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neutralbhad

Just calling it now about Dany's and Jon's army

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I don't think it's clear how much of the army got obliterated. The Dothraki, sure, but the Unsullied were retreating column by column for a while before Grey Worm had to close the barrier, and we do see some of them marching around in the trailer for the next episode. Then there's the Free Folk and the North, and I'm sure between all of them put together they can still raise a formidable force.

I think the problem is more thematic than literal. When it comes to grand battles, the show just gave its all. The battle was epic and the most dangerous baddie in the show has been killed. Another big battle episode will feel really anticlimactic after this.

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38 minutes ago, Anthony Pirtle said:

I don't think it's clear how much of the army got obliterated. The Dothraki, sure, but the Unsullied were retreating column by column for a while before Grey Worm had to close the barrier, and we do see some of them marching around in the trailer for the next episode. Then there's the Free Folk and the North, and I'm sure between all of them put together they can still raise a formidable force.

I think the problem is more thematic than literal. When it comes to grand battles, the show just gave its all. The battle was epic and the most dangerous baddie in the show has been killed. Another big battle episode will feel really anticlimactic after this.

I am sure they have put a lot of thought into making sure it feels very different. I am not worried.

I also think people are underestimating how much story there is left to play out. Blood magic has not been confronted. Now Westeros has a dragon problem in that when there is no Night King to fight noone wants dragons around.

The army is seriously diminished there is no doubt. But Dany is relying on her dragons to defeat Cersei much more than her army.

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If Jon  and Daenerys still have an army to raise this “Great war” had truly no impact on anything at all.

Barely any named characters died and now you’re telling me even the army survived? There should be like 200 people left alive. Everybody was being slaughtered outside of, inside and under Winterfell when our fanfavorite badass female character teleported into the godswood and stabbed the mother ship. 

Whatever they conjure an army out of will take that one last microgram of sense episode 3 had the potential to have. 

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4 hours ago, RhaenysBee said:

If Jon  and Daenerys still have an army to raise this “Great war” had truly no impact on anything at all.

Well, it did unite Dany and the North, and it finally convinced Jaime to leave Cersei. So it did have some impact. Just not the impact I think a lot of people expected or hoped it to have.

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7 hours ago, neutralbhad said:

Despite episode three showing their army get oblitarated, next episode they will magically have enough soldiers to fight Cersei.

Exactly this. We saw the Dothraki obliterated. The Unsullied mostly stayed outside the walls and were decimated. The undead completely poured through the open gate appearing to kill most everyone who wasn't a named character, so that would include the Wildlings, the Vale soldiers, the northern soldiers and the remaining Ironborn. They didn't just breach the gate either. They took over the walls, were inside all the rooms of the castle. Hell, they were even in the crypts. Jon was running around in the final shots against the wight dragon with no other humans around. Even after it was all over, they showed maybe 5 or 10 humans standing.

Yet I guarantee Dany will have some large army when she marches towards King's Landing showing the Great War was completely meaningless. When you can generate soldiers like a real-time strategy game as this show has done countless times, battles and lost soldiers have no bearing on things.

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They might try to make alliances with some of the other realms, which they could get soldiers from. The Riverlands are no longer in Frey hands, so Edmure Tully could take back Riverrun, and he's certainly no friend to the Lannisters. Send Gendry and Arya down to the Stormlands, and try to raise troops there. There are probably those in the Reach, too, who would be happy to fight against the Lannisters. 

Plus, she does have some Unsullied and Dothraki left, along with whoever is left from the North and from the Vale (and they Vale could probably recruit more troops). 

I believe that Tobias Menzies (Edmure) and the kid that plays Robin Arryn are in one or more of the next 3 episodes, so this may be how they go. 

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Posted (edited)

We know some northern houses didn't join them (like House Glover) and now they saved the North, the North will see them as saviors and they will fight for them, as well as the Vale.

Let's say they lost 3/4 of their army.... 

Faceless man worths as much as a Dragon, Arya saved the day while not even Dragons could. And she single handedly assassinated House Frey before that.

Having + 10.000 men wouldn't help against 2 Dragons + Faceless man.

They also have Bran who can exploit any trickster such as Littlefinger.

Edited by Erkan12

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1 hour ago, Erkan12 said:

We know some northern houses didn't join them (like House Glover) and now they saved the North, the North will see them as saviors and they will fight for them, as well as the Vale.

Let's say they lost 3/4 of their army.... 

Faceless man worths as much as a Dragon, Arya saved the day while not even Dragons could. And she single handedly assassinated House Frey before that.

Having + 10.000 men wouldn't help against 2 Dragons + Faceless man.

They also have Bran who can exploit any trickster such as Littlefinger.

A faceless man is no match against an army. They're an assassin, not a soldier. Of course they can use her to kill Cersei and the whole battle will be over before it starts.

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1 minute ago, Bran Snow said:

A faceless man is no match against an army. They're an assassin, not a soldier. Of course they can use her to kill Cersei and the whole battle will be over before it starts.

That's what I said. Arya can assassinate Cersei and Euron, and game over.

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House Glover is no more. They stayed home and were wiped out. If they miraculously showed up at WF and said ”Hi guys. We’re here ‘cause the NK was nice enough to march on by without harming us...” I think that would pretty much sew up any shred of credibility and suspension of disbelief - which is already stretched to the breaking point - I could spare for this show...

Here’s the upshot for me though when it comes to this story - book or show - I don't really care about the whole Night King/WW plot line so I’m willing to look askance at what they’ve done. To call the way they sewed up this aspect of the story anticlimactic is a serious understatement. But again, I don’t care because for me the real story has always been about the Starks and the North, the politics of Westeros, and resolution to the IT problem. Everything else is just window dressing and wouldn’t have held my interest on its own...

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1 hour ago, Green Knight said:

House Glover is no more. They stayed home and were wiped out. If they miraculously showed up at WF and said ”Hi guys. We’re here ‘cause the NK was nice enough to march on by without harming us...” I think that would pretty much sew up any shred of credibility and suspension of disbelief - which is already stretched to the breaking point - I could spare for this show...

Here’s the upshot for me though when it comes to this story - book or show - I don't really care about the whole Night King/WW plot line so I’m willing to look askance at what they’ve done. To call the way they sewed up this aspect of the story anticlimactic is a serious understatement. But again, I don’t care because for me the real story has always been about the Starks and the North, the politics of Westeros, and resolution to the IT problem. Everything else is just window dressing and wouldn’t have held my interest on its own...

Deepwood Mott is not on the way to Winterfell from the wall at all. I'd say it's fairly reasonable to assume that they survived fine. 

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5 hours ago, Anthony Pirtle said:

Well, it did unite Dany and the North, and it finally convinced Jaime to leave Cersei. So it did have some impact. Just not the impact I think a lot of people expected or hoped it to have.

Did it really? Sansa’s What happens next line of questions suggests otherwise

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Posted (edited)

We got sprawling shots of Jon wading through the Winterfell courtyard, seeing nothing but dead bodies and named character. Arya had a whole stealth section inside Winterfell because a lot of the wights moved into Winterfell and run out of things to kill. You're telling me tens of thousands of fighters were present in the last episode that survived?

Edited by Denam_Pavel

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33 minutes ago, justanotherposter said:

Deepwood Mott is not on the way to Winterfell from the wall at all. I'd say it's fairly reasonable to assume that they survived fine. 

Sansa told Glover to stay home and or retreat south. She did the same with Royce. It’s she will have enough soldiers to be a player. 

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4 hours ago, anjulibai said:

They might try to make alliances with some of the other realms, which they could get soldiers from. The Riverlands are no longer in Frey hands, so Edmure Tully could take back Riverrun, and he's certainly no friend to the Lannisters. Send Gendry and Arya down to the Stormlands, and try to raise troops there. There are probably those in the Reach, too, who would be happy to fight against the Lannisters. 

Plus, she does have some Unsullied and Dothraki left, along with whoever is left from the North and from the Vale (and they Vale could probably recruit more troops). 

I believe that Tobias Menzies (Edmure) and the kid that plays Robin Arryn are in one or more of the next 3 episodes, so this may be how they go. 

I think we also get to (finally) see Howland Reed and Meera as the Crannogmen join the cause.  

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37 minutes ago, justanotherposter said:

Deepwood Mott is not on the way to Winterfell from the wall at all. I'd say it's fairly reasonable to assume that they survived fine. 

That’s a good point, I hadn’t thought of that. In that case I’m looking forward to Jon putting his sword up Lord Glover’s arse once and for all. Probably won’t happen though...

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Deepwood Mott isn't on the way to Winterfell directly, but I kind of figured that everyone still north of Winterfell when Edd and Tormund showed up was dead. I mean, why would the Night King just leave a few spots of living people around him as he continues south? Wouldn't be hard to just send another White Walker and couple thousand wights to clean these places out before getting to Winterfell. 

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

Deepwood Mott isn't on the way to Winterfell directly, but I kind of figured that everyone still north of Winterfell when Edd and Tormund showed up was dead. I mean, why would the Night King just leave a few spots of living people around him as he continues south? Wouldn't be hard to just send another White Walker and couple thousand wights to clean these places out before getting to Winterfell. 

 

My line of thinking as well but they could go the other way with it too. I guess it’ll just be whatever they decide is necessary for the plot to continue the way the want it to - which seems to be the way they do things...

Edited by Green Knight

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