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Tywin et al.

US Politics: It’s Not A Crime If Your Feelings Got Hurt

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Man, reading this report is pretty bananas. Cohen and Sater's correspondences trying to get meetings with Putin and others, just on the page ~70ish that I randomly scrolled to sound like Bourne Identity bad guys.

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[The] President slumped back in his chair and said, “Oh my God. This is terrible. This is the end of my Presidency. I’m fucked.” The President became angry and lambasted the Attorney General for his decision to recuse from the investigation, stating, “How could you let this happen, Jeff?” The President said the position of Attorney General was his most important appointment and that Sessions had “let [him] down,” contrasting him to Eric Holder and Robert Kennedy. Sessions recalled that the President said to him, “you were supposed to protect me,” or words to that effect.

How was this not redacted?

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Dave Chappelle was clearly a visionary. White men really can get away with anything by saying, “I didn’t know I couldn’t do that.”

I must say though, Trump’s initial reaction is pretty funny. There’s going to be a lot of embarrassing stuff coming out of this report.

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So my first impressions from the stories on CNN is that Trump tried to obstruct the investigation repeatedly but his own people just refused to carry out or just ignored his instructions.  So the intent was there, but he failed at it completely.

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2 minutes ago, Leofric said:

So my first impressions from the stories on CNN is that Trump tried to obstruct the investigation repeatedly but his own people just refused to carry out or just ignored his instructions.  So the intent was there, but he failed at it completely.

Yeah, it's pretty awesome that he'll be saved from being charged with a crime because he was too incompetent to actually get it done, and most of the people that work for him don't listen to what he actually says.

yay us

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Leofric said:

So my first impressions from the stories on CNN is that Trump tried to obstruct the investigation repeatedly but his own people just refused to carry out or just ignored his instructions.  So the intent was there, but he failed at it completely.

For some types of obstruction but he did succeed in others (e.g., firing Comey). It's pretty clear that in the last few paragraphs of that section that Mueller is leaving it to Congress to decide.

Also, this the same issue with some of the conspiracy charges against Don Jr. He was too stupid to "know what he was doing was wrong" basically.

Edited by Mexal

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9 minutes ago, Mexal said:

Also, this the same issue with some of the conspiracy charges against Don Jr. He was too stupid to "know what he was doing was wrong" basically.

Nah. It wasn't about stupidity. it was about privilege. Don Jr has been taught by his dad that there is no 'wrong' here, only what he gets away with and what he might have to walk away from. His moral compass points entirely to himself. 

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Posted (edited)

NPR and the local public radio station is doing all day bleating about the Mueller Report.  So, being who they are, they keep dragging on reps for the rethugs and the demon and his PERSONAL lawyers to have their say, and ay-up -- it took no time at all for one of them to say, that this, unlike HER EMAILS which need far more investigation, is full exoneration, full exposure of innocence, and just move on now.

And ya, I'm listening, but I'm about to shut it all down.  It's just saying the same things over and over and over, just bringing on a few different voices to say them.

In the meantime, yesterday Bolton and the demon re-criminalized going to Cuba, in the same way abortion has been criminalized.  They attack everything that makes travel possible, such as the airlines using Cuban employees in Cuban airports, making abortion providers unavailable, period.

Edited by Zorral

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5 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Nah. It wasn't about stupidity. it was about privilege. Don Jr has been taught by his dad that there is no 'wrong' here, only what he gets away with and what he might have to walk away from. His moral compass points entirely to himself. 

I don't think Mueller considered Don Jr's privilege in his assessment. It read much more like Don Jr was an idiot.

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1 minute ago, Mexal said:

I don't think Mueller considered Don Jr's privilege in his assessment. It read much more like Don Jr was an idiot.

I'm simply saying that even if he thought it was 'wrong', that wouldn't change his calculus in doing it, because anything he wants to do is wrong only inasmuch as how much he might  get caught doing it. 

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1 hour ago, Kalbear said:

Yeah, it's pretty awesome that he'll be saved from being charged with a crime because he was too incompetent to actually get it done, and most of the people that work for him don't listen to what he actually says.

yay us

DEEP STATE CONSPIRACY

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1 hour ago, Mexal said:

For some types of obstruction but he did succeed in others (e.g., firing Comey). It's pretty clear that in the last few paragraphs of that section that Mueller is leaving it to Congress to decide.

Also, this the same issue with some of the conspiracy charges against Don Jr. He was too stupid to "know what he was doing was wrong" basically.

Since when is ignorance of the law an excuse?

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Duh, he has power and money. Of course it's a valid excuse. You and I would be fucked, but Donny is golden.

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8 minutes ago, Ice Queen said:

Since when is ignorance of the law an excuse?

Quite often it seems. The law states that for campaign finance violations they have to know it's illegal. Same with conspiracy.

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Just now, Mexal said:

Quite often it seems. The law states that for campaign finance violations they have to know it's illegal. Same with conspiracy.

And yet, if that were you or me, we'd be in prison in a no time flat. 

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, Ice Queen said:

And yet, if that were you or me, we'd be in prison in a no time flat. 

Not necessarily. They'd still have to prove that I knew it was wrong. I think they would likely do a lot more digging, take me in for questioning, etc to get to that point.

Edited by Mexal

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What's gonna piss me off is listening to people claiming that this report clears Trump because they didn't charge him while still screaming that Hillary needs to be jailed.

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28 minutes ago, Ice Queen said:

Since when is ignorance of the law an excuse?

See my post above. Ignorance is a valid excuse depending on your degrees of power, and being a famous, rich, white, straight, Christian male who happens to be president is the maximum level of power one can have.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Ice Queen said:

Since when is ignorance of the law an excuse?

When knowledge of the criminality of the action is included as an element of the crime that must be proven.  In other words, because, that’s the way this law was written.

That said, the fact that this may not have constituted a crime by Trump does not keep his actions, in attempting to undermine and control the investigation, from being impeachable.  All Presidents should be held to higher standards.

Edited by Ser Scot A Ellison

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