Rant and Rave Without Repercussion End of The World Edition [Spoilers]

[sweetsunray]

1 minute ago, divica said:

Even if that sounds cool it makes no sense.

It is like they are saying that they don t agree with how GOT was written and want to start again...

Euhm, yeah, basically.

[divica]

Just now, sweetsunray said:

Euhm, yeah, basically.

I always thought the idea was to give us a detailed view of how the GOT origin for the ww came to happen and then the first long night.

[sweetsunray]

Just now, divica said:

I always thought the idea was to give us a detailed view of how the GOT origin for the ww came to happen and then the first long night.

Read the amassed wiki information about it. I gave you the link for it. Not just the pitch... the whole thing.

[ummester]

2 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Based on George's words about it, and his insistence of there being "no dragons" and no KL, no IT, a different older society altogether, and he remains mum about any of the other pitched prequels, I get the impression he wants a project where there is less political machinations and more magic (without dragons stealing the show and pushing everything else from view).

Sure but AsoIaF/GoTs is still the centerpiece right? All of the history and backstory and magical society's of old exist, in a narrative sense, to feed into the main tale which is that being told in ASoIaF.

I get writers garden as they write - I am writing again now myself after many years of hiatus and know that plans change as characters come to life - but for a fantastic universe to ring true it needs logical consistency. The rules must be established, they cannot be plotted as the saga unfolds, when parts are already published - because otherwise you end up with logical inconsistencies from act to act. From what you say above, it sounds like GRRM wants a mini reboot in his own universe.

[sweetsunray]

1 minute ago, ummester said:

Sure but AsoIaF/GoTs is still the centerpiece right? All of the history and backstory and magical society's of old exist, in a narrative sense, to feed into the main tale which is that being told in ASoIaF.

I get writers garden as they write - I am writing again now myself after many years of hiatus and know that plans change as characters come to life - but for a fantastic universe to ring true it needs logical consistency. The rules must be established, they cannot be plotted as the saga unfolds, when parts are already published - because otherwise you end up with logical inconsistencies from act to act. From what you say above, it sounds like GRRM wants a mini reboot in his own universe.

It certainly does come across as a mini-reboot to me, yes. The Long Night can end though with a 2nd generation being created, the NK, just to fit with GOT, or the suggestion of it. There was after all a historical Night's King

[The Fattest Leech]

3 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Thank you for sharing that. I assume that 'ending' he told them five or six years ago was presumably the fabled trip the D's took to New Mexico? And the 'fixed final point' sounds more like the last scenes we might get in the show, and by that I speculate that it will be the ending-ending.

But what about the ending? 

It has always been accepted that Martin’s ending for the books will also be the fixed final point for the show, however, it diverges along the way.

Martin added: “I mean, I think … the major points of the ending will be things that I told them, you know, five or six years ago. But there may also be changes, and there’ll be a lot added.”

Found the follow up to Santa Fe I was thinking about earlier. I am sure this has been passed around a bit already, so why not again:

Q:To what degree do you feel it needs to be perfectly congruent with the vision of the endgame of the novels that Martin presented to you?

BENIOFF: It’s already too late for that. We’re already well past the point of it jibing 100 percent. We’ve passed George and that’s something that George always worried about — the show catching up and ultimately passing him — but the good thing about us diverging at this point is that George’s books will still be a surprise for readers who have seen the show. Certain things that we learned from George way back in that meeting in Santa Fe are going to happen on the show, but certain things won’t. And there’s certain things where George didn’t know what was going to happen, so we’re going to find them out for the first time too, along with millions of readers when we read those books. Some people wish we would wait until the books were finished to finish the show, but George works on his own schedule, which is the way any good writer should do it. He shouldn’t be beholden to a TV schedule to finish his novels, that would be completely artificial and would not serve him well. But we do have these actors and they’re getting older, and we have to finish.

http://time.com/4791793/game-of-thrones-season-7-david-benioff-d-b-weiss/

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

The episode's IMDB rating has now dropped to 8.7, which is really low considering the episode had thousands of 10/10 before anyone had even seen it, and it was also the most hyped episode in the history of the show.  I am sure that the rating will continue dropping, and I'm also sure the next three episodes will have an even worse rating.  

This has been such a disaster for Dumb and Dumber, and what's worse is that they didn't expect it at all.  I mean, they had scheduled their tv appearance on a late night talk show for this week, and also sent the show's stars to make similar appearances, believing that this was their masterpiece.  Instead everyone has been pointing out the enormous plotholes, and the fact that they have deviated so much from what the story once was.

[darmody]

3 hours ago, divica said:

Ignoring everything else. Would be able to see a series about the first long night knowing that all people have to do to stop it is to stab the NK? Like do you want to see them build a big undeafeatable terrifying guy that can be killed with a stab from a relatively rare weapon? And this is if it needed to be valyrian steel and dragonglass wouldn t be enough...

I dunno, because they wouldn't be working under the same burdens as Game of Thrones, which had three main storylines to reconcile (the Stark-Lannister conflict, the Rise of Danny, and the Adventures of Know-Nothing in the Chilly North). I don't know how they beat the White Walkers first time 'round, but we know it wasn't permanent so it doesn't have to be as dramatic. 

A show about the founding of the Night's Watch from a gang of intrepid fighters hacking it out in the Northern wilderness I could watch. But if they do it like they did the Hobbit movies, where a nice little adventure story had to carry the dramatic weight of subsequent serious epic novels, no. That's too much baggage. 

That being said, I don't care if I never see a zombie again at this point. I'd rather it be Robert's Rebellion or Aegon's Conquest. 

[darmody]

3 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

But it wouldn’t be anything that stupid like that... that’s the point. Read the pitch again: “the true origin of the WWs”, “it’s not the story we think we know”. 

The problem is more to do w/ GoT ending really badly. 

That's advertisement-speak, intended to tease you. But it doesn't necessarily mean anything. 

[BlackLightning]

1 minute ago, darmody said:

That being said, I don't care if I never see a zombie again at this point. I'd rather it be Robert's Rebellion or Aegon's Conquest. 

I'd rather see the Dance of Dragons before Robert's Rebellion and Aegon's Conquest.

29 minutes ago, bloodsteel bitterraven said:

The episode's IMDB rating has now dropped to 8.7, which is really low considering the episode had thousands of 10/10 before anyone had even seen it, and it was also the most hyped episode in the history of the show.  I am sure that the rating will continue dropping, and I'm also sure the next three episodes will have an even worse rating.  

This has been such a disaster for Dumb and Dumber, and what's worse is that they didn't expect it at all.  I mean, they had scheduled their tv appearance on a late night talk show for this week, and also sent the show's stars to make similar appearances, believing that this was their masterpiece.  Instead everyone has been pointing out the enormous plotholes, and the fact that they have deviated so much from what the story once was.

Well, what did they expect?

I'm glad people are catching on. The cracks were starting to show big time in season 5 but they were able to coast on cruise control through season 6. But season 7? Yikes

[darmody]

36 minutes ago, bloodsteel bitterraven said:

The episode's IMDB rating has now dropped to 8.7, which is really low considering the episode had thousands of 10/10 before anyone had even seen it, and it was also the most hyped episode in the history of the show.  I am sure that the rating will continue dropping, and I'm also sure the next three episodes will have an even worse rating.  

This has been such a disaster for Dumb and Dumber, and what's worse is that they didn't expect it at all.  I mean, they had scheduled their tv appearance on a late night talk show for this week, and also sent the show's stars to make similar appearances, believing that this was their masterpiece.  Instead everyone has been pointing out the enormous plotholes, and the fact that they have deviated so much from what the story once was.

Maybe if everything about the episode was the same but they made it so that you could actually SEE IT?

[theladyinspring]

13 hours ago, Dragons Are Real said:

I have HBO Now.  1st and Ten hasn't ever been there.  Unless they just added it in the last month or so.  I usually check about every three months.

I don't know if this will be useful to you or if you already know this, but 1st and Ten is on Amazon free to anyone with Amazon Prime.

[Ygrain]

14 hours ago, Bear42 said:

Now that I've had some time to digest it I've realized what bothered me so much about the NK death.  He was built up to be some relentless, unstoppable, mythical threat and his great downfall was a cheap trick. 

Well, there is a reason people say that he was "snoked"  

14 hours ago, divica said:

Can you really find a reason for jon to want the IT for himself?

If Dany goes all Aerys, he might see it as his duty to depose her. But writing something like that would require balls that D and D simply don't have.

[divica]

2 hours ago, Ygrain said:

If Dany goes all Aerys, he might see it as his duty to depose her. But writing something like that would require balls that D and D simply don't have.

And do you think it makes sense for her to go completly aerys in 2 eps? That she will become so evil that jon won t be able to calm her down and will have to kill her or go to war with her?

It sounds too forced to happen in so little time.

[Ygrain]

27 minutes ago, divica said:

And do you think it makes sense for her to go completly aerys in 2 eps? That she will become so evil that jon won t be able to calm her down and will have to kill her or go to war with her?

It sounds too forced to happen in so little time.

You asked for a reason, not if it could be done properly ;-)

Though I might argue that the setup is already there, what with Dany burning the Tarlys (and not bothering to express proper remorse when telling Sam), being disliked and distrusted by Sansa and generally expressing an outright aloof and bitchy attitude that is pretty much getting on my tits. And if she continues the "burn if you don't kneel" line, I can imagine Jon having a serious falling out, perhaps even before witnesses, which might quickly send things downhill. 

But as I have said before, getting Jon and Dany at each other's throat and perhaps killing off one or the other or both, is something I don't see the show writers doing as they lack both the creativity and boldness, as well. 

[Elayis]

I'm sure this has already been mentioned, but where the hell was Arya jumping from? The angle was entirely wrong for her to be leaping from the weirwood tree.

[Amaretto]

Can Arya shapeshift into a bird if she takes their face? Maybe that's what Bran was doing- leading a raven to Arya.

[Gianna Dorenberg]

1 hour ago, Elayis said:

I'm sure this has already been mentioned, but where the hell was Arya jumping from? The angle was entirely wrong for her to be leaping from the weirwood tree.

In the behind the scenes she jumps from a trampoline, like 15-20 feet away at least, on wires. So in the episode, she is just jumping from the ground, fly in the air, leap for at least 15-20 feet (which isn't humanly possible lol).  So yeah, she jumped out of thin air.

[Einheri]

Wolverine is pretty much an anime character at this point.

[Zorral]

15 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

I thought this was more interesting:

“Now, when you get involved in television and film, um… you’re working with a large team. But it can also be… traumatic. Because sometimes their creative vision and your creative vision don’t match, and you get the famous creative differences thing — that leads to a lot of conflict.”

He also told Rolling Stone: “Of course you have an emotional reaction. I mean, would I prefer they do it exactly the way I did it? Sure.”

How can GRRM say this? In an article that leads with a photo of him at the NYC Radio City premiere of the first episode of season 8?  He was there in the theater, watching, as many a NY writer about these matters, who were also present, saw.

Quote

Asked if he had seen any of Season 8 he replied: “No, I haven’t. I haven’t … I mean I know some of what’s going on there, but I haven’t actually seen any footage. So I’ll be seeing that for the first time with everybody else. I haven’t read the scripts, although I’ve had meetings with (showrunners) David (Benioff) and Dan (Weiss) where we’ve discussed stuff.”

Looks like now he's backpeddling as much as the showrunners.