Rant and Rave Without Repercussion End of The World Edition [Spoilers]

[longest night]

2 minutes ago, Corika said:

This warging was so pointless.

Bran was so useless this episode, second only to Varys (barely remembered he was even here), and to think many people expected this episode to be Bran's time to shine.

 

Also, I wonder why Arya was chosen to kill the NK. Just imagine the discussion:

"- We have to change Night King killer, because we're different from the book! Who will do it?

- Idk? Arya is good at killing?

- Genius!"

There is no Night King in the book. From everything we can tell, it will have to be won through pure strategic planning. Not a silly concept like taking out the leader gets rid of the entire threat.

[Corika]

1 minute ago, longest night said:

There is no Night King in the book. From everything we can tell, it will have to be won through pure strategic planning. Not a silly concept like taking out the leader gets rid of the entire threat.

Sorry, made quite a bit of reach here.

What I meant is that in the show they use just the easiest and most straightforward options available, like Arya killing because "that's what she does". 

[Corika]

/multipost

 

[WeCameFromNorth]

Thank you to all of you that made me laugh so hard throughout this thread.

You are good men. And women, obviously, especially if you are strong and snarky.

Please don’t hate me to say this in rant thread: there was one thing that I absolutely loved – both sons of Tywin Lannister fighting for Ned Stark’s home and children. That was stuff of my dreams.  

[Cas Stark]

9 minutes ago, Red Dragon10 said:

Yes, I was surprised to hear so many people praising it.  Normally I think GoT has great music, but I didn't like it at all. 

I thought it didn't really fit, there is no thematic parallel to Cersei blowing up the sept so no reason we should be hearing similar music here.

[Ice Queen]

7 minutes ago, longest night said:

There is no Night King in the book. From everything we can tell, it will have to be won through pure strategic planning. Not a silly concept like taking out the leader gets rid of the entire threat.

And humans are going to have to put their differences aside and unite for the common good, or they're all doomed. I doubt Martin will make it so easy for the humans to defeat the Others.

[Red Dragon10]

4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I thought it didn't really fit, there is no thematic parallel to Cersei blowing up the sept so no reason we should be hearing similar music here.

Yeah exactly.  Unless we're missing something here.... ...(I don't think so).  And the original rendition of it sounded much better, IMO. 

[Lord Varys]

10 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

Mel can't have known that Arya was going to kill the NK at that time, why would she have left her to her own devices instead of trying to protect her?  Mel never even mentioned Arya to Jon, did she?

If the show wasn't going to make the prophecy intelligible, then why include it at all?  Why have all the mumbo jumbo by Mel if it's all BS in the end?  It is one thing to have prophesy wrongly interpreted so there is a 'surprise' in how it plays out, it's another to destroy all of it's meaning.

I'm going to guess that maybe Cersei will be able to kill Jon, he's pretty stupid, otherwise, I don't know what they have saved approximately 4 hours of the show for.

Who cares about prophecy? This show never did. In fact, all they like to do is unexpected twists and turns there was no buildup for until 1-2 episodes before it did happen. Even early on, a thing like the Red Wedding did come as a pretty big surprise rather than being something that hangs ominously in the air.

Sometimes George's uses unexpected twists, too, but foreshadowing and prophecies, etc. are an integral part of his story and should thus also have played a role in the show.

But then, honestly, if there truly were a prophecy that the promised prince were to defeat the Others, etc. then there would basically no need for the books or the show considering that you definitely know the outcome then. 

[darmody]

5 hours ago, The Scabbard Of the Morning said:

Forget animation, I'd settle for a well produced audio drama with good sound effects and music.

Tune in next week for Game of Thrones Radio Theater Hour, same dragon time, same dragon channel.

Brought to you by Lucky Strike cigarettes. After a long day training on the bo-staff, Arya Stark appreciates the cool, refreshing drag of pure Virginia tobacco. 

[darmody]

5 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

For me, they ruined the story in this episode.  There is now no purpose to Jon's ancestry in the story, the prophecy, Prince that was promised all that is moot.  Jon Snow hasn't won a battle in years or had a good idea in years, so if he sits the IT, why?  If he dies fighting Cersei, even worse, he's a total loser, might as well have been killed in his crib.  Dany?  All her magic again pointless.  If she wins, its dragons and she did nothing but get her allies killed fighting the NK, if she loses, again, her whole story pointless to lose to a dumb thug like Cersei Lannister.  So, I can't see how the show comes back from this error in how they handled the NK defeat.

To be fair, he brought the Dragon Queen North and got dragonglass to make the weapons. He helped win back Winterfell and warned everyone of the impending doom. 

Then again, the show made him complicit in bringing down the Wall and all those men armed with dragonglass ended up being beside the point. So nevermind. 

[Cas Stark]

Just now, darmody said:

To be fair, he brought the Dragon Queen North and got dragonglass to make the weapons. He helped win back Winterfell and warned everyone of the impending doom. 

Then again, the show made him complicit in bringing down the Wall and all those men armed with dragonglass ended up being beside the point. So nevermind. 

yeah but so what?  dany was useless, all she did was get the dothraki killed, got her dragon killed in the wight hunt, and a bunch of unsullied killed.  none of that was necessary.  it wasn't even dragonglass that was used against the nk, but a valyrian steel dagger.  no one needed to know about the impending doom, it never went south, southerners will never even believe it happened, the whole thing is like a bad joke.  it was littlefinger and the vale army that won back winterfell,  not jon snow, he is equally useless.

[darmody]

5 hours ago, divica said:

I don t even understand how someone can say they are king/queen at this point. Who supports them?

Cersei is suported by a some lannisters, ironborn and mercenaries. Danny and jon are suported by the north, some vale soldiers and some unsulied.

How or why should the 7 kingdoms support any of them? They haven t tried to win them over… Once they seat their ass on the IT all other regions will automatically recognize them? They haven t talked to other regions. There have been no negotiations...

Are people going to sudenly chose danny because she has 2 dragons? Jon because he says he his a targ? Cersei because nobody cares what she does? I don t even understand how is the relationship between jon and danny at this point...

The Starks have blood ties to the Riverlands. Gendry will probably take Baratheonland. Sam owns Tarlyland. Dorne was already on Danny's side. Tyrion and Jaime can take back House Lannister. Yara presumably has the Iron Islands again. 

[Adam_Up_Bxtch]

I have to say this...

Battle scenes and visuals - 10/10
Writing and logic/battle tactics - 1/10

Like i'm so conflicted with this on one hand the battle itself was "visually" amazing, but the writing in this episode was a solid 1/10. 

Sending the dothraki to their death just for the cool shot of all their fires going out in the dark instead of waiting for the wights to come to you? Makes no sense. 

Putting the fire ditch BEHIND your main forces trapping them to their death when you set it off? Makes no sense. 

Shooting the trebuchets before you can even see the wight army? Makes no sense.

You're fighting a necromancer so you put all your defenseless down with a bunch of dead starks. Makes no sense.

So many deus ex machina moments which really killed the stakes for me. So many more characters should of died in this episode besides no names and redshirts.

but none of that comes close to the biggest problem.
The Night King being a one note "Ice Sauron" was a complete and utter disappointment. No "He's a proto-stark who was turned into an ice demon against his will" or that he wanted more than a "Night that never ends." The thing with Game of Thrones and A Song of Ice and Fire is that most of the villains aren't villains just to be villains there is a reason they are the way they are and to see the NK go out without knowing his true intentions is just so disappointing. He was "forced" to become the NK by the children of the forest why would he want to destroy "humanity" you think his main goal would be just kill all the children and that's it mankind did nothing to him. Maybe he was trying to figure out how to reverse the effects so he could become human again? Possibly having to go to the Isle of faces to achieve this so that's why he wants to come south. None of that. Nothing....literally....nothing. 7 Season build up for him to just be a one note villain who dies after one battle. That's just NOT Game of Thrones at all. That's such a fantasy trope and the source material of this story pisses on traditional fantasy. It's such a slap in the face.

Also Arya killing The NK has caused Jon Snow's Resurrection to be completely pointless. Jon didn't even take back Winterfell from the Boltons on his own. Sansa and Baelish did. Jon was completely unnecessary for the end game. At this point he should of just stayed dead. It feels like he was now brought back JUST as fan service and because of R+L=J. This show just **** all over the Prince that was Promised prophecy.

I could go on and on but i'm not going to right now. I for one can see why people didn't like this episode, because D&D don't care about logic anymore since they are past the books they just want "cool scenes" despite what it costs in logical consistency.

[darmody]

2 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

yeah but so what?  dany was useless, all she did was get the dothraki killed, got her dragon killed in the wight hunt, and a bunch of unsullied killed.  none of that was necessary.  it wasn't even dragonglass that was used against the nk, but a valyrian steel dagger.  no one needed to know about the impending doom, it never went south, southerners will never even believe it happened, the whole thing is like a bad joke.  it was littlefinger and the vale army that won back winterfell,  not jon snow

I said Jon helped. Little Finger alone might not have beat Ramsay, but if he did what would Winterfell under the control of Little Finger and the Vale have amounted to? 

[Ice Queen]

3 minutes ago, darmody said:

The Starks have blood ties to the Riverlands. Gendry will probably take Baratheonland. Sam owns Tarlyland. Dorne was already on Danny's side. Tyrion and Jaime can take back House Lannister. Yara presumably has the Iron Islands again. 

And Tormund is King Beyond the Useless Pile of Rubble.

[darmody]

1 hour ago, RhaenysBee said:

The one way the season can redeem itself to me is a dreaded time travel plot  with a Jason Momoa and his triceps cameo (I know I know, just don’t give me crap about it) 

I guess I would be curious to see if they can pull that off. As in make it even worse. I guess. Maybe... 

If Drogo comes back he's gonna be pissed that all his homies made it across the poison water for nothing. 

[darmody]

1 hour ago, Haskelltier said:

Well in my opinion, the "Arya-killing-Night-King" move came totally unexpected. And that only worked so well, because there was no foreshadowing.

I mean, lets be honest, after the whole Azor Ahai, Prince That Was Promised prophecy and the "Jon is A Song of Ice and Fire" stuff, nearly everybody was suspecting, that Jon or Dany would kill the Night King. But no, only in the last minutes I thought, well, the Night King is literally seconds from killing Bran, Jon is playing cat and mouse with Viserion and Dany is a world away, that doesn't fit. Well and then came flying Arya stabbing the Night King. That came unexpected and showed everybody that the whole prophecy stuff was/is completely meaningless (on a second thought, that shouldn't suprise anybody, because prophecies seldom become true).

They could have done something unexpected by making it so that Jon had to kill Danny or vice-versa in order to kill the Night King. 

Anything, besides Flying Squirrel Arya. 

[darmody]

1 hour ago, DebL66 said:

Last episode felt very Helms Deep, in this episode we get the Battle of the Pelletier Fields complete with Eowyn killing the Witch King of Angmar.  I know they call GRRM the American Tolkien I just didn’t think that was quite so literal.

i have so much grousing to do but I’ll keep it to this:  that’s it with the Night King story?  No motive other than he’s just evil and no explanation for his swirly dead body art?  Melisandre has lived hundreds of years so the Lord of Light could have her light a trench on fire?  And after battling the supposed biggest menace in Planetos, we have to go back to “This week on Carol and Euron”?  I just can’t.  This series has been a disappointment since season 3 yet I gamely followed along hoping to at least get a resolution to the story and all they give me is Lost 2.0.  I honestly tuned out for most of the battle because I really couldn’t tell who was living or dying and it was 60 minutes of clang clang fire scream cold weather front.   I will watch until the end just to see how much more they can disappoint me.  GRRM, you should have been the one to tell your story.  

Most other battles on this show end with Gandalf the White riding to the rescue:

Blackwater - Tywin/Tyrells

The Wall - Stannis 

Battle of the Bastards - Sweet Robin of the Moon Door

This episode I didn't think had room for such a thing. Unless the Glovers and Howland Reed suddenly showed up. But Arya is an Army of One. She did the whole Last Second Rescue by herself.

Oh, and the Red Witch. Who traveled to the East and back for...reasons, showed up out of nowhere, and reminded us all of that one scene where she looked in Arya's eyes once. Because that was super meaningful. 

[darmody]

1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

Mel can't have known that Arya was going to kill the NK at that time, why would she have left her to her own devices instead of trying to protect her?  Mel never even mentioned Arya to Jon, did she?

If the show wasn't going to make the prophecy intelligible, then why include it at all?  Why have all the mumbo jumbo by Mel if it's all BS in the end?  It is one thing to have prophesy wrongly interpreted so there is a 'surprise' in how it plays out, it's another to destroy all of it's meaning.

I'm going to guess that maybe Cersei will be able to kill Jon, he's pretty stupid, otherwise, I don't know what they have saved approximately 4 hours of the show for.

Does Cersei have the mental capacity of Ollie? Because that kid successfully killed Jon Snow. It has been done. 

[Lord Varys]

14 minutes ago, darmody said:

They could have done something unexpected by making it so that Jon had to kill Danny or vice-versa in order to kill the Night King. 

Anything, besides Flying Squirrel Arya. 

That idea would be a lot worse, actually, because there is no reason whatsoever that two people killing each other/either of them is going to kill a third person.