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What was your personal GoT breaking point?

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There are quite a few rant and ravers here, and I’ve always been curious what moment/storyline set them down that path.

For me as an Unsullied (I didn’t read the books until after season 6), I didn’t actively start to dislike the show until Sansa’s Winterfell arc in season 5. It felt like a complete reversal of the progress she had made since leaving King’s Landing. To go immediately from talking smack to Myranda to then being raped by Ramsay was just awful writing. Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken was the straw the broke the camel’s back, even if I didn’t realize it yet. I didn’t hate the show at that point, but it was the first time that watching GoT became a chore instead of a pleasure. It wasn’t until season 6 (specifically how they handled Jon’s death) that I became a full blown hate-watcher.

Sansa’s rape seems to be one of the points of no return for a lot of viewers (even sites like The Mary Sue refused to cover the show after that), but it wasn’t the only one. Dorne was a problem for a lot of people, but for some reason gets handwaved away as being a rare misstep. Beyond the Wall was the first time the show received a tidal wave of pushback, with sites like Forbes, Wired, Vulture and Vanity Fair being particularly critical. The Long Night seems to have been the last straw for a considerable amount of people, but then undermining the central threat of the entire series will do that for you.

I’m also curious how this will break down between Unsullied and book readers. Looking back after finally reading the books, the cracks were always present. Sympathetic Cersei, Saint Tyrion, Talisa.

So what was the moment that made you realize GoT was only tits and dragons?

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For me it was Shae's death. After working very hard to make her a very different and much more compelling character, they forced book-Shae's death on her and it made no sense whatsoever. There may have been questionable moments before, but this one felt jarring.

Her jumping for a knife and the fact that they fought without either of them trying to say anything at all only made it worse. It was like they acknowledged how out of character the moment was, how either of them uttering a single word or showing the slightest bit of emotion towards the other would have made the outcome feel even more absurd, but they wanted it to happen, so they turned their characters into puppets and made them act it out like pantomime.

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2 minutes ago, The Coconut God said:

For me it was Shae's death. After working very hard to make her a very different and much more compelling character, they forced book-Shae's death on her and it made no sense whatsoever. There may have been questionable moments before, but this one felt jarring.

Her jumping for a knife and the fact that they fought without either of them trying to say anything at all only made it worse. It was like they acknowledged how out of character the moment was, how either of them uttering a single word or showing the slightest bit of emotion towards the other would have made the outcome feel even more absurd, but they wanted it to happen, so they turned their characters into puppets and made them act it out like pantomime.

Even as a show-only viewer at that point her death felt wrong to me. Her testimony where she painted the worst possible picture of Tyrion and Sansa which sentenced them to death, after claiming she would "die to protect that girl" came out of nowhere. On top of that, sleeping with Tywin and calling him my lion ruined any sympathy I had for the character. 

Not to mention the absence of Tysha completely ruined Tyrion from that point forward.

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I started ranting about season 3 and "Talisa" the feminist nurse, the lack of Northern lords and how Robb and Cat's story seemed to have been diminished, but the show was still very good at that point, and very good still in season 4, despite that it had some very stupid plot lapses in that season, but many high points.

Season 5, between Stannis and his burning his daughter when he's in walking distance of Winterfell, LOL, the crazy blue/black filters they started using, and Sansa's marriage to Ramsay which rendered Sansa, Roose, the Vale, and Littlefinger all mentally challenged was when I mostly gave up that the show would ever care about plot again, and ever be good at plot continuinty without Martin's books.  And it's been downhill since then.

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I think things really started to go down hill starting with Season 7. 

 

My patience was slowly being eroded away until it finally went when Arya shapeshifted into Walder Frey for days on end and that whole nonsense with the pies. Trying to think about how she could logically have pulled that off- from being a convincing Walder for that long to suddenly being an expert in butchery and cooking pies without tipping any of the servants off...just no. Also she overheard that her Uncle was being kept locked in the Frey dungeon and apparently just left him there. The whole thing was just rushed and made no logical sense at all. 

 

Also the fact that Cersei suffered absolutely no consequences for blowing up the sept and that anybody ever considered her a "threat" when she realistically controls nothing outside of King's Landing (the entire population of which should loathe her with a passion).

 

It's not even worth thinking about that nonsense with Littlefinger last season either. 

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Sansa's marriage to Ramsey…

Jaime and Bron's vacation in Dorne…

Stannis's fate… with Brienne popping up in the battlefield… 

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Posted (edited)

Season 5 mostly, the first few episodes were leaked and what I saw it felt kinda bad:

Mance's execution, Barristan's Death it already seemed like they were cutting corners, but there always exists hope and expectation built on the material of the previous seasons, later  Dorne, Winterfell story-line including Sansa and Stannis were awful and worst parts of that season.

I still had hopes that with supposedly, ending being directly from the George R.R. Martin that the last season would have some semblance of greatness but boy I was wrong, how they wrapped White Walker and Winter is coming arc is inexcusable.

Edited by Eltharion21

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Posted (edited)

Sansa->Ramsay, with Littlefinger passing her off in a way where it was fairly obvious he knew what he fate would be, despite the fact he was utterly smitten with her himself, was the point where I cracked.  I mean, I had seen signs prior to that, but that was the moment where the odd feeling of "huh?" turned to full fledged, "NO!"

The burninination of Shireen was really stupid the way it was handled.  Arya's "training" that was basically getting beaten over and over and over and over and boringly over and over some more, then turning into a master assassin after being stabbed and absorbing what would essentially be raw sewage directly into her gut was the point where "NO!" became, outright hate.

Season 5 was blah.  Season 6 was hot garbage.  And they've been steadily cranking up the awful ever since.

I do have to say "The Long Night" really brought the pain.  It took even the little things I was looking forward to away from me.  I can only watch the rest of the show with bewilderment rather than curiosity.  I can honestly say I've disengaged.  I just don't think there's any way to recover the story at this point that wouldn't be a complete slap in the face to everything that's come before.

I've seen a number of people saying they won't even watch the last three episodes.  You almost have to admire the D&D for taking a rabid fandom and turning away a sizable portion of them with only three episodes left of a show that has run for this long.  There is some sort of talent in that level of failure.  Not talent to be proud of, for certain, but talent.

Edited by Dragons Are Real
rabid not rapid

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I mean i had issues from season 2 onwards but it was still great until season 5. Its been downhill since then. Stannis burning shireen and 20 good men were probably the moments i completely stopped taking the show seriously.

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The Sansa/Ramsay plot in season 5 was ridiculous, but the show really lost me after the Stannis debacle at the end of season 5.

After that I lost most of my enthusiasm, season 6 completely killed it, I watched it with mostly disinterest, and never bothered with 7 or 8.

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I only watched up until season 4, (and even then I started feeling desinterested, probably due to the deviations from the books, so much so that the last thing I remember from it is Joff's wedding). Then I heard all the bad, nay horrible, things about season 5 so I didn't even watch it (till this day lol). I didn't watch seasons 6 or 7 live either, only more recently. I'm watching season 8 cause you know it's the last one and all that. 

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For me it was the season 4 finale, when Jaime doesn't tell Tyrion about Tysha, though the Ds had Tysha's story told in season 2.

It ruins both characters. Tyrion misses the best motivation to kill Tywin and help Daenerys, and Jaime is thrown from the perfect path to redemption GRRM had built for him and the show had followed to this moment.

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Posted (edited)

The treatment of the southern great houses and Cersei's incredible spike in competence was the moment I seriously started to lose investment. 

Olenna's death scene was fantastic in a vacuum but in order to get it they needed to retcon practically everyone involved. Cersei just isn't capable enough to overthrow house Tyrell nor should she have been in a position to do so. Likewise the Tyrells just aren't the weaklings season 7 bewilderingly tries to make us believe they are. They alone defeated Robert and all the way back in season 2 their backing instantly made Renly a very strong contender for the throne.

Cersei's prime trait is her relative incompetence but by wiping out two great houses in two episodes she very suddenly becomes the most competent ruler in the show. It took the extremely competent Tywin three seasons to topple two great houses, one of them being house Tully. In contrast the supposedly inept Cersei defeats two great houses in a mere two episodes and it aren't second rate houses either. The North didn't defeat Aegon like Dorne, and the Riverlands don't have the largest army and the second largest amount of wealth like the Tyrells. 

Worst of all is that Cersei's victory completely undermines the brilliant ending of season 6. The Green Trial was a typical Cersei move. It was solely concerned with getting power and not at all with how to keep it. The bombing removed all her enemies in Kings Landing but logically should have robbed her of everything outside it. Without the Tyrells King's Landing starves and their sizable forces joining Cersei's enemies would be a gigantic drain from Cersei's army. Even the Westerlands shouldn't be completely loyal anymore considering Cersei bombed Kevan and pulled a Wildfire stunt Jaime sacrificed his reputation to stop. With season 6's ending Kings Landing should be starving, surrounded by enemies  and with a lot less forces to defend it. Instead Cersei just casually steamrolls all opposition because its easier for the writers if she does. 

And the less said about the Martells the better. Poor Doran. 

Edited by Daemon of the Blacks

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Season 5, finished off with the plot butchering of the one true king of the seven kingdoms by all the laws. Stannis Kinslayer Baratheon.

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19 minutes ago, Daemon of the Blacks said:

The treatment of the southern great houses and Cersei's incredible spike in competence was the moment I seriously started to lose investment. 

Olenna's death scene was fantastic in a vacuum but in order to get it they needed to retcon practically everyone involved. Cersei just isn't capable enough to overthrow house Tyrell nor should she have been in a position to do so. Likewise the Tyrells just aren't the weaklings season 7 bewilderingly tries to make us believe they are. They alone defeated Robert and all the way back in season 2 their backing instantly made Renly a very strong contender for the throne.

Cersei's prime trait is her relative incompetence but by wiping out two great houses in two episodes she very suddenly becomes the most competent ruler in the show. It took the extremely competent Tywin three seasons to topple two great houses, one of them being house Tully. In contrast the supposedly inept Cersei defeats two great houses in a mere two episodes and it aren't second rate houses either. The North didn't defeat Aegon like Dorne, and the Riverlands don't have the largest army and the second largest amount of wealth like the Tyrells. 

Worst of all is that Cersei's victory completely undermines the brilliant ending of season 6. The Green Trial was a typical Cersei move. It was solely concerned with getting power and not at all with how to keep it. The bombing removed all her enemies in Kings Landing but logically should have robbed her of everything outside it. Without the Tyrells King's Landing starves and their sizable forces joining Cersei's enemies would be a gigantic drain from Cersei's army. Even the Westerlands shouldn't be completely loyal anymore considering Cersei bombed Kevan and pulled a Wildfire stunt Jaime sacrificed his reputation to stop. With season 6's ending Kings Landing should be starving, surrounded by enemies  and with a lot less forces to defend it. Instead Cersei just casually steamrolls all opposition because its easier for the writers if she does. 

And the less said about the Martells the better. Poor Doran. 

Good point that it took Tywin 3 seasons to bring down Houses Stark and Tully, and Cersei does the same in 2 episodes.  LOL. 

I also agree that a Cersei who is desperate, weak, and still dangerous as she tries to hold onto King's Landing, because everywhere else is lost to  her would be much more interesting than that she is somehow turned out to be more of a threat than the thousands year old Night King and his army of the dead.

What a disaster.

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Just one thing:

The Lannisters are broke.

I literally pissed myself from the truly mad fit of laughter I had then, and a short time thereafter I was emotionally completely detached from the show.

I mean, how on earth could anyone take that nonsense shit seriously even within the framework of the show? Not to mention as a proper adaptation of ASoIaF. It is basically like giving the Golden Company fake weapons and armor, turn the Stark direwolves into dogs (which was sort of done, anyway), and the Targaryen dragons in cute little lizards...

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The prologue. Complete skew and hand wave of magic, elemental forces, and bloodlines. 

Then by the end of season 3, but I hung in there a little longer thinking season 4 and 5 were just “off” seasons (which most series have), but after the non-recovery, let’s just say that I have never felt the desire for rewatches. 

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16 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

Just one thing:

The Lannisters are broke.

I literally pissed myself from the truly mad fit of laughter I had then, and a short time thereafter I was emotionally completely detached from the show.

I mean, how on earth could anyone take that nonsense shit seriously even within the framework of the show? Not to mention as a proper adaptation of ASoIaF. It is basically like giving the Golden Company fake weapons and armor, turn the Stark direwolves into dogs (which was sort of done, anyway), and the Targaryen dragons in cute little lizards...

I'd say that one is pretty decent. Gold mines do eventually run out and the Lanisters have been mining it for centuries, if not eons. 

It also allows some narrative suspense to make the Lanisters seem less all powerful. The plot point was introduced when the Lanisters reigned supreme and were practically promoted to the POV house after the Starks were defeated. With their enemies gone and Tywin seemingly being dominant there has to be some sort of weakness to them lest their victories become assured long before the fight takes place.

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Posted (edited)

Though I had many complaints in the first 4 seasons, I still loved the show for what it was. I was even willing to forgive some of the atrocities of season 5 because I foolishly hoped that they could recover some kind of narrative consistency. Season 6 finally broke me, fittingly while watching the episode "The Broken Man." Ian McShane's meribald/elder brother meld of a character was clearly going to die horribly, because he was introduced with a smile on his face. It was suddenly clear to me that the show is--and has always been--the EXACT OPPOSITE of the books on which it is allegedly based. ASOIAF is, among other things, a treatise on the futility of vengeance and the ways it corrodes the soul. GOT is a celebration of everything Martin decries.

This was also about the time arya was mortally wounded, jumped into a literal sewer, crawled out and ate some soup, and was parkouring around braavos the next morning. The show had made huge mistakes before, but that was when I knew I could never forgive it, no matter what.

Since then it's been an amazing hatewatch, and on that front it has NEVER disappointed.

Edited by Dagmer Cleftballs
Typo

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9 hours ago, The Coconut God said:

For me it was Shae's death. After working very hard to make her a very different and much more compelling character, they forced book-Shae's death on her and it made no sense whatsoever. There may have been questionable moments before, but this one felt jarring.

Her jumping for a knife and the fact that they fought without either of them trying to say anything at all only made it worse. It was like they acknowledged how out of character the moment was, how either of them uttering a single word or showing the slightest bit of emotion towards the other would have made the outcome feel even more absurd, but they wanted it to happen, so they turned their characters into puppets and made them act it out like pantomime.

I think there were big problems with Shae involving changing her characterization to make her more likeable and then reverting back. But I didn't have a problem with her death scene. Tyrion was sentenced to death thanks to the testimony of someone he loved, then he finds her in his father's bed. Not surprising that he would try to kill her. Shae grabbing a knife to defend herself is more consistent with her characterization than begging for her life would be.

2 hours ago, Mychel_Redfort said:

For me it was the season 4 finale, when Jaime doesn't tell Tyrion about Tysha, though the Ds had Tysha's story told in season 2.

It ruins both characters. Tyrion misses the best motivation to kill Tywin and help Daenerys, and Jaime is thrown from the perfect path to redemption GRRM had built for him and the show had followed to this moment.

I think Tyrion had plenty of motivation to kill Tywin already. I also liked Shae's rebuke to Tyrion for thinking that a girl who's just survived an attempted rape would jump into bed with him. Shae is trying to get at the mental state of someone who had just experienced that, highlighting how Tyrion would be too focused on his own experience to give much thought to what was going through Tysha's head. Unfortunately, the show later sided against Shae by having Sam's first night with Gilly take place right after he saves her from sexual assault.

For me season 5 was when I started disliking the show. Nothing about it lived up to the standards of previous seasons. Later seasons would be better, but that's a very low bar, and even those mainly got by on spectacle rather than decent writing.

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