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norwaywolf123

What did x character think about Jaime joining the kingsguard?

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What did x character think about Jaime joining the kingsguard?

  • Rhaegar Targaryen
  • Rhaella Targaryen
  • Other Kingsguards
  • Lord/Lady Martell (Unsure of who was the overlord of House Martell at the time)
  • Tywin's siblings
  • Varys
  • Hoster Tully

Do anyone think it was possible or even likely that Rhaegar might have wanted to remove Jaime from the Kingsguard?

Could Aerys/Rhaegar have relieved/dismissed Jaime of the kingsguard prior to the battle at the Trident?

 

I am open to references to the books aswell as just personal opinions.

Edited by norwaywolf123

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6 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Could Aerys/Rhaegar have relieved/dismissed Jaime of the kingsguard prior to the battle at the Trident?

Aerys could.  Rhaegar could not.  

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Most of the list probably disagree with Aerys decision based on Jaime's age. He was too young for such vow. We know that Barristan thought it.

Hoster Tully probably was angry about losing a bethrothal to Lysa.

The Lannisters were probably shocked that their heir was taken away.

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I doubt Rhaegar spent much time thinking about it. Perhaps he had an opinion, but he had a lot of distractions around that time.

I wonder about Arthur Dayne. Jaime obviously idolized Dayne, and Dayne thought highly enough of Jaime to knight him in the first place. One would think that he'd take Jaime under his wing at the least, but there was no time. Between the time that Jaime was raised and the time when Dayne would have been off with Rhaegar kidnapping Lyanna there was probably only a few months to half a year or so to mentor young Jaime, and there's a good chance that those guys were busy planning their shenanigans rather than worrying about the newest Kingsguard's mental health.

I think Selmy disapproving of Jaime's appointment could have been similar to the way Benjen didn't want Jon to take the black. Jon was too young, he should have lived a bit more life before taking the black. The other Kingsguard might have felt similarly, but they probably went about their duties. It does seem though that Jaime was a bit more isolated from the other Kingsguard members as Aerys liked to keep him close while the others may have been off doing other things from time to time.

Doran Martell would have been Prince of Dorne by this time. I am guessing he inherited a dislike of Tywin from his mother (who had wanted to betroth Oberyn to Cersei or Elia to Jaime) and would have been delighted that Tywin lost his heir in this manner.

As to Tywin's siblings, Kevan thinks whatever Tywin thinks. Tygett and Gerion are too far down the line of succession to see this as advantageous to them in some way, although I can imagine that while I am sure they shared Tywin's concerns, they may have felt some pride in Jaime as well. We know that Genna was more impressed with Tyrion than Tywin was, so maybe Genna didn't think losing Jaime as heir was quite as devastating as Tywin did. But I can't see any of them being entirely pleased with the situation. Kingsguard is a good appointment for a second son of a minor house, but a first son of a great house not so much, especially if that son is only 15 years old.

17 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Do anyone think it was possible or even likely that Rhaegar might have wanted to remove Jaime from the Kingsguard?

Could Aerys/Rhaegar have relieved/dismissed Jaime of the kingsguard prior to the battle at the Trident?

Kingsguard serve for life. And Rhaegar at least would have taken these vows very seriously. Obviously as King, you can do pretty much whatever you want in theory, but the removal of Kingsguard members was rare.

We see Joffrey remove Selmy to be sure, but even they used Robert's death as a flimsy excuse. It's kind of unprecedented, but at least it's a pale shadow of what we see Jaehaerys do with Maegor's Kingsguard.

I doubt the likes of Rhaegar and Aerys would have even considered the removal of a Kingsguard as a possibility unless that Kingsguard had committed a crime or failed his king, neither of which Jaime had done up to that point. Aerys at least, if he had wanted to replace Jaime wouldn't have bothered with dismissing him - he would have burned him alive for disobeying him or something like that.

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6 hours ago, Syl of Syl said:

I doubt Rhaegar spent much time thinking about it. Perhaps he had an opinion, but he had a lot of distractions around that time.

I think Rhaegar might have wanted to release Jaime from the Kingsguard, inorder to improve relations with Tywin. It is likely that Rhaegar would have arranged a marriage between Jaime and one of Rhaegar's allies. After the civil war House Targaryen would desire strong allies, while House Lannister had sat out the war, they had not directly fought House Targaryen, unlike much of the Stormlands, Riverlands, Vale and North.

 But i agree that he was very busy at the time.

 

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16 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

I think Rhaegar might have wanted to release Jaime from the Kingsguard, inorder to improve relations with Tywin. It is likely that Rhaegar would have arranged a marriage between Jaime and one of Rhaegar's allies. After the civil war House Targaryen would desire strong allies, while House Lannister had sat out the war, they had not directly fought House Targaryen, unlike much of the Stormlands, Riverlands, Vale and North.

Do you mean in a hypothetical where Rhaegar wins the Battle of the Trident and survives the war? That would change a lot of other things as well. I don't think we can say with much authority about how Rhaegar was as a political maneuverer, but I doubt he or anybody in his inner circle would see the need to reward Tywin Lannister for sitting at home through the whole war.

I think if Rhaegar had won at the Trident, he would have called for a great council or something of that sort to depose his father Aerys for reasons of mental fitness. If Tywin had demanded that Jaime be released because Aerys was not in his right mind when he named him, maybe that is something that Rhaegar would give him, but I don't see Rhaegar necessarily making Tywin a priority over making amends with the rebels who are half the realm and in particular with the North who I think he may have agreed had pretty good reason to rebel.

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On 4/16/2019 at 4:09 PM, norwaywolf123 said:

What did x character think about Jaime joining the kingsguard?

  • Rhaegar Targaryen
  • Rhaella Targaryen
  • Other Kingsguards
  • Lord/Lady Martell (Unsure of who was the overlord of House Martell at the time) 
  • Tywin's siblings
  • Varys
  • Hoster Tully

Do anyone think it was possible or even likely that Rhaegar might have wanted to remove Jaime from the Kingsguard?

Could Aerys/Rhaegar have relieved/dismissed Jaime of the kingsguard prior to the battle at the Trident?

 

I am open to references to the books aswell as just personal opinions.

They assumed he wanted the appointment.  Jaime didn't protest.  He was hanging around the KG all the time.  One could be forgiven for thinking it was his ambition.  Tywin's siblings wouldn't object.  That's one person out of the way in the line of inheritance.  

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7 hours ago, Syl of Syl said:

Do you mean in a hypothetical where Rhaegar wins the Battle of the Trident and survives the war?

yes

7 hours ago, Syl of Syl said:

That would change a lot of other things as well. I don't think we can say with much authority about how Rhaegar was as a political maneuverer, but I doubt he or anybody in his inner circle would see the need to reward Tywin Lannister for sitting at home through the whole war.

Rhaegar would only release Jaime from the Kingsguard to further his own interests i reckon.

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