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JonSleet

I am the Queen

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"Anyone who says 'I am the king' is no true king" - Tywin Lannister 

Danaerys says to Jon at one point in the episode "I am the Queen" 

Is this a hint/ foreshadowing by the writers or just bad writing? 

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Daenerys is like a broken record about this. She says something along the lines "bow down, I'm the queen" every episode.

Not sure if it hints her downfall (what downfall? they need her to defeat the NK) but it certainly shows that she doesn't know how to be the queen. The difference between her and Jon is striking. While Jon inspires loyalty by his actions, Daenerys tries to force loyalty by her words (and Cersei tries to get loyalty through fear).

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1 minute ago, Nerevanin said:

Daenerys is like a broken record about this. She says something along the lines "bow down, I'm the queen" every episode.

Not sure if it hints her downfall (what downfall? they need her to defeat the NK) but it certainly shows that she doesn't know how to be the queen. The difference between her and Jon is striking. While Jon inspires loyalty by his actions, Daenerys tries to force loyalty by her words (and Cersei tries to get loyalty through fear).

I think that if D&D want we could have several amazing dramatric scenes. With jon learning more about what happened between his parents and dealing with living as a bastard and joining the nw because of ned's lie, then the starks learning about it and coming to terms with it and finally how danny would accept that there is another targ with a better claim than her… That she wasn t born to rule the 7 kingdoms...

And they could end with the surviving westerosi having to decide which monarch they want to support and why or how far danny/cersei are willing to go to be queen.

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1 hour ago, JonSleet said:

"Anyone who says 'I am the king' is no true king" - Tywin Lannister 

I like this quote very much, because it is so true. Even in real life with bosses, fathers, mothers, captains or whatever.

1 hour ago, JonSleet said:

Danaerys says to Jon at one point in the episode "I am the Queen" 

She said such pretty often through all the seasons. Maybe this is a real foreshadowing not only by DD but by the real boy, GRRM. 

Daenerys is a wanna-be queen. Just because of birthright she wants a throne that has a long time ago been conquered by someone else. And her ancestors simply conquered it, too. She has no "right" at all. She simply needs to conquer it again, with or without any birth rights. All this babble about birthright is utter nonsense.

Daenerys is alternatingly depicted as "mad king/queen" and as warrior-queen. Good intentions are quite often the opposite of good deeds.

 

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Its foreshadowing in that rulers are only allowed to rule by common assent. The moment they lose it they get overthrown. If you have to say you are the ruler than you haven't proven it.

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2 hours ago, JonSleet said:

"Anyone who says 'I am the king' is no true king" - Tywin Lannister 

Danaerys says to Jon at one point in the episode "I am the Queen" 

Is this a hint/ foreshadowing by the writers or just bad writing? 

I'd like to think it's foreshadowing because it felt like a bit of an arse of a statement to make, especially coupled with the Tywin quote. She's sad it all the way through the Series as well.

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1 hour ago, Nerevanin said:

Daenerys is like a broken record about this. She says something along the lines "bow down, I'm the queen" every episode.

Not sure if it hints her downfall (what downfall? they need her to defeat the NK) but it certainly shows that she doesn't know how to be the queen. The difference between her and Jon is striking. While Jon inspires loyalty by his actions, Daenerys tries to force loyalty by her words (and Cersei tries to get loyalty through fear).

Wrong. 

“She’s not our queen because she’s the daughter of some king we never knew. “She’s the queen we chose.” ~Missandei 

 

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Posted (edited)

Take a step back and you should realize that there are very many similarities between Jon and Daenerys.
It's one of the reasons they ended up banging in S7.

Daenerys inspires loyalty with her actions just as much as Jon does.
There's no way she'd be able to force the Unsullied to follow her back in S3 or the entire Dothraki horde back in S6. 
They came (and stayed) on their own free will.

Is Jon more humble than Daenerys however? Absolutely, but that's for a different topic.

Edited by MinscS2

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Posted (edited)
47 minutes ago, Nictarion said:

“She’s not our queen because she’s the daughter of some king we never knew. “She’s the queen we chose. ~Missandei 

OK, I should have specified it. Daenerys used to inspire by her actions (walking into fire unhurt, the birth of dragons and killing the slavemasters are the biggest examples). Now she expects everyone in Westeros to immediately bow down to her because she has dragons and because she is "the queen", as she constantly reminds everyone. But she hasn't really done anything what the Westeros people should admire her for.

Edited by Nerevanin

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1 minute ago, Nerevanin said:

OK, I should have specified it. Daenerys used to inspire by her actions (walking into fire unhurt, the birth of dragons and killing the slavemasters are the biggest examples). Now she expects everyone in Westeros to immediately bow down to her because she has dragons and because she is "the queen", as she constantly reminds everyone.

She seemed to inspire Jon last season by saving his ass which is why he bent the knee to her in the first place.

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1 minute ago, El Guapo said:

She seemed to inspire Jon last season by saving his ass which is why he bent the knee to her in the first place.

Yeah. That's exactly one person. Sure, a person in a position of power, but still one person. In E01 it is evident that most people are unsure about Dany. They don't know why they should bow down to a foreigner just because she calls herself "queen" (excluding the dragons ofc). As Davos said, Dany needs to win their trust first.

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2 minutes ago, El Guapo said:

She seemed to inspire Jon last season by saving his ass

True -- but more or less only Jon.

2 minutes ago, El Guapo said:

which is why he bent the knee to her in the first place.

As Sansa understands correctly and points out in S8E1, Jon might have a crush an Daenerys which might have clouded his mind. 

Jon bending the knee was a severe mistake. After the wight expedition Daenerys would have fought with him anyway. And if only to revenge her dragon. Bending the knee was purely stupid.

They should have respected each other als Queen und King. Eye to eye, as equals and lovers. 

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1 minute ago, Nerevanin said:

Yeah. That's exactly one person. Sure, a person in a position of power, but still one person. In E01 it is evident that most people are unsure about Dany. They don't know why they should bow down to a foreigner just because she calls herself "queen" (excluding the dragons ofc). As Davos said, Dany needs to win their trust first.

I mean, bringing her entire force up north to help them is a good start, no? 

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1 minute ago, Nerevanin said:

Yeah. That's exactly one person. Sure, a person in a position of power, but still one person. In E01 it is evident that most people are unsure about Dany. They don't know why they should bow down to a foreigner just because she calls herself "queen" (excluding the dragons ofc). As Davos said, Dany needs to win their trust first.

But she is the Queen.  Once Jon bent the knee to her she became their Queen whether they like it or not.

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3 minutes ago, Nerevanin said:

OK, I should have specified it. Daenerys used to inspire by her actions (walking into fire unhurt, the birth of dragons and killing the slavemasters are the biggest examples). Now she expects everyone in Westeros to immediately bow down to her because she has dragons and because she is "the queen", as she constantly reminds everyone. But she hasn't really done anything what the Westeros people should admire her for.

Agreed.

I think part of this is an exploration on the nature of power. Varys has certainly spent some time thinking about it. We are heading to a Westeros without a monarch, or a constitutional monarchy. 

Jon has never sought power for power's sake. That is what makes him so attractive as a leader. Does he screw up? You betcha. But he truly believes he's doing the right thing for everyone. He was duly elected as Lord Commander--by his peers. Danaerys has no such motivations. In her mind, Westeros is hers, Would she have been willing to lay waste to the North in a Redgrass Field just to get the North to submit, even with the White Walkers bearing down on them? 

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Dany is postponing her entire war against Cersei (which was basically won at the end of S6) in order to march north with her dragons and armies, putting herself and those she loves at risk, in order to save a part of the country that she has never been to and where the majority outright dislikes her.
(Yes, I know that saving the north is in her self-interest as well.) In a normal world, this would've been enough to earn the respect of anyone north of the trident.

Apparently though, the northerners respect depends entirely on Daenerys being super-friendly and humble and nothing else. 
I'm surprised she didn't tell everyone in the great hall to fuck off in the last episode. 

 

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Just now, MinscS2 said:

Dany is postponing her entire war against Cersei (which was basically won at the end of S6) in order to march north with her dragons and armies, putting herself and those she loves at risk, in order to save a part of the country that she has never been to and where the majority outright dislikes her.
(Yes, I know that saving the north is in her self-interest as well.) In a normal world, this would've been enough to earn the respect of anyone north of the trident.

Apparently though, the northerners respect depends entirely on Daenerys being super-friendly and humble and nothing else. 
I'm surprised she didn't tell everyone in the great hall to fuck off in the last episode. 

 

It took a lot of talking for Jon to get her to agree to help him. She has a crush on him, too, don't forget,  just as his bending the knee was caused by his infatuation. SHE summoned him to pay homage to her, remember. She had no interest in helping him or the North. All she wanted was his fealty as his god given queen. 

Remove her infatuation from the equation, and I doubt she helps him. She'd lay waste to Westeros and be queen of the ashes. 

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Well, when you think of Daenerys and who she "inspired", what else were they going to do? Where was Missandei and the Unsullied going to go? Who was going to lead the Dothraki when all the leaders are dead? When you look at John, who he fought for at Castle Black, trying to work with the Wildlings, trying to make a necessary change, the fact that the North chose a bastard to be King, because he commands that without trying. Without those dragons, who is Daenerys Targaryen? I wanted more of that explored, especially with the Northerners. They all know one of the dragons belongs to the NK and brought down the Wall. That completely deserves their fear and reservation of her, that what she has and what she brings is a threat, not an advantage

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13 hours ago, JonSleet said:

"Anyone who says 'I am the king' is no true king" - Tywin Lannister 

Danaerys says to Jon at one point in the episode "I am the Queen" 

Is this a hint/ foreshadowing by the writers or just bad writing? 

I did not like how she threatened Sansa to Jon while in "this mode" To me it is clear that they intend to may Dany finish the series as a Tyrant. Whether she lives or not, I doub that but it will not be pretty.

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For the last few years she has had the people of Essos falling at her feet worshipping her, The Dragons, Pale Skin, Blonde Hair... she stood out and barely had to work for their love..... since arriving in Westero's I feel she has been getting more and more frustrated with everyone not falling all over like she has been used to for the past few years and this I am the queen line is result of it.

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