longest night Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 19 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: Well with a line such as "it's strong enough" what do you think? Is this a game where people try to make every line in a TV show as some kind of foreshadowing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 46 minutes ago, longest night said: Is this a game where people try to make every line in a TV show as some kind of foreshadowing? Nope, no game, just how D&D telegraph stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longest night Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 1 minute ago, sweetsunray said: Nope, no game, just how D&D telegraph stuff. Just pointing out that each individual episode has it's own writer. There's a reason the quality of dialogue is all over the place with each episode. The scene there was to convey the strength of the dragonglass weapons they are making, because in reality obsidian weapons would be fragile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinscS2 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 12 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: Nope, no game, just how D&D telegraph stuff. You give the writers (and the actual characters) too much credit. Not everything is foreshadowing and not everything is a clever ruse. I remember when Arya got stabbed in the gut by the Waif in S6. Everyone was absolutely certain that Arya couldn't be that stupid, and that it was all a trick. It was Arya who was wearing the Waif's face, or it was someone else who was wearing Arya's face in order to protect her from the Waif. Nope, turns out Arya/the writing was simply dumb as a doorknob. Good thing for her she had her plot-armour on. Anyone else who was stabbed that many times in the gut, let alone the fact that the Waif twisted the dagger would've dead in a matter of minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longest night Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 1 minute ago, MinscS2 said: You give the writers (and the actual characters) too much credit. Not everything is foreshadowing and not everything is a clever ruse. I remember when Arya got stabbed in the gut by the Waif in S6. Everyone was absolutely certain that Arya couldn't be that stupid, and that it was all a trick. It was Arya who was wearing the Waif's face, or it was someone else who was wearing Arya's face in order to protect her from the Waif. Nope, turns out Arya/the writing was simply dumb as a doorknob. I remember when people thought Sansa's conversation when she confronted Littlefinger about Ramsay made a lot of people think she was pregnant with Ramsay's child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, longest night said: Just pointing out that each individual episode has it's own writer. There's a reason the quality of dialogue is all over the place with each episode. The scene there was to convey the strength of the dragonglass weapons they are making, because in reality obsidian weapons would be fragile. lol... there are only three people writing on this show and they plot everything out together, to then have Cogman write the episode. It's about dragonglass on the surface, but it has to do with Gendry being a Baratheon and Jon Arryn's words about Baratheon seed, and how one time is enough for a Baratheon. And I actually am not looking forward to that plotline. Gendry is one of the few characters whose role has been to be a supporting character for Arya - for her character development and showcase a particular unique side of her, instead of having her mimic the Hound, or Cat, or Ned, or Lady Crane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 4 minutes ago, longest night said: I remember when people thought Sansa's conversation when she confronted Littlefinger about Ramsay made a lot of people think she was pregnant with Ramsay's child. I didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 9 minutes ago, MinscS2 said: You give the writers (and the actual characters) too much credit. Not everything is foreshadowing and not everything is a clever ruse. I remember when Arya got stabbed in the gut by the Waif in S6. Everyone was absolutely certain that Arya couldn't be that stupid, and that it was all a trick. It was Arya who was wearing the Waif's face, or it was someone else who was wearing Arya's face in order to protect her from the Waif. Nope, turns out Arya/the writing was simply dumb as a doorknob. Good thing for her she had her plot-armour on. Anyone else who was stabbed that many times in the gut, let alone the fact that the Waif twisted the dagger would've dead in a matter of minutes. I didn't honeypot that plot one bit. It was awful nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longest night Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 4 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: lol... there are only three people writing on this show and they plot everything out together, to then have Cogman write the episode. It's about dragonglass on the surface, but it has to do with Gendry being a Baratheon and Jon Arryn's words about Baratheon seed, and how one time is enough for a Baratheon. And I actually am not looking forward to that plotline. Gendry is one of the few characters whose role has been to be a supporting character for Arya - for her character development and showcase a particular unique side of her, instead of having her mimic the Hound, or Cat, or Ned, or Lady Crane. No, it's just talking about dragonglass.. Dialogue is written by the show writer, in the case of this episode, Cogman. The same person that gave us the line, "I took this castle from you, let me defend you now." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 6 minutes ago, longest night said: No, it's just talking about dragonglass.. Dialogue is written by the show writer, in the case of this episode, Cogman. The same person that gave us the line, "I took this castle from you, let me defend you now." We'll see I know my track record since Lady Crane's dialogue about bad boyfriends has been top notch though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 On 4/23/2019 at 12:35 PM, LadyNoOne said: For me, sex can deepen relationships. I think the feelings you mention might be love and now fear: fear of losing someone else she loves. I feel she has always loved him, but she tried to keep it separate from the sex and it leaked over and as you pointed out may have increased her feelings for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darmody Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 14 hours ago, sweetsunray said: preventing innocents from dying (like not allowing Walder's wife to drink from the wife) Arya had no way of knowing that girl was innocent, nor that the crowd of people she impossibly poisoned were guilty. She's just a mass-murderer there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinscS2 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 9 minutes ago, darmody said: Arya had no way of knowing that girl was innocent, nor that the crowd of people she impossibly poisoned were guilty. She's just a mass-murderer there. Yeah as much as I like Arya, collective punishment bad, regardless if it's Arya or Daenerys who orders it. All of the Frey-sons where hardly guilty, same as how all of the Merenesi masters where not guilty either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 26 minutes ago, darmody said: Arya had no way of knowing that girl was innocent, nor that the crowd of people she impossibly poisoned were guilty. She's just a mass-murderer there. 1 - We don't know how long Arya pretended to be that scullion maid to find out information 2 - Walder had a different wife at the RW than her 3 - With the show you don't really know whether D&D assume the women of the Twins are innocent, or whether Arya is wrong to target all and only the Frey men. But I gather they tried to make it a combination of Arya doing a Harrenhal-Jacquen (who murdered everyone) and some attempt by them to make her appear as still wanting to spare the "innocent". 4 - I'm not a fan of that cold-open and it's plotzee by d&d kill 3 birds with one stone: Lady Stoneheart revenge, Manderly's Frey pies and Frey House implosion after Walder's death. 5 - I agree that collective punishment is bad. Hence she met the nice Lannister soldiers afterwards to point out that there are good men who serve evil rulers, who shouldn't be killed willy nilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajjo Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 5 hours ago, darmody said: Arya had no way of knowing that girl was innocent Well, the killings on the Red Wedding were committed by men. The girl is not guilty for the crimes of the Red Wedding. Arya spares her because she was not involved in the Red wedding. This is no statement about general innocence. Further, Arya appears to want a witness to "tell them Winter came to House Frey". She wants the message to get out. She needs a surviving witness. Simple as that. 5 hours ago, darmody said: nor that the crowd of people she impossibly poisoned were guilty All the people cheered to Walder Frey saying they have committed the Red Wedding. So yes, most of them were somehow involved in the Red Wedding. And yes, maybe she killed some of Walder Frey's followers even without having been directly involved in the Red Wedding. So what? It's like war, Arya brings an end to the horrors of House Frey. Well done. I have no problem with her killing all those men cheering to Walder Frey. The Freys are the Starks enemy now. Well, up till then. Further, there was nothing "impossibly" about using poison in wine for Arya trained by the faceless men. She knows about poison now and maybe even took some of the poisonous water from the fountain. 5 hours ago, darmody said: She's just a mass-murderer there. Phrase it whatever negatively you like. Such is war. I call it "killing", not "muderering", but it was revenge and justice in her eyes and I can understand that. The Freys needed to be brought down. She could not tolerate that these men survive that massacred her family. We all agree that Arya is an assassin and has no worries about killing anymore. That's part of her nature now. Same for executing Baelish, no worries, calm act of her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajjo Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 5 hours ago, MinscS2 said: collective punishment bad, regardless if it's Arya or Daenerys who orders it. All of the Frey-sons where hardly guilty Well, almost all Frey's men at the Red wedding were guilty somehow. They knew about it and committed the massacre. I have no problems with Arya eliminating the Freys. It's war and revenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajjo Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 4 hours ago, sweetsunray said: 5 - I agree that collective punishment is bad. Hence she met the nice Lannister soldiers afterwards to point out that there are good men who serve evil rulers, who shouldn't be killed willy nilly Right, that was intentional to show she does not murder blindly. They showed us she invited those Freys she considers to be guilty. We don't know how the selected those men. They show us she spared the girl. They show us she is friendly to the Lannister soldiers. For me it fine for a TV show. We can't expect more careful depicting the circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo555 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Arya's seduction of Gendry is a very nuanced scene because of Maisie's acting. When Gendry tells her that he's Robert's bastard, she's seems to be momentarily surprised by the information since she stops familiarizing herself with the weapon he built and stares at him with a slight hint of shock, then quickly transitions into interrogating him about his sex life. This seems to be the point where she decides to dive right in and proposition him. Also, just after she says that "we're probably going to die soon" and before "I want to know what it's like before that happens", she takes a very subtle but noticeable *gulp*/swallow. It's a sign that Arya is after all a teenager(albeit an atypical one, being a somewhat remorseless assassin) whose is nervous about losing her virginity since this is uncharted emotional territory and an area that the Faceless men didn't train her for. Dempsie responds almost perfectly with a mixture of shock, bewilderment, and submission to her logic of an imminent death shortly awaiting them that transcends his reluctance and any thoughts of emotional repercussions. Technically, it's an intriguing and well acted insight into visually showing her regaining what's left of her humanity. Hopefully, it won't be too little and too late, i.e. if she doesn't survive the Battle of Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anjulibai Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 She'll survive, he won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajjo Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 On 4/28/2019 at 12:37 AM, neo555 said: Arya's seduction of Gendry is a very nuanced scene because of Maisie's acting. I agree with your description and explanation. It's a nice scene, well performed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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