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Krishtotter

Remorseful Jaime, Unrepentant Dany

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4 minutes ago, SeanF said:

More than they loved Olly, at any rate.

Which sadly says a lot about the GoT fanbase.

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4 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

Yeah the cases are very similar, but the fans reactions are remarkably different.

Jon executing 3 men and a boy who broke their vows and killed someone they had sworn allegiance too? 
No one bats an eye.

Daenerys executing 2 men who broke their vows and killed someone they had sworn allegiance too?
"Daenerys is evil and crazy omfg!"

And everyone loved Randyll?

I wouldn't say they were very similar. In Jon's case, he was Lord Commander and men under his direct commander murdered him. That is strait treason and a capital punishment. He had no choice to hang them.

In Dany's case, The Tyrells were sworn to the Iron Throne (like all the lord of westeros are suppose to be). Now given the fact that Cersei is crazy and blew up the Sept of Baelor, killing all the Tyrells except the Queen of Thorns, it no wonder why the Queen of Thorns would back another queen. From one perspective, the Tyrells were the traitors and the Tarly's were keeping their original vow to the Throne.

Now on the issue of Dany's execution, she really had no choice. She gave two option, bend the knee or die. Any sane man would bend the knee but Tarly was to proud. So she really had no choice but to follow through. Like Jaime said at the siege of Riverrun, don't make a threat if you aren't going to follow through. The only thing I would have suggested would have Dany burn the father first and then ask the son if he wanted to reconsider bending the knee. 

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5 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

Yeah the cases are very similar, but the fans reactions are remarkably different.

Jon executing 3 men and a boy who broke their vows and killed someone they had sworn allegiance too? 
No one bats an eye.

Daenerys executing 2 men who broke their vows and killed someone they had sworn allegiance too?
"Daenerys is evil and crazy omfg!"

And everyone loved Randyll?

I am not arguing for the Tarleys, nor Jon. [although I would point out that the Tarleys are not hands- on murderers, they murdered indirectly, re: Olenna]  

My issue is that Dany does not seem to operate on any moderate level.  She is trying to take over a city/area and showing mercy might have given a folks a reason to love her.  Showing up, burning men and supplies was not enough?  She then had 2 more men burned alive to make her point.  I think her point was made with the dragon attack.  She had men beheaded and put their heads on spikes.  Her dragons ate children.  

In season 7, ep 4, Jon tells Dany that "if she uses dragons to melt castles and burn cities, she isn't different, she is just more of the same". 

I think Dany is too taken with her dragon power and her rightful (in her mind) rise to complete power. In short, Dany is dangerous.

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12 hours ago, princess brittany said:

yeah dany is the  only one thats not too bad. she just didnt always think things through.  

Maester Aemon was a highly respected and beloved character. 

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On 4/19/2019 at 12:34 PM, Krishtotter said:

 

Dany, by contrast, burns alive nobles in Essos and Westeros for simply having doubts about her or for belonging to a certain political class by birth, in addition to the petty Cersei-style revenge for Drogo's death.

 

Quibble.  Pyatt Pree didn't have doubts; he stole her dragons and tried to imprison her.  The Masters of Mereen were not simply having doubts about her; they were actively fomenting a rebellion and did kill Barristan Selmy.  Tarly actively fought against her, and was given a choice.  2 choices, actually, but he turned down The Nights Watch option.  The burning of MMD was petty revenge for Drogo?   For killing him, then killing their son just to bring Drogo back w/o his mind?

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Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

This is a massive whitewash of Randyll Tarly and his actions during S7. 

Let's forget for a second that he was a xenophobic, racist asshat that threatened to kill his eldest son for no good reason.

He's a enemy commander who betrayed his liege lord and attacked and killed one of Daenerys allies. 
He was captured after a battle (if he'd died during the battle we wouldn't have this conversation t begin with) and brought to Daenerys, who gave him several options, despite him insulting her and her second-in-command: 
- Kneel, submit and receive a pardon. (A pretty common occurrence in Westeros, but one that far from every leader would allow their defeated enemy, especially one who has done so much harm as Randyll.)
- Take the black and go into exile.
- Execution. 

Given what he had done, his options where more than fair.
Daenerys didn't execute him because he didn't kneel.
She executed him for what he had done previously in the war, and for being a high-ranking enemy who defied her by insulting her and by turning down all the choices she gave him.
 

 

The options that Dany presented to Randyll Tarly were essentially the same ones that Aegon the Conqueror presented to his foes, were they not? 

Edited by Tywin Tytosson
extra 'the

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13 minutes ago, Tywin Tytosson said:

 

Quibble.  Pyatt Pree didn't have doubts; he stole her dragons and tried to imprison her.  The Masters of Mereen were not simply having doubts about her; they were actively fomenting a rebellion and did kill Barristan Selmy.  Tarly actively fought against her, and was given a choice.  2 choices, actually, but he turned down The Nights Watch option.  The burning of MMD was petty revenge for Drogo?   For killing him, then killing their son just to bring Drogo back w/o his mind?

her son could have been stillborn. 

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3 minutes ago, princess brittany said:

her son could have been stillborn. 

 

He was either stillborn or died quickly.  Due to the blood magic that MMD performed.  She pretty much said that the life that paid for Drogos resurrection was Dany's son.  After leading Dany to believe that her (or Drogo's) horse was that life.  And MMD was happy or at least content that the son was dead.

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the reason why people are so mad about her killing randyll and dickon because you can tell she likes doing it. jon didnt like  killing people.

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Just now, Tywin Tytosson said:

 

He was either stillborn or died quickly.  Due to the blood magic that MMD performed.  She pretty much said that the life that paid for Drogos resurrection was Dany's son.  After leading Dany to believe that her (or Drogo's) horse was that life.  And MMD was happy or at least content that the son was dead.

she shouldnt have let drogo died a peaceful death. 

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1 hour ago, lakin1013 said:

My issue is that Dany does not seem to operate on any moderate level.  She is trying to take over a city/area and showing mercy might have given a folks a reason to love her.  Showing up, burning men and supplies was not enough?  She then had 2 more men burned alive to make her point.  I think her point was made with the dragon attack.  She had men beheaded and put their heads on spikes.  Her dragons ate children.  

 

Since you seem to be suffering of selective amnesia, rewatch this clip < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL-B76vX_pw > where Dany decides to NOT ATTACK King's Landing in order to avoid the killing of innocent townsfolk and to make a better impression in the Westerosi. To win their over by loyalty and not simply by force.

"Showing up, burning men and supplies was not enough? ". That was the middle of the battle. Was Tyrion guilty of using wildfire against Stannis' fleet? 

"She had men beheaded and put their heads on spikes.". What? Ned beheaded men, Robb beheaded men, Arya murdered so many people.... You justified the men Jon executed because that's how it worked in that society, but you use "she beheaded men" against dany? Honestly, you're not even trying.

 

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2 hours ago, lakin1013 said:

  Showing up, burning men and supplies was not enough?  She then had 2 more men burned alive to make her point.  I think her point was made with the dragon attack.  She had men beheaded and put their heads on spikes.  Her dragons ate children.  

 

The dragon attack that burned men and supplies was a battle.  The burned men were enemy soldiers in battle formation.  The supplies were what the enemy soldiers were guarding.  To quote Ellaria, "This is War".  The point of the battle was to win it and prove that she does have the power to defeat the Lannisters.   And to prevent those supplies from making it to KL so the Lannisters could withstand a lengthy siege.

 

I don't recall Dany ever having men beheaded and having their heads put on spikes.  Please provide examples of such.

 

Her dragons eating (or burning) children are her dragons, not her.  As soon as she found out that happened, she chained 2 of her dragons inside a pyramid to prevent that from happening again.  Recall what Jorah said outside the Dragonpit in 7.7.  That sounded like a common issue with dragons in general, not just Dany's.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, princess brittany said:

the reason why people are so mad about her killing randyll and dickon because you can tell she likes doing it. jon didnt like  killing people.

Trust me, she would've much preferred that Randyll would've bent the knee (or possibly even taken the black), than having to execute him. 

 

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2 hours ago, princess brittany said:

the reason why people are so mad about her killing randyll and dickon because you can tell she likes doing it. jon didnt like  killing people.

You're absolutely assuming this.

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1 hour ago, Tywin Tytosson said:

 

I don't recall Dany ever having men beheaded and having their heads put on spikes.  Please provide examples of such.

 

 

163 Great Masters crucified during Mereen.

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2 hours ago, Nymeria Stone said:

Since you seem to be suffering of selective amnesia, rewatch this clip < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL-B76vX_pw > where Dany decides to NOT ATTACK King's Landing in order to avoid the killing of innocent townsfolk and to make a better impression in the Westerosi. To win their over by loyalty and not simply by force.

She decides not to attack based on Jon's advice.  He points out to her that, by killing and roasting people, she would only be more of the same.

 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, lakin1013 said:

163 Great Masters crucified during Mereen.

Ah, those.  Those were not beheadings.  Those were crucifixions. 

Those were not because the Masters were from a certain class.   They were because those Great Masters crucified a slave at each mile on the road to Meereen so Dany would see them.  163 miles, so 163 crucified slaves.  In Dany's mind, 163 innocents.   In repayment, she crucified the same number of Masters.

Edited by Tywin Tytosson
mispellings

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3 hours ago, princess brittany said:

the reason why people are so mad about her killing randyll and dickon because you can tell she likes doing it. jon didnt like  killing people.

I’m definitely watching a different show than you...

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1 hour ago, lakin1013 said:

163 Great Masters crucified during Mereen.

So she didn't behead people and put their heads on spikes then.

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