. 

  roose is a sadist he is like ramsay but roose just keeps more control over it  there are hints  that he's probably just as much one as his son is, if with slightly different tastes. He's a lot better at hiding it and/or rationalizing it within the setting of Westeros. Westeros certainly does give plenty of opportunities for a clever sadist to get their fix without it looking too much out of place.

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Roose by far

Tywin did what he did to, he drove a powerful family  into the ground to stop people mocking the lannisters so people would fear him again  and then his already mocked  wilful son marries a commoner.

He tried to break tyrion  of his rebellious ways hurting the lannister family name  and also cut him loose of a useless marriage ...dwarf or not his 2nd name could secure an alliance

 

 

Roose by contrast is just a monster by his own admission his actions will prob ruin his house so they are utterly short sighted for his own gain

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47 minutes ago, silverwolf22 said:

  roose is a sadist he is like ramsay but roose just keeps more control over it  there are hints  that he's probably just as much one as his son is, if with slightly different tastes. He's a lot better at hiding it and/or rationalizing it within the setting of Westeros. Westeros certainly does give plenty of opportunities for a clever sadist to get their fix without it looking too much out of place.

Really? I can't remember any from the text where Roose seems to act out of sadism or enjoying himself much, if at all. There is his active part in the red wedding, but mostly, he just hangs back and does as little himself as possible. 

I can't remember him showing any enjoyment from anything, really. 

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8 minutes ago, SiSt said:

Really? I can't remember any from the text where Roose seems to act out of sadism or enjoying himself much, if at all. There is his active part in the red wedding, but mostly, he just hangs back and does as little himself as possible. 

I can't remember him showing any enjoyment from anything, really. 

 Two peasants "forgot" to inform Roose about there Wedding, he responded by having the husband hung and raping his wife beneath the husbands hanging corpse. Roose apparently still practices First Night, and is perfectly aware that it is Rape.

And that's how Ramsey was conceived.

He also apparently knows that human skin makes for poor boots. 

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That doesn't mean he enjoys it. 

He seemingly doesn't enjoy fat Walda much either, merely finds her noises endearing in a comical sense. 

The skinning is pretty much a family tradition, which he may be keeping up merely to keep his smallfolk afraid of him.

I trust Barbrey Dustin. 

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You think Roose does not know? Silly boy. Watch him. Watch how he watches Manderly. No dish so much as touches Roose's lips until he sees Lord Wyman eat of it first. No cup of wine is sipped until he sees Manderly drink of the same cask. I think he would be pleased if the fat man attempted some betrayal. It would amuse him. Roose has no feelings, you see. Those leeches that he loves so well sucked all the passions out of him years ago. He does not love, he does not hate, he does not grieve. This is a game to him, mildly diverting. Some men hunt, some hawk, some tumble dice. Rooseplays with men. You and me, these Freys, Lord Manderly, his plump new wife, even his bastard, we are but his playthings

Ramsay is the sadist in the family imo. 

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On 4/14/2019 at 7:57 PM, Eddard Waters said:

So we have Tywin Lannister, a sadistic and power-hungry egomaniac who is probably the biggest mass murderer in recent Westerosi history, or Roose Bolton, a psychopathic torturer, serial rapist and Kingslayer.

What are you talking about? Both of these two people were typical power grasping Medieval Lords, neither of them were evil.

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