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Is Tyrion going to die in this episode?


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5 hours ago, Anthony Pirtle said:

I'll give you 100/1 odds against. 

It is actually quite possible, so long as he has some important conversations and dreams up some important strategies first. Think about it; what would his death do to advance the plot? Many things I think.

1. The effect on Jaime would be profound. For now he is just in the North to fight for the living and keep his word. But Tyrion's death might convince him to actually pledge his sword to someone there. This has big endgame consequences.

2. Dany would lose the second of only two advisors capable of and trying to restrain her worst impulses, just before she plans to attack KL.

I think the loss of Tyrion could have interesting effects on the story that make it a real possibility.

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9 minutes ago, Gianna Dorenberg said:

Not even Podrick died in episode 3. You really think they're going to kill of Tyrion in ep 4 ?

If anything major happens in terms of death, has to happen ep 5 or 6. Talk about predictable.

Virtually no major character dies in a battle. Stannis getting killed after the Boltons rout his forces at Stannisgrad is about the only one (until Jorah)

Ygrette during the attack on Castle Black and some Sand Snakes during the Iron Born civil war are about as big as it gets otherwise. 

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I have my doubts about Bronn going through with Cersei's request to kill Jaime and Tyrion. I think he accepted her offer because refusing her while he was still within her reach would be stupid and put himself in danger. I think it is more likely that Bronn will tell Tyrion and Jaime what he was sent to do and this will be the final push for both of them to start actively wanting to kill Cersei/have her killed. Up to this point neither of them seem to have actively wished her dead or worked to make this happen. They might not have liked her, but Tyrion still felt familial ties to his siblings and Jaime of course still has twisted love/hate feelings for her. This revelation might change that.

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27 minutes ago, MinscS2 said:

I doubt anyone of importance is dying in episode 4.

This will be an aftermath/planning/talking about stuff-episode. 

I think you are forgetting that Dany now knows that AeJon says he has a claim. The fractures were real between her and the Northerners even before, but if she denies his claim she will lose them completely, and if she accepts it fully she is no longer queen. She needs to DO something with and about the news and it may not be pretty. It may also lead to betrayals from characters such as Tyrion.

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14 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

I think you are forgetting that Dany now knows that AeJon says he has a claim. The fractures were real between her and the Northerners even before, but if she denies his claim she will lose them completely, and if she accepts it fully she is no longer queen. She needs to DO something with and about the news and it may not be pretty. It may also lead to betrayals from characters such as Tyrion.

I'm not forgetting, I just doubt it will cause more tension. The show already milked the fake-drama in E1 and E2.

To quote myself from a different thread:
 

Quote

[...]
Sam telling Jon in E1 and Jon telling Daenerys in E2 has, for all intents and purposes, been more or less pointless thus far.
Why Bran decided that "it was time to tell Jon" in E1 is anyone's guess.

The only thing I can think of is that the fact that Jon and Daenerys both got to know before the battle will make them realize that how little it matters between them, due to both having plenty of near-death experiences in the latest episode.
(They both knew, yet they both seemingly still cared about each other and fought on as allies, which means that whatever feelings they had on the matter, where not strong enough to cloud their judgement during the battle. Daenerys never showed a hint of wanting to off Jon at an opportune moment, and Jon not only showed a hint of worry for Daenerys safety early on ("Dany!?") but was also clear minded enough to still focus on Bran even with Daenerys being in danger, etc.)

This way it potentially causes less drama the next episode when they (hopefully) bring it up again, than it otherwise would've had if they hadn't been "distracted". 

 


The matter will be resolved, either by marriage, or by either of them stepping down (well, or getting killed.). Especially Jon pushing his claim would be slightly out of character, especially since he's already pledged himself to her. The revelation of his parentage doesn't technically undo this pledge. There's a reason why Ned wanted Jon to join the Nightswatch. 

Regardless, there's no time for some additional intricate twist at this point.
There's 3 episodes left, and Cersei is already the mad queen, she's the last villain, just as Saruman was in the LotR (books).

 

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2 minutes ago, MinscS2 said:

I'm not forgetting, I just doubt it will cause more tension. The show already milked the fake-drama in E1 and E2.
To quote myself from a different thread:
The matter will be resolved, either by marriage, or by either of them stepping down (well, or getting killed.)
There's no time for some additional intricate twist at this point. There's 3 episodes left, and Cersei is already the mad queen, she's the last villain, just as Saruman was in the LotR (books).

 

This series is not LotR. It is as much a critique of that series as a tribute.

The last few episodes are not just about Cersei the villain. That is not and has never been what this series is building towards. Yes, she needs to be defeated but the real problem is power and how it is used. 

I do not know if Tyrion will die, but I do know that the question of how Dany deals with the news about Jon is not pointless because it touches the heart of the series questions about approriate use of power.

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5 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

This series is not LotR. It is as much a critique of that series as a tribute.

I didn't say it was, but it's heavily influenced by it. And Cersei = Saruman being defeated after the main antagonist NK = Sauron is not just a tribute as a direct copy-paste. 

5 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

The last few episodes are not just about Cersei the villain. That is not and has never been what this series is building towards. Yes, she needs to be defeated but the real problem is power and how it is used. 

No they're not "just" about her, but she's the primary target at this point. 
Normally she'd be a pushover, but post-Battle of Winterfell, she's actually a threat again.

Again this is influenced by LotR where Saruman would be a pushover after dealing with Sauron, but since the hobbits have to deal with him on their own, he becomes a real threat all of a sudden.

5 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

I do not know if Tyrion will die, but I do know that the question of how Dany deals with the news about Jon is not pointless because it touches the heart of the series questions about approriate use of power.

We'll find out next episode I reckon. 

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43 minutes ago, a girl knows nothing said:

I have my doubts about Bronn going through with Cersei's request to kill Jaime and Tyrion. I think he accepted her offer because refusing her while he was still within her reach would be stupid and put himself in danger. I think it is more likely that Bronn will tell Tyrion and Jaime what he was sent to do and this will be the final push for both of them to start actively wanting to kill Cersei/have her killed. Up to this point neither of them seem to have actively wished her dead or worked to make this happen. They might not have liked her, but Tyrion still felt familial ties to his siblings and Jaime of course still has twisted love/hate feelings for her. This revelation might change that.

Totally agree.

Bronn's genuine care & regard for both Tyrion and Jaimie is similar to the genuine care and regard that the Hound developed for Arya.... that brotherly friendship he has towards them is gonna trump any fee from Cersei. He's not an entirely dishonourable man.... Sure, he'll be like a cockroach surviving everything to come... but he's loyal to the boys... and managed to keep that loyalty to both, even when the brothers hated each other.

I'm just curious who that Crossbow is gonna end up killing... or inflicting a serious wound on... because its a weapon loaded with history, and chosen by Cersei for it's meaningfulness.

It was Joffrey's gift on his name day... used to commit patricide against Tywin... maybe a dart from it will hit Cersei in the stomach, putting an end to her is-she-or-isn't-she-pregnancy, before she crawls her way towards the stocks of wildfire with a match, and Jaimie has to throttle her as per the Valonqar prediction?
 

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46 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

I think you are forgetting that Dany now knows that AeJon says he has a claim. The fractures were real between her and the Northerners even before, but if she denies his claim she will lose them completely, and if she accepts it fully she is no longer queen. She needs to DO something with and about the news and it may not be pretty. It may also lead to betrayals from characters such as Tyrion.

That becomes of little importance if they stay together as a couple. they are King and Queen either way, and which of them really makes which decision becomes about their personal relationship, not which is the Monarch and which is Consort.

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1 minute ago, Larger than Average Finger said:

That becomes of little importance if they stay together as a couple. they are King and Queen either way, and which of them really makes which decision becomes about their personal relationship, not which is the Monarch and which is Consort.

Yes well we will see if that is a solution that works for either of them. I am not sure I see that resolving Northern fractures, particularly give the very different priorities and ruling style of Jon and Dany.

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1 minute ago, Hippocras said:

Yes well we will see if that is a solution that works for either of them. I am not sure I see that resolving Northern fractures, particularly give the very different priorities and ruling style of Jon and Dany.

Correct, it surely can't resolve the fractures when the throne would pass to another Targaryan after Jon's death, not a Stark... its just the same old/same old, which is what the North is sick of. A Jon/Dany mutual rule would only be a temporary bandaid on the North's discontent with being ruled from Kings Landing.
 

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9 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

Yes well we will see if that is a solution that works for either of them. I am not sure I see that resolving Northern fractures, particularly give the very different priorities and ruling style of Jon and Dany.

Huh? If anything their ruling style (leading from the front and actively fighting for your own people and wanting to help people: "helping people from a position of strength, sometimes strength is terrible", etc) are very similar, it's one of the reasons why they started liking each other in S7. 

As for priorities, that has up to this point been different, but a shift in priorities is easier to do than a shift in ruling style (which essentially boils down to ones personality.)

As for northern independence, am I the only one who feels that this feels super-forced?
(Especially Sansas borderline possession with it? Where did that come from anyway?)

The North is by far the most independent out of the 7K already.
Southerners rarely come there and they don't like it there, and the northerners don't really welcome them with open arms.
So far their war for independence has only caused death and turmoil for themselves.
Why is being a part of the 7K so horrible for them? What would they gain from breaking loose? Lower taxes?

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2 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

Yes well we will see if that is a solution that works for either of them. I am not sure I see that resolving Northern fractures, particularly give the very different priorities and ruling style of Jon and Dany.

I fully suspect that the way Westros is governed will look so different by the end, that questions about claims are likely moot anyways.

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19 minutes ago, MinscS2 said:

Why is being a part of the 7K so horrible for them? What would they gain from breaking loose? Lower taxes?

A quick review of independence struggles in Northern Ireland, the Basque Country while ongoing independence movements in Catalonia, Scotland, Corsica etc suggest that people are willing to fight and die for independence even modern, relatively well off democracies. 

People who feel ethnically and religiously different to the rest of the lands, are often motivated by more than "low taxes" in their struggles. (See the past couple of hundred years of Balkan history for many, many examples).

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