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UK Politics: Awaiting MV3


Which Tyler

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1 minute ago, Soylent Brown said:

Some of the motivations for Brexit absolutely are racist, and one of the figureheads (amongst others) of the new party is unabashedly racist, but that clearly doesn't deter you at all - how else should I read into that?

You're not racist, you're just a big fan of a bunch of other racists?

No point going round this roundabout again but being opposed to large scale immigration doesn’t make someone a racist, and the more you try and pass off that opposition as racist the more likely you are going to be to end up with someone as unpleasant as Farage in charge of things.

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6 minutes ago, Soylent Brown said:

You voting for Farage is much more likely to lead to him coming into power than me disliking him and everything he stands for.

What bizarre logic.

I haven’t voted for anybody yet.

But if you are wondering why Brexit party are doing so well in the polls then you might want to consider that it isn’t because everyone except you is a racist.

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37 minutes ago, Soylent Brown said:

You voting for Farage is much more likely to lead to him coming into power than me disliking him and everything he stands for.

What bizarre logic.

While I share your opinions, one vote is one vote. Behaviours that have the potential to alienate a significant number of voters are potentially worse. 

 

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Keep in mind, those are a sample of 22 statements.

So do not despair if you still have a Tory rating of almost 50%, they are not just all around horrible, it means they hold some sensible positions. (I know our chaircat will take offense at that sentence, so replace the Tories with any other party you don't want to vote for).

Personally I'd be more worried if I scored highly with Arlene's Christian Order of the Homophobic Knights. But that might just be me, who would start to reexamine some life choices, or answers on that test.  However, you still might feel there are deal breakers for you with certain parties; like the racism in UKIP or the Brexit party, or the homophobic Christian fundamentalism in the DUP.

 

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Voting intention shows that The Brexit Party is leading and is doing really rather well. The Tories have to be seriously worried about this, and its interesting to see some of the stories coming out recently, with Jeremy Hunt saying they should 'embrace no deal'. 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1120883/European-elections-polls-latest-tories-brexit-party-news-nigel-farage-eu-election

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3 minutes ago, Soylent Brown said:

The Brexit party are doing well because the Remain vote is split between the proper parties; people voting how they ordinarily would.

In reality, a vote for them is a vote to install a bunch of people who will be as obnoxious and obstructive as possible during their official duties.

I really don't see any positives to be gained from further souring international relationships, whatever your preference on Brexit. The European elections are not another referendum.

They will, however, be treated as such.

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So, conscious that splitting the vote is still a thing in this form of PR, do you think I’m better off voting Lib Dem or Change? This is a single issue for me, as other policies will not matter if we leave anyway, so I want to vote for the party with the best chance of success. The Independent Group made headlines this year, but is Change more recognised and more likely to get votes than the Lib Dems? I haven’t seen much polling information that hasn’t come from the Express as linked above.

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6 minutes ago, Stannis Eats No Peaches said:

So, conscious that splitting the vote is still a thing in this form of PR, do you think I’m better off voting Lib Dem or Change? This is a single issue for me, as other policies will not matter if we leave anyway, so I want to vote for the party with the best chance of success. The Independent Group made headlines this year, but is Change more recognised and more likely to get votes than the Lib Dems? I haven’t seen much polling information that hasn’t come from the Express as linked above.

It depends which region you live in.  The smaller the region, the higher the threshold to get elected, and the greater the risk of splitting the vote.

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36 minutes ago, Soylent Brown said:

The Brexit party are doing well because the Remain vote is split between the proper parties; people voting how they ordinarily would.

The Brexit Vote is also split amongst a number of parties, seeing that both the Tories and Labour should essentially be seen as Brexit parties (if you go by their promises rather than actions) and we can of course ignore UKIP for now.

 

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For someone who likes to think of himself as a character from House of Cards, Williamson ends up sacked after an investigation into a shambolic leaking - a plot straight out of The Thick of It.

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13 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Just a here to offer a crutch for the undecided

If you need the help to decide which party you allign with most politically and are too busy or lazy to read the manifestos.

Otherwise, you can enforce your party allegiance and just play with it for your entertainment.

Top 3 for me were SNP, Sinn Fein and the Lib Dems.

I tend to think of Change UK as being similar to typical Lib Dem positions, but at least in this test there's a relatively big gap between them.

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22 hours ago, Heartofice said:

The Brexit Vote is also split amongst a number of parties, seeing that both the Tories and Labour should essentially be seen as Brexit parties (if you go by their promises rather than actions) and we can of course ignore UKIP for now.

Should be seen, but are not seen. At least as far as Labour is concerned. According to yougov.

Party%20Brexit%20stance-01.png

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26 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Well exactly, both parties have stood on a promise of delivering on the referendum results, but both seem rather reluctant to do so. 

Which is not related to your original statement.

Your original statement was that Labour and Tories should be regarded as Leave splits. But as yougov showed, that is not the case. A majority of over 40% consider Labour to be a remain party, even the Tories are for some reason considered a remain party by 25% (I can only assume 25% of the sample have been spending the last two years or so in a cave beneath Stoke).

In a normal world, yes, nobody but a tiny minority would consider both major parties as remainers. However, that's not what the figures show. I see what you were trying to do. You wanted to hijack and claim any votes Labour might get as basically leave votes (the same notion that has been propagated after the last GE), which has a very shaky connection (if any) to reality, as a majority still considers Labour to be a remain party (for whatever reason).

The parties which are perceived by majority as Leavers are, UKIP, Brexit, the DUP and the Tories - with the latter that perception is surprisingly split.

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2 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Which is not related to your original statement.

Your original statement was that Labour and Tories should be regarded as Leave splits. But as yougov showed, that is not the case. A majority of over 40% consider Labour to be a remain party, even the Tories are for some reason considered a remain party by 25% (I can only assume 25% of the sample have been spending the last two years or so in a cave beneath Stoke).

In a normal world, yes, nobody but a tiny minority would consider both major parties as remainers. However, that's not what the figures show. I see what you were trying to do. You wanted to hijack and claim any votes Labour might get as basically leave votes (the same notion that has been propagated after the last GE), which has a very shaky connection (if any) to reality, as a majority still considers Labour to be a remain party (for whatever reason).

The parties which are perceived by majority as Leavers are, UKIP, Brexit, the DUP and the Tories - with the latter that perception is surprisingly split.

Well I said if you go by their promises not by their actions. My point was that there is confusion as to who represents what. Both labour and conservatives are not seen as either entirely remain or leave parties. The comment I was answering seemed to assume that the Brexit party was the only party representing Brexit, which clearly isn’t true. ( although it’s popularity is due to it advocating the most strongly for Brexit, where others are more half hearted)

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